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Post by volleyguy on Aug 1, 2019 22:36:42 GMT -5
I think you’ve completely misunderstood my post. The investor isn’t being played for a fool. P1140 is trying to use her undisclosed investment to attract other investors. Your statement that it’s a pretty good vote of confidence proves my point. You have no idea what the amount of investment is. If she contributed $10,000 - a drop in the bucket for her - how could that possibly be considered a “pretty good vote of confidence” in P1440? why would a well known and well regarded venture capitalist bother with a "drop in the bucket" investment? They don't bother with small change. That makes no sense. I've seen successful VCs drop $10,000 for meal with rare wines on the regular. Why would that well regarded venture capitalist approve a press release whose primary purpose is to attract other investors? You guys act like this VC is an idiot. Because she knows the last investor took it in the shorts, and she's requiring a demonstration of more broad-based support before she commits. She's clearly not the one we think is an idiot. |
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Post by c4ndlelight on Aug 1, 2019 23:20:20 GMT -5
At this point, an individual investment means it's a pet project of a rich person, who happens to have worked in Venture Capital. Maybe she wants to support volleyball, maybe she just wants to hang out with a gold medalist (or use access to a very famous person as a networking tool), or maybe she believes in the business model and has a hunch it'll turn a profit.
But she's not risking her investors' capital through her fund, if the press release is accurate.
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Post by PaulBVB on Aug 2, 2019 0:15:39 GMT -5
why would a well known and well regarded venture capitalist bother with a "drop in the bucket" investment? They don't bother with small change. That makes no sense. I've seen successful VCs drop $10,000 for meal with rare wines on the regular. Why would that well regarded venture capitalist approve a press release whose primary purpose is to attract other investors? You guys act like this VC is an idiot. Because she knows the last investor took it in the shorts, and she's requiring a demonstration of more broad-based support before she commits. She's clearly not the one we think is an idiot. Talk about taking it in the shorts, the AVP hasn't turn a profit or come close to breaking even since Donald bought it. That's why the AVP is up for sale... Yep, AVP is looking for a buyer. Unfortunately for AVP it fell out of negotiations in 2017 and couldn't get another buyer to bite in 2018. I've heard the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year so times that by the years he's owned it (7 or 8) and you have a loss of 40 plus million. With the current AVP growth rate and lack of sponsors he will never make that money back. It's a shame, hopefully he can find a buyer after the olympics when the hype is at it's highest. PS- I've also heard that Amazon will not renew after the contract expires, not a pretty site out there for anyone looking to run a pro tour. |
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Post by dunninla3 on Aug 2, 2019 1:08:36 GMT -5
^ that is a sobering post for anyone wanting to make a living playing pro beach. Not more than a handful can make a go of it by only playing FIVB.
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Post by guest2 on Aug 2, 2019 7:47:04 GMT -5
Because she knows the last investor took it in the shorts, and she's requiring a demonstration of more broad-based support before she commits. She's clearly not the one we think is an idiot. Talk about taking it in the shorts, the AVP hasn't turn a profit or come close to breaking even since Donald bought it. That's why the AVP is up for sale... Yep, AVP is looking for a buyer. Unfortunately for AVP it fell out of negotiations in 2017 and couldn't get another buyer to bite in 2018. I've heard the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year so times that by the years he's owned it (7 or 8) and you have a loss of 40 plus million. With the current AVP growth rate and lack of sponsors he will never make that money back. It's a shame, hopefully he can find a buyer after the olympics when the hype is at it's highest. PS- I've also heard that Amazon will not renew after the contract expires, not a pretty site out there for anyone looking to run a pro tour. Amazon always seemed like a short term play to bring a niche audience to Prime for the derivative value. A trans sort of play. If AVP didn't plan for non renewal they were negligent |
