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Post by bigfan on Jun 12, 2008 11:01:58 GMT -5
........because all we have had on this board is female-coach bashing and I am getting tired of reading it. There are good and bad female AND male coaches. Bad MALE coaches have been bashed on this board many times. |
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Post by bobbyhill on Jun 12, 2008 13:26:32 GMT -5
Rileystar,
There WERE NCAA violations that UTM had to self-report on, and they were menitoned in the lawsuit.
"Also in the summer of 2007, Draper was accused of violating NCAA rules for
attending an open gym. Draper explained to Dane that she was merely in the gym with
the athletes for liability reasons. Draper asked why she was being singled out for
reprimand when the Men’s Basketball program had one-on-one coaching sessions with
players in violation of NCAA rules. Dane responded that Draper should not try to drag
down another program in order to divert attention from her."
The gym situation didn't seem to keep Chris Rushing from winning two conference titles, nor did it cause him to break NCAA rules. I have been to UTM's gym as well, and it is not nearly as bad as many I have seen. There are many more gyms that are worse than UTM's.
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Post by rileystar on Jun 12, 2008 14:35:57 GMT -5
I saw that there was the self-reported violation. And I also know that schools have coaches commit similar violations, they self-report as well and do not get fired. All I am saying is I hope that there is a lot more than we all know about as to why she got fired. Chris did great things, and in his last two years, they were "down" years. Draper began in '05, so the '04 record of 10-17, 7-9 OVC and the '03 record of 7-25, 6-10 OVC were similar to Draper's last season, and Rushing wasn't fired...he got another job! Did he get it because he was a male? No, it is because he is a good coach, even with a few down years on his record.
And all I am saying about the facilities at UTM is that they are not very nice, and if Draper was fighting for equity in that athletic department and was really treated the way she "claims", maybe there is a problem.
I also just read Draper's bio. She had a successful coaching career at DII including a Division Coach of the Year award in her conference, so to imply that she was an unqualified female that just got the job because of her gender is inaccurate as well.
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Post by bluecollar on Jun 12, 2008 22:29:53 GMT -5
Check out her Division I record before coming to Martin. Bad record at a bad school. The administration did not even consider any male candidates. An administrator told a male friend who applied that they wanted a female. He was very shocked that they would say that out loud to a male candidate. He thought about suing. Gender was the main qualification UT-Martin was looking for in their Head Coach when they hired Amy.
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Post by simplycurious on Jun 12, 2008 22:39:48 GMT -5
Recapping for Wolfgang: The former female head volleyball coach is suing an institution (UT-M) for gender descrimination. An institution who could've (supposedly) been sued before they hired her, by a male coach who was discriminated against (during the hiring process) based on gender. Continue...
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Post by rileystar on Jun 13, 2008 9:51:26 GMT -5
bluecollar- I cannot find where she had been at a DI school before UTM. Best I can tell from her bio, she was a graduate assistant at West Georgia, then was a successful high school coach, then got the head position at West Georgia before going to UTM. Please clarify your suggestion....
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Post by bluecollar on Jun 13, 2008 13:10:42 GMT -5
Rileystar - I double checked and I confused Amy with another young lady. This was Amy's first D-I job. Sorry for the confusion...
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Post by sportsfan on Jun 13, 2008 18:34:59 GMT -5
Unfortunately there was Retaliation in this case and that does not look good for UTM should it go to court. Amy's case parallels that of Lindi's case at Fresno State which looks good for Amy.
I understand there seems to be a 'trend' of law suits happening. However, stop and think before you begin to judge these women who are fighting for gender equity rights. Do not allow the media to sway your opinion. Stick to the facts - she was only there for three seasons trying to WIN. She worked hard and was met with wall after wall while trying to perform the job she was hired to do. Look closer at the other coaches at UTM and you will notice a baseball coach that has been there for 20 years with only one winning season, a men's basketball coach there for 10 years with only 2 winning seasons. How can Amy be fired on performance after only three years? Also, let's not forget that the AD sought her out. She was happy at West Georgia coaching. When she got a call to interview for a D1 job she was excited and took the opportunity. I'm sure she has learned a lot from that fatal decision for taking the job - don't kick her while she's down people. Then she's replaced within minutes by a less qualified male? Are you kidding me? Those poor girls on that team no longer have a qualified coach.
