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Post by butteryhands on Aug 21, 2019 22:59:17 GMT -5
If Bradford Beach wasn't so damn rocky this year, I'd say they should move the whole thing up to Milwaukee (of course not, it'd be a logistical nightmare) Thank The County for letting Harley dig up the beach last Summer making a track for a weekend of races. They ruined all the courts. It went from naturally deep sand to ridiculously shallow, pitted and rocky. I've played there only once this Summer. That place started quickly going downhill when Gawronski was forced out to save money but this ruined it completely in a matter of days. That place had 50 perfect courts and now is a joke.
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Post by guest2 on Aug 22, 2019 1:41:02 GMT -5
If Bradford Beach wasn't so damn rocky this year, I'd say they should move the whole thing up to Milwaukee (of course not, it'd be a logistical nightmare) Thank The County for letting Harley dig up the beach last Summer making a track for a weekend of races. They ruined all the courts. It went from naturally deep sand to ridiculously shallow, pitted and rocky. I've played there only once this Summer. That place started quickly going downhill when Gawronski was forced out to save money but this ruined it completely in a matter of days. That place had 50 perfect courts and now is a joke. Its a shame our sport is so tenuous that petty local government can almost ruin whole regions of play. Similar experiences at a lot of East Coast beaches. Licenses, fees, etc. moreso the issue for tournament organizers The AVP should just make this a shootout. Top 8 teams men and women, round robin. Different and in many ways better (drawbacks too) fan experience Less space needed, then in the future solve this problem well in advance as many have suggested
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Post by moderndaycoach on Aug 22, 2019 8:43:20 GMT -5
If Bradford Beach wasn't so damn rocky this year, I'd say they should move the whole thing up to Milwaukee (of course not, it'd be a logistical nightmare) Thank The County for letting Harley dig up the beach last Summer making a track for a weekend of races. They ruined all the courts. It went from naturally deep sand to ridiculously shallow, pitted and rocky. I've played there only once this Summer. That place started quickly going downhill when Gawronski was forced out to save money but this ruined it completely in a matter of days. That place had 50 perfect courts and now is a joke. If I remember correctly there was some big in-fighting with the county, the guy who ran bradford beach, and something about permits or what events were allowed to happen there. I am not positive on any of this just remember hearing guys talk about the situation a few years back at Waupaca. Anyone that is a Bradford regular could probably shed some more light on it but I believe it had something to do with people who ran the events no longer doing it mixed in with a little politics.
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Post by Winbabywin on Aug 22, 2019 10:47:02 GMT -5
Politics and fees...the main reason Gulf Shores will be hosting the NCAA Champs for the foreseeable future. They see the benefit of bringing in thousands of fans and filling hotels and restaurants, and having a great overall event and experience; instead of the local government trying to get rich off of the event by charging ridiculous permit fees, etc. Obviously, the erosion can't be helped, but according to several other posters, there are other, more spacious places to have it in Chicago...like North Beach. Chicago has always been a great AVP event, that I have taken part in, both as a fan and a player. Unless it becomes easier to get back there, Sun might have to consider another spot in the midwest. I know it helps to have it on a body of water, like one of the Great Lakes, but wasn't Cinci always a popular event, in the tennis stadium?
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Post by bombsaway on Aug 22, 2019 11:03:48 GMT -5
Would Indianapolis, Memphis, Nashville or Saint Louis be other options? I'm thinking river front with a metropolis backdrop and a decent amount of people... no clue on the politics or logistics of any of these places
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Post by moderndaycoach on Aug 22, 2019 11:29:37 GMT -5
Politics and fees...the main reason Gulf Shores will be hosting the NCAA Champs for the foreseeable future. They see the benefit of bringing in thousands of fans and filling hotels and restaurants, and having a great overall event and experience; instead of the local government trying to get rich off of the event by charging ridiculous permit fees, etc. Obviously, the erosion can't be helped, but according to several other posters, there are other, more spacious places to have it in Chicago...like North Beach. Chicago has always been a great AVP event, that I have taken part in, both as a fan and a player. Unless it becomes easier to get back there, Sun might have to consider another spot in the midwest. I know it helps to have it on a body of water, like one of the Great Lakes, but wasn't Cinci always a popular event, in the tennis stadium? North Ave would be an absolute logistical nightmare, Chicago Sport and Social already has their Labor Day tourney there that day (yes it could probably move to Oak Street), plus Players Sport and Social have a tourney there as well on labor day weekend. Not to mention both social organizations run their leagues on Thursdays and Fridays also. I have only seen the cons outweigh the pro's on this board for Cinci, and to take the event out of Chicago would just assure that they will lose even more money and not have nearly the amount of people turn up as they would in any of those other cities in the Midwest.
