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Post by dorothymantooth on Oct 22, 2007 16:52:47 GMT -5
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Post by slider on Oct 22, 2007 19:19:22 GMT -5
Carrie DeMange is an outstanding player. She is one of the few middles in the country who plays all rotations and does it well. She has had a great career at Duke, a fabulous education and is well deserving of this award. The match against a good Virginia team was hard fought, and she was critical, especially in game 5, where Duke won 17-15. She had 8 kills in that game alone, a total of 29 kills in the match and 28 digs. Along with her strong play Friday night against Virginia Tech she is well deserving of this honor. Without her, Duke is nowhere near the strong team they have become.
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Post by bownlovingfreak on Oct 22, 2007 19:46:52 GMT -5
Duke gets criticized quite a bit, but DeMange is a total animal deserving of this award.
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Post by OU-OhYeah! on Oct 22, 2007 21:16:54 GMT -5
Carrie DeMange is an outstanding player. Agreed. Her stats are worthy of the honor and, before I continue, I am NOT advocating that the honor belongs to anyone else. However, I want to point out that Melissa Griffin (Ohio MB) arguably played better this past weekend against tougher competition than when she won AVCA POW four weeks ago. I'm not upset that she didn't get national POW again -- it is hard enough to get once -- but that she was slighted in conference. Consider, How it actually is: East Ashley Feutz, Kent State, Jr. OH, Muskengon, Mich/FruitportIn two matches (9 games) last week, Feutz registered 44 kills (4.89/game), hit at .352 with seven blocks (0.78/game), two service aces (0.22/game), and scored 50.5 points (4.21/game). In KSU’s 3-2 win over Northern Illinois (10/19), Feutz recorded a team-high 28 kills while hitting .421 with two aces and two blocks. She added 16 kills with five blocks in the Golden Flashes’ 3-1 win over Western Michigan on Saturday (10/20). How it should be (I simply replaced the relevant information): East Melissa Griffin, Ohio University, Sr. MB, Whitehall, Mich/Whitehall
In two matches (7 games) last week, Griffin registered 45 kills (6.43/game), hit at .557 with four blocks (0.57/game), one service ace (0.14/game), and scored 48.5 points (6.93/game). In Ohio’s 3-0 win over Western Michigan (10/19), Griffin recorded a team-high 19 kills while hitting .417 with one ace and two blocks. She added 26 kills with two blocks in the Bobcats’ 3-1 win over Northern Illinois on Saturday (10/20). Imagine the stats she would've racked up if Ohio played 9 games instead of 7. But, as they say, if ifs and buts were candies and nuts, we'd all have a big Christmas. Spread the love; spread the awards! At least the conference got the volleyball standings updated on Monday this week.
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Post by bomber on Oct 22, 2007 22:47:12 GMT -5
Carrie DeMange is an outstanding player. Agreed. Her stats are worthy of the honor and, before I continue, I am NOT advocating that the honor belongs to anyone else. However, I want to point out that Melissa Griffin (Ohio MB) arguably played better this past weekend against tougher competition than when she won AVCA POW four weeks ago. I'm not upset that she didn't get national POW again -- it is hard enough to get once -- but that she was slighted in conference. Consider Melissa Griffin, Ohio University, Sr. MB, Whitehall, Mich/Whitehall [/b] In two matches (7 games) last week, Griffin registered 45 kills (6.43/game), hit at .557 with four blocks (0.57/game), one service ace (0.14/game), and scored 48.5 points (6.93/game). In Ohio’s 3-0 win over Western Michigan (10/19), Griffin recorded a team-high 19 kills while hitting .417 with one ace and two blocks. She added 26 kills with two blocks in the Bobcats’ 3-1 win over Northern Illinois on Saturday (10/20). Imagine the stats she would've racked up if Ohio played 9 games instead of 7. [/quote] Yes, but imagine the stats she wouldn't have racked up if she played in the PAC 10, the Big 12 or the Big Ten......
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Post by bucky415 on Oct 23, 2007 0:49:04 GMT -5
Come on, bomber. If you remember, the Badgers didn't exactly spank the Bobcats in the AVCA in Madison last year. The girl probably can play.
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Post by bomber on Oct 23, 2007 0:54:02 GMT -5
Come on, bomber. If you remember, the Badgers didn't exactly spank the Bobcats in the AVCA in Madison last year. The girl probably can play. No doubt....but this thread was about Demange, and I thought it was inappropriate for some Ohio fan (probably her mother) to be stumping Griffin off topic.
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Post by Keystonekid on Oct 23, 2007 10:44:31 GMT -5
Man, if that is the definition of inappropriate, this whole board is NC-17.