Another fact : the AD told Amy to schedule tougher teams leading into her third season after posting an 18-13 record. Did he ask her to schedule tougher so she would lose and he would have reason to fire her? Meanwhile the other teams in the department can schedule with DII and DIII schools all they want.
Another FACT: (if you read the case) Amy didn't have a performance review in a year maybe two. What paper trail does UTM have to go by in order to justify firing her? None - that's your answer.
I'm a sports fan and hope to live to see the day when women in sport get the same benefits as men do in sport. Stop and ask yourself - if you had a son playing sports in college...would you be comfortable with him trading places with a female at that same school? Think about their facilities, spending budgets and coaching staff numbers. If the answer is yes then they are being treated equally. If your answer is No then you should applaud any woman fighting for equal rights.
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Post by bobbyhill on Jun 13, 2008 21:41:37 GMT -5
sportsfan, do you have intimate knowledge of this situation, or are you just going on what you read in a one-sided lawsuit, written by a lawyer? In the article, it says that UT-Martin is not allowed to comment on ongoing litigation, thus no rebuttal. You are reading a one-sided account from someone who is TRYING to make UT-Martin look as bad as possible. Was she fired with good cause? Who knows for sure, but I personally know a former player on that team and the FACT is, there was mistreatment of players, she broke NCAA rules, and couldn't win more than 10 games with 6 returning seniors and all her starters returning. I can guarantee you that if this goes to trial, the facts will come out and the view that we see in her court filing will be far from what can be proven in court. How many defendants who are found guilty have alternate views of the facts? Coming from the former player at UT-Martin, this was a justified firing. And to another point, the male coach was not hired within minutes of her firing, it was at least a week to 10 days after she was let go before he was introduced to the team. And he is the INTIRIM coach, so her replacement has not been hired yet on a permanent basis, so another point of making her look as good as possible.
To say this mirrors Lindy Vivas' lawsuit is a joke. They are not even close. Again, no ability to refute allegations by UT-Martin until it goes to court. You say don't kick her while she is down, but don't assume UT-Martin is guilty based on a one-sided court filing meant to make the plaintiff look as good as possible. There are two sides to every story.
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Post by wsufan on Jun 14, 2008 0:54:54 GMT -5
I had decided to stop posting on the website and to only visit here on rare occasion; I just got fed up with VT. The topic of the upcoming election came up when I was talking with a female coworker/friend and I emailed the link to this thread to her. I have no independent information about this case and I'm not going to make a judgment. The issue of (gender) entitlement is illustrated by many of mango's posts; to me, mango is the poster child for female entitlement. With Hilary's run for the nomination and the strong support of many female voters for her, this issue may be getting more attention. I find such "entitlement mentalities" objectionable, whether they involve gender, race, orientation, etc. If WSU's men's basketball coach was female and she was a successful (e.g. winning, making good academic progress, etc.), well respected person, I would be happy. I am happy that WSU volleyball coach is a good coach who happens to be male; he wins, his students graduate, he is well respected, etc. A focus on the gender of a coach rather than his or her performance and behavior seems completely out of place to me. www.mvc-sports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=7600&ATCLID=1479393The report that "The suit's examples of discrimination include receiving no support or praise for the team's first winning season in four years in Fall 2006" does make Amy Draper look pretty silly. The report says "The discrimination faced by Draper led her to e-mail Dane and Fabianich on November 16, 2006, stating "I sense that you are targeting me for unequal treatment here at the athletic department. I sense this could be due to the fact that I am a strong and capable woman. I believe that gender may be playing a role not only in the investigation into my meal expenditure but also in other forms of treatment I receive." Imagine how you would laugh at me if I posted "I am a strong and capable man" and then criticized you for something. Lots of coaches are jerks. A number of male coaches file silly lawsuits after they are fired. There is nothing wrong with female coaches filing silly lawsuits. (Note: Some lawsuits are not silly.) Who am I to criticize "entitlement mentalities"? I started out as a Hilary Clinton supporter and later switched to Obama; I still agree with almost all of Hilary's positions on the issues. I am of a particular gender, race, etc. and it would be difficult to change these; I do have nieces and grandchildren of different races (Asian, Africian-American). In a job, I don't care if you are male/female, gay/straight, black/white/green/etc. or anything else; I expect you to do your job and do it well. I don't know if this makes me qualified or unqualified in your mind to criticize people like mango. |
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ecuvb
Junior High
Posts: 4
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Post by ecuvb on Jun 15, 2008 0:18:17 GMT -5
This is Chris Rushing, the volleyball coach for seven years at UT Martin before Draper was there. Since this thread started, and I read the suit and all the posts, I have gotten so angry. I can't be silent any more. Believe me, I have tried very hard, but I have finally been broken down to make this post. I will be somewhat blunt about my thoughts on this matter, without going into detail about the whys.
