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Post by Wolfgang on Dec 16, 2015 1:05:57 GMT -5
Just off the top of my head, leagues that have failed include the USFL, WFL, XFL, WHL, ABA, CBA, Pro softball, Team Tennis, and likely several others. The WNBA is still around, but bleeding large volumes of cash. And these were all well bankrolled in sports that already had large followings. How is AVP doing? And that doesn't require much in stadium/vcenue costs. If someone were thinking about funding pro volleyball, all they would have to do is look at the number of people who actually bought tickets for the Regional matches, to be scared away. If I were an investor, I would be asking questions about attendance and popularity numbers before I bankrolled any league. The fact that collegiate volleyball has really low attendance figures would scare me away. However, I might consider a vb league consisting of two conferences, the winners of each conference playing for a championship: Nebraska conference: West Omaha East Omaha Lincoln Bellevue Grand Island Kearney Fremont Hastings Hawaii conference: Honolulu Kailua Hilo Pearl City Waipahu Kaneohe Mililani Kahului
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Post by alarmclock on Dec 16, 2015 2:01:58 GMT -5
Gabby Reece. Nike. 90's. Didn't work. Says the Gabrielle Reece poster I had in my room? It did work, but volleyball wasn't the sport then that it is now. I'd never even heard of club ball and I was a big lover of the sport back then. Times they are a changin and social media and all the vball obsessed club girls make today a very different environment than the mid 90's. Didn't work. The fact that you had one Gabby Reece poster on your wall doesn't mean it worked in the 90's.
Maybe you should look up the ABVL.
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Post by mikegarrison on Dec 16, 2015 2:12:01 GMT -5
Says the Gabrielle Reece poster I had in my room? It did work, but volleyball wasn't the sport then that it is now. I'd never even heard of club ball and I was a big lover of the sport back then. Times they are a changin and social media and all the vball obsessed club girls make today a very different environment than the mid 90's. Didn't work. The fact that you had one Gabby Reece poster on your wall doesn't mean it worked in the 90's.
Maybe you should look up the ABVL.
Well ... no one specified what "work" the poster was supposed to accomplish. Perhaps it did work.
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Post by alarmclock on Dec 16, 2015 2:55:00 GMT -5
Didn't work. The fact that you had one Gabby Reece poster on your wall doesn't mean it worked in the 90's.
Maybe you should look up the ABVL.
Well ... no one specified what "work" the poster was supposed to accomplish. Perhaps it did work. Stop getting distracted. Stay on point. Pro league in the U.S. Gabby Reece and Nike. Didn't work. See ABVL.
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Post by alarmclock on Dec 16, 2015 2:57:38 GMT -5
Just off the top of my head, leagues that have failed include the USFL, WFL, XFL, WHL, ABA, CBA, Pro softball, Team Tennis, and likely several others. The WNBA is still around, but bleeding large volumes of cash. And these were all well bankrolled in sports that already had large followings. How is AVP doing? And that doesn't require much in stadium/vcenue costs. If someone were thinking about funding pro volleyball, all they would have to do is look at the number of people who actually bought tickets for the Regional matches, to be scared away. If I were an investor, I would be asking questions about attendance and popularity numbers before I bankrolled any league. The fact that collegiate volleyball has really low attendance figures would scare me away. However, I might consider a vb league consisting of two conferences, the winners of each conference playing for a championship: Nebraska conference: West Omaha East Omaha Lincoln Bellevue Grand Island Kearney Fremont Hastings Hawaii conference: Honolulu Kailua Hilo Pearl City Waipahu Kaneohe Mililani Kahului I can see it now. Kearney and Waipahu meeting for the championship in a best-of-seven home/away series. Average attendance = 47 people.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2015 6:50:17 GMT -5
Just off the top of my head, leagues that have failed include the USFL, WFL, XFL, WHL, ABA, CBA, Pro softball, Team Tennis, and likely several others. The WNBA is still around, but bleeding large volumes of cash. And these were all well bankrolled in sports that already had large followings. How is AVP doing? And that doesn't require much in stadium/vcenue costs. If someone were thinking about funding pro volleyball, all they would have to do is look at the number of people who actually bought tickets for the Regional matches, to be scared away. If I were an investor, I would be asking questions about attendance and popularity numbers before I bankrolled any league. The fact that collegiate volleyball has really low attendance figures would scare me away. However, I might consider a vb league consisting of two conferences, the winners of each conference playing for a championship: Nebraska conference: Hawaii conference: Nebraska and Hawaii are 2 of the strongest collegiate volleyball markets in the USA. However, I was watching the US Women's National Team over the summer play in the FIVB World Grand Prix Final Round, which was in Omaha, NE and the attendance was paltry. I don't know whether there was lack of advertising or just the time of year (late July), but it was disheartening to see so many empty seats.
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Post by hennosy on Dec 16, 2015 7:50:21 GMT -5
I would think playing in Jan, Feb, March would be better than May, June and July. Not much to do as it is. Football is in playoff mode. Basketball (college and pro) is going but that's it. WNBA fans aren't attending WNBA games.
The model of regional conferences to limit travel costs would be best. Start with 4-6 teams per region. 1-2 teams make playoffs. Pay would be low to start, but increase if it took off. Players would need to make side deals to market themselves. Play all games on the internet with advertising on screen during the game. Again if it takes off, FOX sports or CBS sports might pick it up to fill in programming.