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Post by Wolfgang on Oct 23, 2007 10:50:14 GMT -5
Carrie DeMange ... has had a great career at Duke, a fabulous education and ... You don't necessarily get a great education at Duke (or Stanford or Northwestern or Harvard for that matter). It depends on your major, what classes you took, and how you applied yourself in those classes. You can go through 4 years of college and not learn much. In fact, you can be Joe Dimwit and get a better education from Kapiolani Community College if you put in the effort and dedication to bettering yourself. What you DO get, however, is a highly reputable degree from Duke, not necessarily a great education.
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Post by OU-OhYeah! on Oct 23, 2007 17:05:14 GMT -5
Yes, but imagine the stats she wouldn't have racked up if she played in the PAC 10, the Big 12 or the Big Ten...... vs. Wisconsin (in Madison) on August 26, 2006: 19-11-53 for .151, 1 BS, 2 BA Not a great percentage, but as I look over the Wisconsin stats the highest percentage is .182 (Reineke). The highest kill total for Wisconsin? Dolger with 13. Ellen Herman AND Amanda Andersen matched that for Ohio. Since you were speculating!
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Post by OU-OhYeah! on Oct 23, 2007 17:10:54 GMT -5
No doubt....but this thread was about Demange, and I thought it was inappropriate for some Ohio fan (probably her mother) to be stumping Griffin off topic. Last time I checked, it was physiologically impossible for me to be her mother. I can check again -- still the same. Actually, I thought the thread was about POW and Demange. I duly noted Demange's accomplishment. But questioning the award (or a similar conference award) is no different than questioning a weekly poll. I see a lot of people stumping for their teams when Ohio is ranked. I don't gripe about that. That's the purpose of a forum!
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Post by bomber on Oct 23, 2007 17:13:57 GMT -5
Yes, but imagine the stats she wouldn't have racked up if she played in the PAC 10, the Big 12 or the Big Ten...... vs. Wisconsin (in Madison) on August 26, 2006: 19-11-53 for .151, 1 BS, 2 BA Not a great percentage, but as I look over the Wisconsin stats the highest percentage is .182 (Reineke). The highest kill total for Wisconsin? Dolger with 13. Ellen Herman AND Amanda Andersen matched that for Ohio. Since you were speculating! Did anyone for Wisconsin have close to 53 swings?? I don't think so......and that was Dolgner's second game as a frosh, she wasn't even starting then. I hate to say this, but you kind of proved my point. But to take it one step further, this year Griffin played two games against the conferences I mentioned. She hit .212 on 33 swings against Minnesota, and .000 on 19 swings against Stanford. Let's see....three games against Big Three conference teams, with hitting %'s of .151, .212, and .000. It ain't so easy to hit in the Big Three..... I rest my case.
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Post by bomber on Oct 23, 2007 17:30:16 GMT -5
By the way, in no way do I mean to imply that Melissa Griffin is not a very good volleyballer. But sometimes I think it is important to temper gaudy stats against the level of competition you face.
(See thread about AA Watch List for further discussion on this very topic.)
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Post by OU-OhYeah! on Oct 23, 2007 18:18:27 GMT -5
I hate to say this, but you kind of proved my point. It ain't so easy to hit in the Big Three..... I rest my case. OK, then let's follow the point through to its logical conclusion -- no one outside the "Big Three" should be considered for POW? Please!
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Post by bomber on Oct 24, 2007 6:49:20 GMT -5
I hate to say this, but you kind of proved my point. It ain't so easy to hit in the Big Three..... I rest my case. OK, then let's follow the point through to its logical conclusion -- no one outside the "Big Three" should be considered for POW? Please! No, I didn't say that at all. But this whole discussion started when you brought up Griffin's stats for POW consideration in the manner of something like, look. she's put up these numbers again (she should be considered again). My point is, a superior player in a lesser competitive environment should and probably will put up gaudy numbers almost every week. And that is when some consideration should be given to the overall competitiveness of the conference she is in. One last example. If you were to look at NCAA stats for D1, you would see that almost without exception, the leaders in service ace's per game ALL come from schools in other conferences than the Big Three. Do you think that's because just by coincidence, all the best servers went to these schools instead of the Big Three? Obviously not. The answer more probably has to do with the fact that there are more people capable of handling difficult serves in the Big Three conferences because their overall athletic ability is that much better,and in general there are more capable players in these conferences. I also believe that when awards like AA are given out at season's end, consideration should be focused on those players who consistantly performed at the highest level against the highest levels of competition. Again, I'm not saying players from a mid level conference shouldn't be considered. But I do think overall level of competition should be a factor in determining who are worthy of the awards.
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