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Post by trainermch on Mar 17, 2018 9:33:49 GMT -5
I have said this before. The minute a college coach quits recruiting a PSA after a verbal commitment, he/she is guilty of collusion. We have all heard stories of the PSA that de-commits late and has not been recruited for years. Isn't this an unwritten rule? It's expected that all dogs will back off once the commitment is made. However, our personal experience can speak to the fact that the determined ones find creative ways to continue sending the message that "we still want you if you change your mind." It doesn't stop...even after arrival on campus at school of original choice. Until things change and it becomes acceptable to publicly pursue a verbally committed volleyball player, creativity will have to be the way to go. Note, prior to "volleyball player" I had said "athlete," but changed it because it seems to apply only to to volleyball, and maybe just the females? I don't know anything about the males' side of recruiting process--volleyball that is.
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Post by ProfessorPlum on Mar 17, 2018 11:32:09 GMT -5
I have said this before. The minute a college coach quits recruiting a PSA after a verbal commitment, he/she is guilty of collusion. We have all heard stories of the PSA that de-commits late and has not been recruited for years. Preach on! Been saying it for years. It is undeniable collusion. I’m not saying it doesn’t still go on by the very aggressive coaches after the high profile players, but a public commitment stopping any form of recruiting at any level is collusion. Plain and simple!
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Post by nickd on Mar 17, 2018 16:34:37 GMT -5
Back in the day (a year or so ago) Volleyball verbals were as good as gold. Unlike football and basketball where kids and coaches routinely change commits many times before the NLI. Most of the problems came from kids making an early verbal and then continuing to shop for a better deal. The last year or so you see the "formally committed to school X is now committed to school Y. If this trend continues like other sports VB coaches will be forced to do like FB and BB and get more verbals than they need and drop the lowest right before the NLI. Dont blame the Coaches, its the kids that created this frog jumping approach. IMHO It would be a shame if it became that cut-throat. But, do you think that the shear number of coaching changes every year plays a part in it? Of course, the commitment is to the school and the team but do all of the new coaches honor the commitments made by players with previous coaches? I have to imagine that at least some of these commitment changes are related to the desires of the new coach to go in a different direction. So, isn't some of the blame at least on the universities? They bring in a new coach, presumably to make a change. The coaches must at least feel some pressure question the previous coaches decisions. And, by the way, the very process of recruiting is the coach doing so to maintain the program AND shop for a better deal. With my girls, once they committed, that was it. They wanted it to be final so they weren't looking for the BBD. But, if we were in the process today and based on the number of stories I have heard in recent years from other parents, I might be inclined to tell them to keep their options open. Sad, but true. As the saying goes, he who has the gold, makes the rules. I think the coaches and universities play a role in this trend , if it is a trend.
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Post by rblackley on Mar 22, 2018 12:42:02 GMT -5
I have seen new coaches not honor a prior coaches verbal commits. And often if a coach leaves a program to goto another school his prior verbals follow him. Case and point UGA when Black left LM.
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Post by maɡˈnōlēə on Mar 22, 2018 14:59:45 GMT -5
I have seen new coaches not honor a prior coaches verbal commits. And often if a coach leaves a program to goto another school his prior verbals follow him. Case and point UGA when Black left LM. Wait. Am I reading this correctly? If a girl (or guy) commits to a SCHOOL if/when a coach leaves the commitment goes with the coach? Even if the athlete bases their selection of the school on their own criteria (and probably not necessarily the coach since the overwhelming advice is to pick the school NOT the coach)? Wow. I've heard of athletes following coaches to their new program but I didn't realize their commitment to the school wasn't always to the school.
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Post by dgo on Mar 22, 2018 15:23:45 GMT -5
I have seen new coaches not honor a prior coaches verbal commits. And often if a coach leaves a program to goto another school his prior verbals follow him. Case and point UGA when Black left LM. Wait. Am I reading this correctly? If a girl (or guy) commits to a SCHOOL if/when a coach leaves the commitment goes with the coach? Even if the athlete bases their selection of the school on their own criteria (and probably not necessarily the coach since the overwhelming advice is to pick the school NOT the coach)? Wow. I've heard of athletes following coaches to their new program but I didn't realize their commitment to the school wasn't always to the school. I'll respond, assuming you weren't being sarcastic (i.e., "Say it isn't so! You're telling me that girls often pick where they want to play college ball based on the coach, and not the school?!"). From the NCAA's perspective, there literally is no such thing as a verbal commitment -- to a coach or to a school. So, it's not at all uncommon for athletes who have "verbally committed" to a school to simply follow the coach to a new school since the "verbal commitment" wasn't binding and didn't really "do" anything. Now, if there is a signed LOI, it's a different story. The LOI binds the athlete to the school (not the coach) and she needs to get a release to follow (or sit out a year).