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Post by JB Southpaw on Aug 2, 2019 8:21:52 GMT -5
Talk about taking it in the shorts, the AVP hasn't turn a profit or come close to breaking even since Donald bought it. That's why the AVP is up for sale... Yep, AVP is looking for a buyer. Unfortunately for AVP it fell out of negotiations in 2017 and couldn't get another buyer to bite in 2018. I've heard the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year so times that by the years he's owned it (7 or 8) and you have a loss of 40 plus million. With the current AVP growth rate and lack of sponsors he will never make that money back. It's a shame, hopefully he can find a buyer after the olympics when the hype is at it's highest. PS- I've also heard that Amazon will not renew after the contract expires, not a pretty site out there for anyone looking to run a pro tour. Amazon always seemed like a short term play to bring a niche audience to Prime for the derivative value. A trans sort of play. If AVP didn't plan for non renewal they were negligent I wonder, did anyone on here going Amazon Prime just for AVP? I've had it for years, so there was no gain from me, probably like a large %. Now, they take this streaming product to a new platform, I'll be paying for it as will everyone else. |
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Post by guest2 on Aug 2, 2019 9:40:00 GMT -5
Amazon always seemed like a short term play to bring a niche audience to Prime for the derivative value. A trans sort of play. If AVP didn't plan for non renewal they were negligent I wonder, did anyone on here going Amazon Prime just for AVP? I've had it for years, so there was no gain from me, probably like a large %. Now, they take this streaming product to a new platform, I'll be paying for it as will everyone else. Almost everyone I know who has prime tried it for one thing, maybe a Christmas season or the AVP and kept it because its a good value. Its been part of Amazon's strategy for a long time to use loss leaders like the AVP to pull certain groups of people in. Otherwise why put on the AVP but spend so little time and energy promoting it? This year I tried to continue my Prime subscription solely for the AVP so thats one - although I am somewhat unique in that my geography prevents me from really using it much and if I were still in the US or closer I would keep it AVP or no |
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Post by wilsonthevolleyball2 on Aug 2, 2019 9:45:56 GMT -5
Because she knows the last investor took it in the shorts, and she's requiring a demonstration of more broad-based support before she commits. She's clearly not the one we think is an idiot. Talk about taking it in the shorts, the AVP hasn't turn a profit or come close to breaking even since Donald bought it. That's why the AVP is up for sale... Yep, AVP is looking for a buyer. Unfortunately for AVP it fell out of negotiations in 2017 and couldn't get another buyer to bite in 2018. I've heard the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year so times that by the years he's owned it (7 or 8) and you have a loss of 40 plus million. With the current AVP growth rate and lack of sponsors he will never make that money back. It's a shame, hopefully he can find a buyer after the olympics when the hype is at it's highest. PS- I've also heard that Amazon will not renew after the contract expires, not a pretty site out there for anyone looking to run a pro tour. Paul do you have a source that the AVP is looking for a buyer? |
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Post by johnbar on Aug 2, 2019 10:28:33 GMT -5
Just want to point out this is not a "press release". It is a signed article published by Bloomberg. I am certain it is based on a press release. It would be nice to think the Bloomberg staffer(s) did a little checking and digging, and didn't just rewrite the PR. But in any case, it is Bloomberg that is responsible for the content, not P1440 or Gouw.
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Post by downtheline on Aug 2, 2019 11:42:19 GMT -5
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Post by PaulBVB on Aug 3, 2019 1:28:45 GMT -5
“The AVP is for sale ?”- Yup Is volleytalk also for sale ? DS needs to jump on this truth wagon of VB..!- Huh?www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/nickdiunte/2019/06/18/how-donald-sun-is-playing-the-long-game-to-grow-the-avps-beach-volleyball-reach-across-america/amp/- Nice article, DS is building it the right way. Still doesn't change the fact that DS/AVP is looking for a buyer, he would get out tomorrow if he could. BTW there's nothing wrong with that, how much financial punishment can one person/investors/Kingston Tech take.