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Post by ramo2653 on Aug 22, 2019 12:07:10 GMT -5
Thank The County for letting Harley dig up the beach last Summer making a track for a weekend of races. They ruined all the courts. It went from naturally deep sand to ridiculously shallow, pitted and rocky. I've played there only once this Summer. That place started quickly going downhill when Gawronski was forced out to save money but this ruined it completely in a matter of days. That place had 50 perfect courts and now is a joke. If I remember correctly there was some big in-fighting with the county, the guy who ran bradford beach, and something about permits or what events were allowed to happen there. I am not positive on any of this just remember hearing guys talk about the situation a few years back at Waupaca. Anyone that is a Bradford regular could probably shed some more light on it but I believe it had something to do with people who ran the events no longer doing it mixed in with a little politics. The version I heard from a friend of mine that used to work down there( like all good rumors) was that he kept adding events to the beach without clearing it with the county. Like he added sand soccer leagues at the north end of the beach and the county flipped out when they just saw it one day. Then SURG restaurant group took over and just kept adding courts but didn't have a way to level them so the courts got a little rocky. I didn't make the connection between the sand races and the crappy sand this year but it makes sense. The guy that took over running the leagues this year has been running the leagues at Grant Beach ron the south side for a while now so I think the future will be OK. But I wouldn't expect to see an AVP here anytime soon. As an aside I'm playing in a tournament at Bradford on Sunday, we'll see how long I can go without diving ☺️
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Post by itsallrelative on Aug 22, 2019 14:34:09 GMT -5
Politics and fees...the main reason Gulf Shores will be hosting the NCAA Champs for the foreseeable future. They see the benefit of bringing in thousands of fans and filling hotels and restaurants, and having a great overall event and experience; instead of the local government trying to get rich off of the event by charging ridiculous permit fees, etc. Obviously, the erosion can't be helped, but according to several other posters, there are other, more spacious places to have it in Chicago...like North Beach. Chicago has always been a great AVP event, that I have taken part in, both as a fan and a player. Unless it becomes easier to get back there, Sun might have to consider another spot in the midwest. I know it helps to have it on a body of water, like one of the Great Lakes, but wasn't Cinci always a popular event, in the tennis stadium? North Ave would be an absolute logistical nightmare, Chicago Sport and Social already has their Labor Day tourney there that day (yes it could probably move to Oak Street), plus Players Sport and Social have a tourney there as well on labor day weekend. Not to mention both social organizations run their leagues on Thursdays and Fridays also. I have only seen the cons outweigh the pro's on this board for Cinci, and to take the event out of Chicago would just assure that they will lose even more money and not have nearly the amount of people turn up as they would in any of those other cities in the Midwest. Saint Louis would have to be parking lot event...no natural beaches around. I think the logistics of parking lot events mean that they aren't doable anymore....
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Post by houdini on Aug 26, 2019 2:50:06 GMT -5
Milwaukee would be great in the future. Fan base would be stronger in a smaller metro area. A bit rocky? Nothing that a a few truckloads of sand wouldn't cure. The old Miller lite /Jose Cuervo were big hits and the sport has only gone uphill in Wisconsin.