Player can make 100k in Europe (foreign country/foreign language) by themselves or 20k in America with family and friends. MLS has existed without the top American players for years. Now more and more American players stay in the US vs traveling to Europe. IF things went well eventually more American players would stay to play volleyball.
It has to be proven it can succeed, before investors show the money.
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Post by joc on Dec 16, 2015 8:17:29 GMT -5
Imagine if one dollar of every club juniors membership fee went towards a pro league endowment. How long would it take to build that fund up? Anyone know what the membership totals are in club volleyball, as in, how many people play?
In the opening years, offer the interest as a tournament prize much like PVL does at the National, but make a qualification for the championship event by hosting four smaller regional dates where teams can compete to qualify based on results.
Website and webcasting are both pretty easy, so promotion of the league that way would be fairly simple until it gained the popularity to draw the corporate sponsors to be on television.
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Post by SportyBucky on Dec 16, 2015 8:52:24 GMT -5
If I were an investor, I would be asking questions about attendance and popularity numbers before I bankrolled any league. The fact that collegiate volleyball has really low attendance figures would scare me away. However, I might consider a vb league consisting of two conferences, the winners of each conference playing for a championship: Nebraska conference: Hawaii conference: Nebraska and Hawaii are 2 of the strongest collegiate volleyball markets in the USA. However, I was watching the US Women's National Team over the summer play in the FIVB World Grand Prix Final Round, which was in Omaha, NE and the attendance was paltry. I don't know whether there was lack of advertising or just the time of year (late July), but it was disheartening to see so many empty seats. Most leagues don't make their money from attendance. They make money from sponsorship. A league in NE and HI would have to pay sponsors to take part, unless they were local sponsors. Not trying to be a smartas*, but they are really, really, really small and relatively insignificant financial markets. If you could fill 50K seats every match at $40-50 a seat, have at it. Otherwise, wouldn't work.
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Post by luckydawg on Dec 16, 2015 11:43:01 GMT -5
I wonder what percentage of ticket buying fans at schools with good attendance are there to watch good volleyball vs. they love their university's sports? Fans of school programs likely would not buy tickets to the pros, even if it were across the street.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2015 11:50:07 GMT -5
I wonder what percentage of ticket buying fans at schools with good attendance are there to watch good volleyball vs. they love their university's sports? Fans of school programs likely would not buy tickets to the pros, even if it were across the street. But what if the pros were made up of former college players from their school? Plus have the school program's social media do regular shout-outs or "where are they now" type of posts to the alumni who are playing pro.
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Post by bc1900 on Dec 16, 2015 12:14:01 GMT -5
Nebraska is by far the most financially successful VB program: Nebraska VolleyballThey generated $600K in gross profit on $3 million in revenue, a 20% margin (pretty good), but no player salaries. If we allocate half the gross profit to salaries that's $25K per player for a 12 person roster and leaves the hypothetical owner with a gross profit margin of 10% (getting a bit thin). However, if advertising/sponsorship money could be maximized, who knows. Advertisers direct money to where they get the most eyeballs, so VB has to be TV friendly. The players themselves are a big plus, typically attractive and athletic; the game is fast and strategic, so what's the problem? In my view the game should be simplified, fewer technical violations, no rotations, more substitutions allowed, etc., easier to understand and follow. There are still a few curmudgeons out there grousing about how rally scoring has ruined the sport, but if we're serious about a pro league the game has to evolve.
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Post by n00b on Dec 16, 2015 12:52:20 GMT -5
Nebraska is by far the most financially successful VB program: Nebraska VolleyballThey generated $600K in gross profit on $3 million in revenue, a 20% margin (pretty good), but no player salaries. If we allocate half the gross profit to salaries that's $25K per player for a 12 person roster and leaves the hypothetical owner with a gross profit margin of 10% (getting a bit thin). However, if advertising/sponsorship money could be maximized, who knows. Advertisers direct money to where they get the most eyeballs, so VB has to be TV friendly. The players themselves are a big plus, typically attractive and athletic; the game is fast and strategic, so what's the problem? In my view the game should be simplified, fewer technical violations, no rotations, more substitutions allowed, etc., easier to understand and follow. There are still a few curmudgeons out there grousing about how rally scoring has ruined the sport, but if we're serious about a pro league the game has to evolve. I'm pretty sure you could also spend less than $2.4 million (like Nebraska apparently did) to run the team...
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Post by owlsem on Dec 16, 2015 13:59:43 GMT -5
I think there is a pro league it is just of the beach variety. Beach has identifiable stars. It is event marketing in one weekend, Big party all the stars at one location. My guess is it would take this kind of barnstorming approach to make this work for the floor game. Think like senior tennis or Harlem globe trotters, WWE with real competition. But there has to be another attraction to the event.
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Post by diggerdive on Dec 16, 2015 14:27:58 GMT -5
This was tried in the late 80's; and it didn't survive for a few reasons; finances being the main one. DHL was the corporate sponsor. I created a Wiki page a few years ago; as I was a huge fan. I learned a lot from Chris Marlowe and Mary Jo Peppler. Here's the link if you'd like to learn more. I also posted some short clips on YouTube. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_League_Volleyball
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