I feel a need to speak out in defense of UT Martin (because they can't). This suit is the biggest bunch of BULL that I have ever seen in my entire life. I can write pages upon pages in response to the law suit, and some of these posts, but I am not going to do that at this point. All I really want to say right now is that a picture has been painted by Drapers attorneys that is so far from the truth.
I loved UT Martin for 7 years while my wife and I were raising three children there. I loved Phil Dane and Danelle Fabianich, and all the other people of the community and campus. Danelle and Phil have such a high passion for their job. They LOVE UTM and they LOVE the student athletes at UTM. They are always looking out for the welfare of the student athletes. When I was there, I reported to Phil, since Danelle was made SWA at the end, or shortly after my departure. But with my experiences with Phil Dane as my boss for several years, I feel that if it were possible, I would work for Phil Dane as my AD for the rest of my coaching career!
I know the story on the locker room, the gym, the office, the budget, the win loss records, the rule breaking, the team gpa, and just about everything discussed in the suit or this board. It just makes me sick that this suit is happening. If you knew what I know, you too would feel the same.
I don't know Draper (met her once). I am not on here to bag on her, but only defending UTM by stating that ther is no way on earth that the things she is saying has any validity whatsoever. Like I said before, I love UTM and I know the administration there is wonderful. They are very supportive. They were there in the stands to witness our couple years of championships, as well as our down moments or years. They were there to cheer us on when our team gpa was above a 3.5 for my last 5 years there. It was sad when I left UT Martin. I left UTM because there was NO volleyball to be played within an hour of the university (high school, middle school, or club). My daughters were 7th grade and 3rd grade when I left and I wanted to get them to a place where they could play. I am actually in Orlando getting ready to coach my older daughters 16s team and then they play in JOs in Dallas in 2 weeks. Anyway, I left UTM to go to East Carolina University so that they could have that opportunity. It worked as they love it (including my oldest-son-who just graduated from high school last week and my wife loves it too). Speaking of my family, I have read the suit and posts to my wife and kids and they are in obsolute shock over what is being claimed in the suit and what is being said on this site.
Anyway, I hope that UTM does not suffer at the hands of Draper, because they DO NOT deserve this. I hope both parties can get past this nonsense and move forward with productive lives and experiences and careers.
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Post by sbcvolley on Jun 15, 2008 10:38:05 GMT -5
Nice job, Chris. Wish we had more people identify themselves and step up to the plate when stuff like this happens. Hope you get called to testify if it goes to trial.
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Post by hailtothechief on Jun 16, 2008 10:09:08 GMT -5
Coach Rushing,
Thanks for your input. Now, go make an appointment with someone in the English department. Obviously, your grammar skills were "broken down" along with your patience.
SimplyCurious is going crazy trying to read your paragraph with all the errors.
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ecuvb
Junior High
Posts: 4
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Post by ecuvb on Jun 16, 2008 17:58:16 GMT -5
Born and raised in California. English was fine. Liven in the south for the past 12 year. Get off me back yall.
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Post by Phaedrus on Jun 16, 2008 22:05:36 GMT -5
Coach Rushing talk inglish real good.
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