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Post by Winbabywin on Aug 26, 2019 10:17:09 GMT -5
I know it's kooky-talk, and a ridiculous premise that Sun will not entertain. But what about the ridiculously crazy thought that having an AVP tourney in FLORIDA, would be a good idea? I know, I know, I feel stupid even saying it; it really is ludicrous...I mean, why entertain the thought of going to the state that is 2nd in beach vball popularity? And it doesn't even have to be in Miami/Ft. Laudy or Tampa (the 2 biggest vball spots in FL); it could be in Orlando, I'm sure Disney has some sort of beach vball capabilities, Jacksonville, Daytona (to a lesser extent), or even somewhere in the Panhandle (Panama City or Pensacola - which would have to be later than April due to the weather). HELL, if we're talking north FL, we might as well include Gulf Shores! But I digress from the original thread...it really sucks that Chicago is having these erosion problems, and hopefully it can get worked out or a new awesome city/venue can pop up in 2020
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Post by butteryhands on Aug 26, 2019 11:06:53 GMT -5
I know it's kooky-talk, and a ridiculous premise that Sun will not entertain. But what about the ridiculously crazy thought that having an AVP tourney in FLORIDA, would be a good idea? I know, I know, I feel stupid even saying it; it really is ludicrous...I mean, why entertain the thought of going to the state that is 2nd in beach vball popularity? And it doesn't even have to be in Miami/Ft. Laudy or Tampa (the 2 biggest vball spots in FL); it could be in Orlando, I'm sure Disney has some sort of beach vball capabilities, Jacksonville, Daytona (to a lesser extent), or even somewhere in the Panhandle (Panama City or Pensacola - which would have to be later than April due to the weather). HELL, if we're talking north FL, we might as well include Gulf Shores! But I digress from the original thread...it really sucks that Chicago is having these erosion problems, and hopefully it can get worked out or a new awesome city/venue can pop up in 2020 Perhaps, just perhaps actually Donald has wanted to go to Florida but the cost has been too prohibitive. Especially considering that he is losing money by the millions by continuing the tour.
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Post by Winbabywin on Aug 26, 2019 12:46:50 GMT -5
I know it's kooky-talk, and a ridiculous premise that Sun will not entertain. But what about the ridiculously crazy thought that having an AVP tourney in FLORIDA, would be a good idea? I know, I know, I feel stupid even saying it; it really is ludicrous...I mean, why entertain the thought of going to the state that is 2nd in beach vball popularity? And it doesn't even have to be in Miami/Ft. Laudy or Tampa (the 2 biggest vball spots in FL); it could be in Orlando, I'm sure Disney has some sort of beach vball capabilities, Jacksonville, Daytona (to a lesser extent), or even somewhere in the Panhandle (Panama City or Pensacola - which would have to be later than April due to the weather). HELL, if we're talking north FL, we might as well include Gulf Shores! But I digress from the original thread...it really sucks that Chicago is having these erosion problems, and hopefully it can get worked out or a new awesome city/venue can pop up in 2020 Perhaps, just perhaps actually Donald has wanted to go to Florida but the cost has been too prohibitive. Especially considering that he is losing money by the millions by continuing the tour. I refuse to believe, absolutely refuse to believe, that having 1 tourney in FL is going to cost as much or more than 1 tourney in Cali...there is simply no way FL is more expensive than Cali. I obviously realize the travel from the home base, but permits and such are cheaper in FL than Cali.
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Post by volleyballjim on Aug 26, 2019 15:07:31 GMT -5
Perhaps, just perhaps actually Donald has wanted to go to Florida but the cost has been too prohibitive. Especially considering that he is losing money by the millions by continuing the tour. I refuse to believe, absolutely refuse to believe, that having 1 tourney in FL is going to cost as much or more than 1 tourney in Cali...there is simply no way FL is more expensive than Cali. I obviously realize the travel from the home base, but permits and such are cheaper in FL than Cali. Not sure where the hub for the infrastructure is for AVP events, but Florida is a LONG way from Cali (READ: Transportation costs). But not sure what % that is for the overall event cost.
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Post by JB Southpaw on Aug 26, 2019 15:15:37 GMT -5
I refuse to believe, absolutely refuse to believe, that having 1 tourney in FL is going to cost as much or more than 1 tourney in Cali...there is simply no way FL is more expensive than Cali. I obviously realize the travel from the home base, but permits and such are cheaper in FL than Cali. Not sure where the hub for the infrastructure is for AVP events, but Florida is a LONG way from Cali (READ: Transportation costs). But not sure what % that is for the overall event cost. If they put it after Austin, but before NYC it's not adding too much additional costs.
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Post by collin on Aug 28, 2019 9:14:53 GMT -5
I went by Oak Street and North Ave. Beaches this morning and things are looking mostly set up. Only Stadium Court and Court 1 are on Oak St. Beach, courts 2+ are at North Ave. Kind of a bummer since I think last year up to court 3 were all on Oak. You'll have a 15 minute walk up to N Ave. if you want to watch other matches than St. or Court 1. And I wouldn't be surprised if Court 2 isn't available to stream on Amazon either since it's away from the main site.
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