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Post by shockjock on Aug 5, 2009 10:00:56 GMT -5
Actually, I do have concern about his citizenship. No president should be above the law (see George W.), therefore if President Obama does not meet the requirements to be president, then I believe he should step down. If people don't like those requirements, they should pursue legislative means to change the law. The ethical responsibility to do what's right doesn't change simply because a bunch of idiots unfortunately just happen to appear to be on the side of doing what's right for idiotic personal motives. Just to be fair and balanced, because its true! Some idiots ,unfortunately, also happen to appear to be on the "wrong "side of doing what's right for idiotic personal motives too! Changes can be good! |
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Post by Barky on Aug 5, 2009 10:55:31 GMT -5
Actually, I do have concern about his citizenship. Tell me... Is your concern that he was actually born in Kenya and there has been a grand conspiracy by an incredibly large number of people, including federal employees, the entire Hawaii State government, it's Republican governor and two mainstream independent newspapers to cover up this fact? Or as some birther put it in one of these threads that the two newspapers "lied" when they printed his birth announcement 48 years ago. Or some other birther claims the Republican governor and State of Hawaii are covering up the fact that he was born in Kenya because they like the idea of Obama being a local boy? Or is it that he as born in the US to a US citizen yet is still not a natural born citizen? Sure, but he's already stated he was born in Hawaii. Therefore, the burden of proof is 100% on the lunatics to prove otherwise and take action. A few irrational people don't get to throw out ridiculous, meritless accusations and then sit back and say "now prove to me it isn't true. I say you need to prove to me it isn't true!!" It doesn't work that way in this country. Right. And if people feel that he does not meet those requirements, they should pursue judicial means to rectify the situation, otherwise they are just spitting into the wind. Absolutely. But you seem to have reached the conclusion that there is an ethical responsibility here that isn't being met and that the bunch of idiots with idiotic personal motives in this situation are doing what's right. That is where we disagree. |
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Post by goGopherBill on Aug 5, 2009 12:41:28 GMT -5
He already stated he was born in Hawaii..
Baaaa ?
I want all of you to think back and remember when and where you were born...
Baaa?
I can prove when and where ..actually why and because also.
He can too..by showing us the BIRTH CERTIFICATE.
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Post by shockjock on Aug 5, 2009 12:59:18 GMT -5
Posted by Barky VonSchnauzer on Today at 10:55am
"Or is it that he as born in the US to a US citizen yet is still not a natural born citizen?"
"The Dangerous Precedent Set by Obama being President.
Posted in Uncategorized on August 4, 2009 by naturalborncitizen
Obama’s father was never a US citizen, nor was he ever permanently domiciled in the US. At birth, Obama was a British citizen. [He's also been a Kenyan citizen and perhaps a citizen of Indonesia as well.] Obama admits his birth status was governed by Great Britain.
The question presented then is whether the US is willing to allow persons who were born without sole allegiance to the US to be Commander in Chief of our military.
For it is this specific fear that prompted our first Supreme Court Chief Justice – John Jay – to suggest to George Washington the following:
Permit me to hint, whether it would be wise and seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of Foreigners into the administration of our national Government; and to declare expressly that the Commander in Chief of the American army shall not be given to nor devolve on, any but a natural born Citizen.
This letter was written on July 25, 1787. It is in direct response to Alexander Hamilton’s suggested Presidential requirement appearing in the first draft of the Constitution wherein Hamilton – five weeks earlier – on June 18, 1787 submitted the following:
No person shall be eligible to the office of President of the United States unless he be now a Citizen of one of the States, or hereafter be born a Citizen of the United States.
There you have the crux of the issue now before the nation. Hamilton’s original drafted presidential requirement was rejected by the framers. Instead of allowing any person born a citizen to be President, the framers chose to adopt the more stringent requirement from John Jay, that the President be a natural born citizen.
Contrary to media lies, you will find not one single statute in current US law which uses the words “natural born citizen” in code provisions which grant citizenship. For no statute can make one a natural born citizen. It’s a status, not a right. And that status is necessary for only one purpose under the sun – to be Commander In Chief of the US armed forces.
Any citizen can hold any office in the entire Government of the United States except for Commander In Chief. And for good reason, as John Jay made clear all those years ago. This doesn’t mean that immigrants from all nations can’t one day be President. They can. But they need to have two generations of US citizenship to do that – not one.
If we decide to ignore the natural born citizen provision, we open the door to the possibility of a person with strong ties to foreign nations – possibly stronger than to our own – to be the sole commander of our military men and women who protect us. And they also deserve our protection – AT ALL COSTS – from such a treasonous scenario.
We shouldn’t let our Constitutional guard down for the sake of allowing one very popular man to endanger all future generations. Is it not possible that persons such as Kim Jong Il or Osama Bin Laden might imgregnate a US citizen woman? And if this woman gives birth on US soil the precedent set by Obama would allow that child to be Commander In Chief.
