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Post by wilsonthevolleyball2 on Feb 6, 2018 23:36:55 GMT -5
I can easily see the sport, maybe in a perfect world, following a structure like tennis: year round, lots of tournaments, but only a handful of big- big "grand slams", or in this case the 5-star events. Yet just what is is specifically that turns sponsors off toward beach volleyball? Why was 2017 not a really good year, especially when 2016 was so successful?
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Post by Semp12 on Feb 7, 2018 16:59:18 GMT -5
Everyone wants the same thing here.. successful tours that can pay their athletes as if they were true professional athletes. Does a Union help us get there? Who knows. Someone needs to come up with the answer as to what makes volleyball more marketable?
The college growth, followed by the junior clubs expedited growth, certainly helps. However, that isn't exactly in thanks to the AVP or FIVB.. probably more thanks goes to the AVCA.
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Post by ajm on Feb 7, 2018 17:27:39 GMT -5
Everyone wants the same thing here.. successful tours that can pay their athletes as if they were true professional athletes. Does a Union help us get there? Who knows. Someone needs to come up with the answer as to what makes volleyball more marketable? The college growth, followed by the junior clubs expedited growth, certainly helps. However, that isn't exactly in thanks to the AVP or FIVB.. probably more thanks goes to the AVCA. It’s really hard to see that this union will have much of a voice when only 7 of the 32 Americans playing in the Fort Lauderdale Major are members. Haven’t checked other countries but it doesn’t really seem like a union with such low numbers of player involvement. I’d love to hear from the players about why or why not they decided to join or not join this association. The best leverage a union has is the threat of a strike, but I don’t think any tour would blink with so few players belonging.
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Post by bigfan on Feb 7, 2018 19:38:54 GMT -5
Officials from the International Volleyball Federation and the domestic American tour did not immediately respond to messages. Why should they? This is a dumb idea.
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Post by c4ndlelight on Feb 7, 2018 22:19:05 GMT -5
The Union will find it challenging to negotiate, considering each player is dealing with two-three different forms of "management"(FIVB, Federation, Domestic Tour(s)) and the FIVB is the only one they have in common - and frankly they don't have a lot of leverage. You really think all of the players are gonna hold out when the Federation has a monopoly on Olympic bids?
And are the players really in a financial position where they'll willingly start paying in union dues?
What do they really think they will accomplish here? If there were a profit motive for organizers to host more tournaments with bigger payouts, there would be more tournaments and bigger payouts.
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Post by donnyw on Feb 8, 2018 8:07:14 GMT -5
If beach volleyball is to become a professional sport around the world, a union is needed...Just like every other professional sport....If they/we want to continue watching a hobby sport than one is not needed...
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Post by houdini on Feb 8, 2018 16:36:19 GMT -5
Wonderful idea. Sponsors, organizers, athletes need to act in tandem. This is a start. The international calendar can become too wild and geographically illogical without athletes' input. It's symbiotic.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 17:13:58 GMT -5
I would assume this is FIVB only as the players have already signed the AVP 4 year contract. I mean the sport has never been profitable beyond the "big sponsor" era from what I've read so attracting sponsors would probably be more fruitful than an association of players (though that is what AVP means, literally)...An association of "what, one might ask". Players wanting sponsors which, the union, might be counter productive to? Before you solve a problem, you have to define it and I've heard the talk of "models", etc., but NOW we have another example of a model (the current "FIVB version") that is joining the ranks of the "not working" ones we have seen. Since the players are not of NFL/NBA/NLB "means", none will probably be buying the FIVB tour, which leads us to "what is their problem"? Lack of a big name sponsor or building the game, along the lines of what the AVP is attempting, which, in the current model, would increase the event size each year (and thus the ability to charge for stuff: VIP seats, etc.) and hopefully stops. At this point, after the AVP 2017 season, that is believable and "in sight". You only had to attend one stop to understand that. I think sponsorship is the easiest route, but with the turmoil in the sport, brands probably don't want to associate with a "brand in ruin/evolution". I can't imagine a company not wanting to market our game/players/lifestyle with access to players/photos/video for their marketing dept., but as they say, if it were so easy, everybody would be doing it...Well, we'll have to see where this one goes, but evidently the FIVB sponsor pool ain't what it used to be... I think the volleyball community in general needs to get real about their sponsorship prospects in general. It seems like the AVP etc. expect to find a "Sugar Daddy" type to underwrite their entire budget forever. MLB, NFL, and NHL are all communities of individual ownership and a commitment to a common business goal to generate revenue and grow market share. My personal experience as a businessman/marketing executive for a high profile company included being solicitated for many years by the beach marketing guys among many other professional sports teams and organizations. My issue was always what kind of return can you guarantee me for my investment? The beach guys always answered that their 1000's of fans will be knocking down your doors to support your business. Sure. In the big picture not very many fans compared to other sponsorship opportunities. Also, the amount of many they were requesting was always outrageous. My company worked with many of the beach sponsors at that time and when we asked about the results they were getting the answer was always , "don't do it!" Beyond that I have to say that when working with professional athletes from the NFL, MLB, NBA, and NHL almost to a person with the exception of 1 or 2 they were always kind, courteous, grateful, and enthusiastic about our support. The beach players on the other hand almost to a person including their mangement seemed entitled, somewhat arrogant, and gave us the impression that they were doing us a favor by supporting their sport financially. An attitude that I see still exists both indoors and outdoors with this sport. Try fixing that and then coming up with a real plan to enhance your major sponsors coffers, and then just maybe things will kickstart for volleyball in general.
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Post by volleyballjim on Feb 8, 2018 22:42:52 GMT -5
elevated: Interesting take on "real world marketing". The pros, to most fans, are pretty magnanimous in so many ways, I guess it must be the top tier that spoil it, so hearing that was kind of counter to our fan experiences. Other than stories I've heard on "a VERY few", not much finds the rounds of that kind of behavior, but obviously you've seen it. Hmmm...Interested in the "don't do it" relative to aligning with beach, so any more on that would be of huge interest. I've chatted with Donald Sun on many occasions and found him to be as gracious as they come, but I know others have seen the side of "Sign or we shutter the tour". But, even THAT, I think was warranted and in light of the current "union", a brilliant move at the time. When the four (or whatever years) expire, I think "all boats will rise in the expected high tide", so lets hope. STILL, I cannot imagine not being able to increase product sales with an alignment, but that is easier to type out here than probably execute on the factory floor...Anyway, thanks for the insight.
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