It is true that Kingston Technology has upped its stake and involvement in running the AVP. I don’t see that as a sale to outsiders. Any asset is potentially for sale but where are the facts PBvB?- Why did Kingston Tech up their involvement? Not cause the AVP is turning a profit or breaking even. Usually companies build there assets (AVP America, AVP Next) before selling, having Kingstons Tech absorb some cost is standard to show less loses or as Dain calls it, fake fire. You seem to be in the loop or have an inside track on the AVP, just ask an AVP player if they've heard any thing.
With billions of annual income the owners and investors of the AVP are gaining a tax right off, that is not a game of losing money, it is how professional sports owners world wide play the game.- I doubt Steve Ballmer owns the Clippers for tax purposes... I also bought into the tax right off thing in 2015 when everyone was saying it. That comment is outdated. Anyhow, not having the AVP is NOT a good thing, I enjoy it. HB and Hermosa were fun, Austin was eh. I didn't attend the others. |
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Post by beavis on Aug 3, 2019 1:59:50 GMT -5
Because she knows the last investor took it in the shorts, and she's requiring a demonstration of more broad-based support before she commits. She's clearly not the one we think is an idiot. Talk about taking it in the shorts, the AVP hasn't turn a profit or come close to breaking even since Donald bought it. That's why the AVP is up for sale... Yep, AVP is looking for a buyer. Unfortunately for AVP it fell out of negotiations in 2017 and couldn't get another buyer to bite in 2018. I've heard the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year so times that by the years he's owned it (7 or 8) and you have a loss of 40 plus million. With the current AVP growth rate and lack of sponsors he will never make that money back. It's a shame, hopefully he can find a buyer after the olympics when the hype is at it's highest. PS- I've also heard that Amazon will not renew after the contract expires, not a pretty site out there for anyone looking to run a pro tour. PaulBVB - have to call you out. Unless you are an insider, you have no idea about the financial picture of the AVP since it is not a publicly held company. Your disdain for Donald Sun is evident from your other posts on here, but you also simply could not know that the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year for a total loss of 40 million. Again, unless you are an AVP executive or Donald Sun's bestie, there is no way you could know any of that. Also, what facts do you have that show that some alleged AVP sale in 2017 fell through, that they were trying unsuccessfully to find another buyer throughout 2018, and that the AVP is now for sale. How on earth could you know any of this? Please be specific, because if you have no facts to back up your comments, it looks pretty foolish. Finally, please tell us how you know what the current growth rate of the AVP revenue is. Again, you could have no idea about that - maybe you just meant that they are not growing in the number of AVP tournaments (7-8) each year, but obviously that has nothing to do with revenue. No one could have any idea about the financials of a closely held AVP (again, unless one of us is on the inside somehow), and most folks who were at Hermosa have already commented on a seeming increase in the number of sponsor booths, etc. Not that it means tons of additional revenue, but your "lack of sponsors" comment seems to be another thing that you simply made up. |
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Post by guest2 on Aug 3, 2019 4:27:34 GMT -5
Talk about taking it in the shorts, the AVP hasn't turn a profit or come close to breaking even since Donald bought it. That's why the AVP is up for sale... Yep, AVP is looking for a buyer. Unfortunately for AVP it fell out of negotiations in 2017 and couldn't get another buyer to bite in 2018. I've heard the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year so times that by the years he's owned it (7 or 8) and you have a loss of 40 plus million. With the current AVP growth rate and lack of sponsors he will never make that money back. It's a shame, hopefully he can find a buyer after the olympics when the hype is at it's highest. PS- I've also heard that Amazon will not renew after the contract expires, not a pretty site out there for anyone looking to run a pro tour. PaulBVB - have to call you out. Unless you are an insider, you have no idea about the financial picture of the AVP since it is not a publicly held company. Your disdain for Donald Sun is evident from your other posts on here, but you also simply could not know that the AVP loses 6 to 7 million a year for a total loss of 40 million. Again, unless you are an AVP executive or Donald Sun's