I’m not worried about Obama as President. I’m worried about who comes next because of the precedent he sets. The same fear caused me to challenge McCain on the ballot as well.
This is the issue before the nation - and it’s right from the mouth of John Jay’s more restrictive requirement that it was “wise and seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of Foreigners into the administration of our national Government; and to declare expressly that the Commander in Chief of the American army shall not be given to nor devolve on, any but a natural born Citizen.”
The framers wisely provided us with that check.
By weakening the natural born citizen check, we dangerously enlarge the pool of candidates who can be Commander In Chief or our armed forces."
Who made the rules?
Who should follow the rules?
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Post by goGopherBill on Aug 5, 2009 13:06:43 GMT -5
There have been DIRECT challenges to his "Certificate of birth "
It is shown to be a FORGED DOCUMENT.
WHY is HE NOT responsible to show a NON FORGED document and end any worries that MANY HAVE..
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Post by Tiruray2004 on Aug 5, 2009 13:29:05 GMT -5
How Fake are these Transparency Dodgers?
They are as fake as Pam Anderson's boobs!
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Post by goGopherBill on Aug 5, 2009 13:34:19 GMT -5
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Post by Barky on Aug 5, 2009 17:36:59 GMT -5
Like I said, put up or shut up. Don't just make up accusations - prove them or stop bitching and crying.
Since, according to you, it is a FACT that the birth certificate has been PROVEN to be forged and it is a FACT that he was born in Kenya then by all means do something about it.
Lol. I've got my popcorn ready and will wait for this comedy to play out. Go ahead. Surely, since it is a FACT that it is forged and he was born in Kenya, you should absolutely be able to get the election overturned. No problem. Time's a wastin' so get crackin'.
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Post by goGopherBill on Aug 5, 2009 18:23:56 GMT -5
When the legal process challenges someone to defend themselves against accusations..
Prosecutors must prove a time line and a motive ..
the DEFENSE must provide a sound alibi.
OBAMA cannot yet prove beyond a doubt he was born when and where he claims,
Motive..To gain office and become the most powerful man in the world.
GOOD enough for me.
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Post by Barky on Aug 5, 2009 18:59:38 GMT -5
Nope.
Lol! You really do make stuff up as you go along.
(BTW, What legal process? The one you have never initiated and will never initiate because you know it's meritless?)
The prosecution has the absolute burden of proving a case beyond a reasonable doubt in criminal cases (the defense has NO duty to prove anything - they are presumed innocent). The plaintiff has the absolute burden of proving cases by a preponderance of the evidence in civil cases.
Like I said, I'll be waiting for you to take this up since you have stated you have "FACTS" and "PROOF."
Go for it.
Because if you just babble and don't do anything, it just kind of looks like you're really full of it.
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Post by lonewolf on Aug 5, 2009 21:37:01 GMT -5
Actually, I do have concern about his citizenship. Tell me... Is your concern that he was actually born in Kenya and there has been a grand conspiracy by an incredibly large number of people, including federal employees, the entire Hawaii State government, it's Republican governor and two mainstream independent newspapers to cover up this fact? Or as some birther put it in one of these threads that the two newspapers "lied" when they printed his birth announcement 48 years ago. Or some other birther claims the Republican governor and State of Hawaii are covering up the fact that he was born in Kenya because they like the idea of Obama being a local boy? Don't forget all of the people in the House, as it's their responsibility to go over any issues concerning a president's eligibility. |
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Post by lonewolf on Aug 5, 2009 21:38:14 GMT -5
It is shown to be a FORGED DOCUMENT. Certain people believe it is a forgery...just as people believe there is a face of a man on Mars...there is no substantial proof that it is a forgery, unlike the Kenyan birth certificate that surfaced recently. And honestly...don't you think that if he did have all the power to make this giant conspiracy, that he could make a "real" certificate? |
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Post by goGopherBill on Aug 5, 2009 21:40:04 GMT -5
I guess you didnt watch the OJ trial close enough.
OJ had to produce an alibi and he tried to say 4 strange Mexicans and a spaceship from outerspace landed and committed the act.
The jury believed him.
If the glove dont fit you must aquit.
If the document is a fraud..you must flog.
works for me.
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Post by lonewolf on Aug 5, 2009 21:40:55 GMT -5
When the legal process challenges someone to defend themselves against accusations.. Prosecutors must prove a time line and a motive .. the DEFENSE must provide a sound alibi. OBAMA cannot yet prove beyond a doubt he was born when and where he claims, Motive..To gain office and become the most powerful man in the world. GOOD enough for me. Interesting legal standpoint....where in the constitution does it say that proof has to be beyond a doubt? |
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Post by Barky on Aug 5, 2009 22:02:45 GMT -5
Just keep me posted on how your legal process goes... Should be a slamdunk case with all your "FACTS" and "PROOF".
I'll be waiting for you to get the election nullified since you claim to have the "TRUTH" on your side.
(Or do you just plan on just continuing to whine because you actually have nothing and you know it?)
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