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Post by ironhammer on Mar 11, 2019 21:53:23 GMT -5
I can't stop people from making mistakes. Well since we aren't in the position to ground planes, it's fine to speculate and wonder. Just don't spread rumours as facts.
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Post by ironhammer on Mar 11, 2019 22:07:50 GMT -5
IF indeed it was traced to the MCAS, then I think the FAA should ground all 737-800 MAX until they could find a permanent fix for this software. Another question raised is, do you feel safe flying on a 737-800 MAX? Your next flight may well be on one. Not putting down Lion Air or Ethiopian Air pilots. Actually come to think of it, it's ok to criticize Indonesia (where Lion Air operates), because their country does have a poor safety record regarding aviation. Indonesia's break-neck speed expansion of the commerical aviation sector has often outstrip the ability of Indonesian regulators to properly manage their domestic airlines and ensure their compliance with safety regulations. Indonesian carriers were at one point banned from flying to EU countries after all. And Lion Air in particular was known to have a rather lackadaisical attitude to safety. Now Lion Air claims they have improved safety a lot in recent years. And before the final report comes out, it would be unfair to automatically blame the deceased pilots for the crash. But given their history, it's understandable that people will criticize Lion Air and Indonesia. As for Ethiopian Airlines, they did generally have a better reputation. It was regarded as one of the better runned airlines in Africa and follow Western standards in safety compliance and pilot operation...up to the horrible crash.
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Post by XAsstCoach on Mar 12, 2019 4:05:21 GMT -5
For China and other countries who have grounded the MAX, people are saying this is Beijing's retaliation for the trade war. But I think you are right. I don't think it's that simple. Having lived and worked in the country, I know the Chinese are super strict on aviation safety. There was a time in the 90's when China suffered a series of crashes, that caused massive criticism against the CAAC for being lax on safety (China's FAA-yes, believe it or not, even in an authoritarian country, they can be vulnerable to public criticism). So as a response, the Chinese became much stricter on aviation safety. They tend to adopt a "better-safe-than-sorry" attitude, so it makes sense that they have grounded the MAX as a precaution. They also face this problem....LOL! www.shine.cn/news/nation/1903121036/
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Post by mikegarrison on Mar 12, 2019 4:19:19 GMT -5
Well, you know, FOD in the engine can be dangerous.
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Post by XAsstCoach on Mar 12, 2019 5:27:39 GMT -5
Well, you know, FOD in the engine can be dangerous. First time I came across this crew was the movie Serenity, one of my favorites. Never saw the series, though I heard it was short-lived. Also first place I ever came across people tossing coins into the engine for luck. It’s cute on one hand, where the people are using old ways for good luck. On the other hand, it’s kind of like a palm-face moment at the naivity...not realizing the coins inside the engine can bring them bad luck.
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Post by mikegarrison on Mar 12, 2019 6:42:23 GMT -5
First time I came across this crew was the movie Serenity, one of my favorites. Never saw the series, though I heard it was short-lived. Don't get me started. The series was terribly flawed, but a lot of that was due to FOX meddling. They decided the 2-hr pilot episode that introduced the entire cast and gave everyone's backstory was too boring, so they never aired it until after the series cancellation was announced. Instead they opened with a train robbery show because they wanted to highlight the "Western in space" thing (this clip is from that first episode). After three or four pretty ragged but still fun episodes, they finally started trending toward really good. And that's when FOX canceled it. And oh yeah, when the series started and it had a huge audience, they were also trying to broadcast the MLB playoffs. So they would show one or two episodes a month, pretty much making sure that anybody who liked the show wouldn't be watching it when they did finally show it. They waited to cancel it just long enough so that everybody with a working brain realized the show was about to turn a corner and be really good and probably pick up more viewers, then they canceled it. The movie was pretty good but too little, too late. And it wasn't enough of a hit to spawn a movie series, either. But I think Whedon knew there would be no movie series, which is why he didn't mind killing off several of the main characters in the movie. It did explain one of the silliest things about the series though -- the "reavers".
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Post by ironhammer on Mar 12, 2019 8:56:20 GMT -5
I liked Firefly. Not the best sci-fi series there is, but certainly watchable. Back to topic, UK and Australia has also grounded the 737 MAX, along with Singapore: www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-47536502They say it's a precautionary measure. I suspect this is due to varying degree of media or public pressure to "do something" to sooth concerns over the plane (speculation of course), which may be unfounded if it turns out to be pilot error (possible in the case of Lion Air-their pilots are...not known to be of the highest quality). But if it turns out indeed to be a case of a design defect with the MAX, then Boeing is going to be facing legal liability for sure. The UK ban is significant though because of it's implications on transatlantic flights, some of which are among the busiest air routes in the world, so this will have impact, for example on Canadian carriers (which has not yet banned the MAX), because Air Canada and Westjet do fly the MAX to London on certain routes. And even if the airline do not fly to UK, it may overfly it to reach it's destination, and since UK is also banning overflight of the MAX in UK airspace, this will impact other transatlantic flights, not just the ones to the UK.