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Post by trainermch on Mar 23, 2018 10:12:16 GMT -5
Wait. Am I reading this correctly? If a girl (or guy) commits to a SCHOOL if/when a coach leaves the commitment goes with the coach? Even if the athlete bases their selection of the school on their own criteria (and probably not necessarily the coach since the overwhelming advice is to pick the school NOT the coach)? Wow. I've heard of athletes following coaches to their new program but I didn't realize their commitment to the school wasn't always to the school. I'll respond, assuming you weren't being sarcastic (i.e., "Say it isn't so! You're telling me that girls often pick where they want to play college ball based on the coach, and not the school?!"). From the NCAA's perspective, there literally is no such thing as a verbal commitment -- to a coach or to a school. So, it's not at all uncommon for athletes who have "verbally committed" to a school to simply follow the coach to a new school since the "verbal commitment" wasn't binding and didn't really "do" anything. Now, if there is a signed LOI, it's a different story. The LOI binds the athlete to the school (not the coach) and she needs to get a release to follow (or sit out a year). Well stated. This is something every psa and parent needs to understand.
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Post by maɡˈnōlēə on Mar 23, 2018 10:32:40 GMT -5
Wait. Am I reading this correctly? If a girl (or guy) commits to a SCHOOL if/when a coach leaves the commitment goes with the coach? Even if the athlete bases their selection of the school on their own criteria (and probably not necessarily the coach since the overwhelming advice is to pick the school NOT the coach)? Wow. I've heard of athletes following coaches to their new program but I didn't realize their commitment to the school wasn't always to the school. I'll respond, assuming you weren't being sarcastic (i.e., "Say it isn't so! You're telling me that girls often pick where they want to play college ball based on the coach, and not the school?!"). From the NCAA's perspective, there literally is no such thing as a verbal commitment -- to a coach or to a school. So, it's not at all uncommon for athletes who have "verbally committed" to a school to simply follow the coach to a new school since the "verbal commitment" wasn't binding and didn't really "do" anything. Now, if there is a signed LOI, it's a different story. The LOI binds the athlete to the school (not the coach) and she needs to get a release to follow (or sit out a year). Thank you. I wasn't being sarcastic, I didn't realize there was no separate intent thing for verbals, it seems as if there is based on what people publicize on social media. To hear there is no NCAA classification for verbal commitments is kind of a revelation. I knew that the LOI was binding but I guess I never realized the verbal was kind of not even a real thing as far as the NCAA is concerned. This is great info. Thank you!
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Post by rblackley on Mar 27, 2018 10:34:17 GMT -5
A verbal is a "gentlemans" agreement between the coach and PSA. Non binding. The NLI is guaranteed by the NCAA for 1 year. unless the school guarantees the following next three years up front. Rare. I would say the Coach is a major reason many PSA's verbally commit to apply and persue the NLI. If the coach leaves may times the PSA will follow and persue a NLI with the school the coach went to. I fully understand why. For my DD, it was academics first, coach second, program third. The coach/program thing killed the possibility for many schools she looked at.
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Post by mervinswerved on Mar 27, 2018 10:40:54 GMT -5
A verbal is a "gentlemans" agreement between the coach and PSA. Non binding. The NLI is guaranteed by the NCAA for 1 year. unless the school guarantees the following next three years up front. Rare. I would say the Coach is a major reason many PSA's verbally commit to apply and persue the NLI. If the coach leaves may times the PSA will follow and persue a NLI with the school the coach went to. I fully understand why. For my DD, it was academics first, coach second, program third. The coach/program thing killed the possibility for many schools she looked at. A bit of clarification: the NLI covers the first academic year after a prospect's senior year of HS. The grant-in-aid agreement which accompanies the NLI can encompass multiple years (or all four years, if the school so chooses).
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