bestie, there is no way you could know any of that. Also, what facts do you have that show that some alleged AVP sale in 2017 fell through, that they were trying unsuccessfully to find another buyer throughout 2018, and that the AVP is now for sale. How on earth could you know any of this? Please be specific, because if you have no facts to back up your comments, it looks pretty foolish. Finally, please tell us how you know what the current growth rate of the AVP revenue is. Again, you could have no idea about that - maybe you just meant that they are not growing in the number of AVP tournaments (7-8) each year, but obviously that has nothing to do with revenue. No one could have any idea about the financials of a closely held AVP (again, unless one of us is on the inside somehow), and most folks who were at Hermosa have already commented on a seeming increase in the number of sponsor booths, etc. Not that it means tons of additional revenue, but your "lack of sponsors" comment seems to be another thing that you simply made up. "You say something I don't like so how could you know?" and "you simply made [it] up" Hmm, if Donald tried to sell the AVP how could any financial information have gotten farther than AVP execs? Its not like that information would become known by the people involved with DD in a sale of this size right? Those figures aren't one of the first thing potential purchasers would ask for are they? |
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Post by beavis on Aug 5, 2019 2:31:39 GMT -5
Nice try! When the king of making up facts gets involved in an argument as your chief supporter, you know you're in trouble. I'm sure Paul BVB is a nice guy, but for him to state all those things as fact would mean that he clearly either (a) has inside knowledge himself, or (b) knows someone who does. He has made a bunch of claims about the AVP's financial state, that the entity has been for sale since 2017, and that a prospective buyer bailed, and we are not to ask for verification? I guess in Guest2's world of made-up facts, those claims are to be taken as gospel and not questioned, but most of us would rather know the truth.
Finally, of course a prospective buyer would want to know the complete financials of any business he or she may be thinking of purchasing. However that does not mean that all those financials just become open for the entire world to see. Instead, that information would be subject to a strict non-disclosure agreement and again, would not become public. If PaulBVB knows the business broker who is in charge of marketing the AVP for sale, or is on the inside and has seen financial statements disclosing that the AVP has lost over 40 million dollars so far, let's know about it. But if these are just wild claims based on no information whatsoever, then admit that and quit starting rumors.
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Post by bigjohn043 on Aug 9, 2019 10:33:49 GMT -5
I hope they come up with a great plan and better execution! IF I were starting a tour, I'd go east. 1. The East is starving for Pro tournaments: 3 in FL (Daytona/Jax, Ft. L/Miami, Clearwater/St.Pete) 1 in N.O./ Miss. or FL Panhandle 1 in S.C 1 in VA 1 in NYC/NJ 1 in BOS/MA 1 in Ohio 1 in Chi 1 in Austin 2. Grow to other places like Tenn, Indy, Upstate NYC 3. you can run tournaments earlier in the year, before FIVB kicks off 4. Pay Phil & Nick, Piotr, Palm & Hyden to headline the men's side for the 1st 2 years 5. Use FSU, LSU, Stetson, USCe and the other Eastern colleges for the Women's talent pool (give WCs to some of the young talent) 6. Master the 3 court concept, start w 16 team draws with regional Qs before the tournament and do night matches on Friday just my thoughts First, I am deeply skeptical that a domestic tour is ever going to do anything in the US. The fundamental issue is that it is essentially a minor league versus the FIVB. Minor leagues don't do well in the US. Minor leagues of minor sports really don't do well. Second, you have to understand the economics of beach volleyball. All of the locations you mention are very expensive. You either have to build sand courts which costs a ton, or you have to essentially rent a beach during the busy season. CA beaches always have a bunch of room. East coast beaches do not. They all cost a bunch of money to put on an event. The only AVP events that ever really made money are the SoCal ones that don't cost very much and have a big fan base. My guess is that the AVP is going to remain a fringe tour with half of its <10 events in SoCal. It wouldn't shock me to see Manhattan or Hermosa partner with the FIVB. It actually costs locations a bunch of money to host an FIVB but if they want to be true beach volleyball spots that is the way this is going and would probably be good for the sport. |
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