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Post by akbar on Mar 12, 2019 10:13:56 GMT -5
Just get to the bottom of this. Its tragic .
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Post by tomclen on Mar 12, 2019 17:49:55 GMT -5
The top job at the FAA has been vacant for 14 months. FOURTEEN MOTHER-F---ING MONTHS!
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Post by ironhammer on Mar 12, 2019 19:49:16 GMT -5
The top job at the FAA has been vacant for 14 months. FOURTEEN MOTHER-F---ING MONTHS! I don't think the Trump administration ever has any intention of filling that post, which is one among many still vacant. He seem to imply FAA and NTSB is irrelevant in his tweet, question regulations itself. God help us if he somehow goes ahead to abolish the FAA and NTSB. Whatever issue the FAA and NTSB has, it does generally a good job in keeping air travel safe and reliable, more safe than you driving your car to buy groceries. Get rid of that, and consumer confidence will nose-dive in aviation. On the MAX, now with the EU and more countries banning the MAX, only the US and Canada still seem to operate the MAX. Boeing stocks is down another 6% after the 5%+ drop on Monday. edition.cnn.com/world/live-news/boeing-737-max-8-ethiopia-airlines-crash/index.htmlAir Canada is also cancelling flights to London with the MAX: www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-03-12/air-canada-cancels-two-london-flights-as-boeing-737-ban-spreadsSome are saying it's pilot training issue, that in both of those crashes, it's third world countries with less-trained pilots and fewer flight hours (US mandate minimum of 1,500 hours for a pilot to hold the Air Transport Pilot license, the top license in civil aviation, and a basic requirement to fly commerical aircraft like the 737, although there are certain allowances for pilots with less hours under certain situations. But the First Officer in the Ethiopian crash only had 200 hours, although the Captain of the flight had 8000 hours, more than sufficient). The problem though is that EU and Australia is also banning the MAX, developed Western countries which presumably have well-trained pilots of comparable level of training with the US.
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Post by XAsstCoach on Mar 12, 2019 20:34:01 GMT -5
They never figured out what happened with the Lion Air flight, did they? I mean they just recovered one of the data recorders last month and are now trying to extract data from it...nothing yet, right?
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Post by ironhammer on Mar 12, 2019 20:38:28 GMT -5
They never figured out what happened with the Lion Air flight, did they? I mean they just recovered one of the data recorders last month and are now trying to extract data from it... nothing yet, right? They have not reached a conclusion but they have release findings that the pilot struggled with the controls as the nose of the plane repeatedly pitched down. And they also release maintenance records showing problems with the AOA sensor. That is why everyone is discussing MCAS. They have both the voice recorder and flight data recorder, the two essential black boxes, so they are very likely to figure out the cause eventually and release it in a report. A competent pilot can disable the automatic trim controls, but Indonesian pilots...again, their quality is in question. And Asia is a big place. A really big place. People now are painting the whole continent with a broad brush saying Asian pilots are problematic. But that cannot be more wrong. Airlines like Japan's ANA, Hong Kong's Cathay Pacific and Singapore Airlines are considered one of the best in the world, both in terms of service and safety record. They would be pretty offended to be tarred with a broad brush. It's far more accurate to say certain Asian countries have a problem.
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Post by mikegarrison on Mar 13, 2019 0:25:48 GMT -5
God help us if he somehow goes ahead to abolish the FAA and NTSB. He can't. They are established by law.
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Post by mikegarrison on Mar 13, 2019 0:33:47 GMT -5
They never figured out what happened with the Lion Air flight, did they? They found a proximate cause. A new system called MCAS was supposed to assist the pilots in an emergency situation. If they applied too much thrust, the torque from the engines not being directly in line with the center of mass could have caused the airplane to pitch up and stall. MCAS was supposed to stop that. But due to a failed sensor, MCAS thought the airplane was dangerously pitching up, so it kept pushing the nose down. The pilots kept pulling it back up again, but they never turned off the autotrim. Eventually the plane crashed. An advisory was issued to all operators highlighting MCAS, how it works, and how to disable it in an emergency. The final report has not yet come out answering all the questions about ultimate cause.
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Post by bucky415 on Mar 13, 2019 1:26:35 GMT -5
It wasn't the most fun getting on a plane yesterday and seeing that it was this particular model.
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