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Post by bvolley17 on May 15, 2018 23:31:23 GMT -5
I'm glad she's taking her time and being thoughtful about finding the right fit. Agreed. As tough as it is to stomach losing all of these players, I really hope they find the best situation for them and succeed. For me - even as a die-hard Carolina guy - I became invested in these players; and even if it's not with our program, I want to see how well they do in their careers. It will be hard though, especially when you start to think of what could have been! SaveSave
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Post by bvolley17 on May 15, 2018 23:46:48 GMT -5
What's crazy is that when they list all of our transfers in the article, it's almost impossible to digest. And yet, they didn't mention losing an additional top-50 recruit in Sydnye Fields. Even though we've known about a bulk of these transfers for so long it still seems unbelievable to me the transition the program is undergoing. I am a very optimistic person in general, so I am really hoping that our current roster really rises to the challenge and becomes a strong and unified team. I think we'll win some games we shouldn't win and lose some games we shouldn't lose, but I don't know if we will crack the top-25 at any point next season. However, I'd certainly welcome it! Also, it's interesting they mention Hadden Lagarde in the article but not Ava Bell. I believe Bell was a top-50 recruit, wasn't she? Was Hadden a ranked recruit, too? I didn't think she was. SaveSave
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Post by bvolley17 on May 15, 2018 23:57:05 GMT -5
Agreed. As tough as it is to stomach losing all of these players, I really hope they find the best situation for them and succeed. For me - even as a die-hard Carolina guy - I became invested in these players; and even if it's not with our program, I want to see how well they do in their careers. It will be hard though, especially when you start to think of what could have been! SaveSave2 years ago they had a recruiting class with 4 top 25 kids and 2 very good assistants. Now 2 new assistants and starting over with a brand new highly ranked recruiting class. What happened? Obviously there was one medical retirement, which always stinks. Why did the rest leave? Did they not pan out? Did they leave because the assistants moved on? Other reasons? Nobody seems to know the exact reason - or at least hasn't shared it. We did lose Mariah Evans to medical retirement and Julia Scoles quit indoor for what appears to be health reasons (multiple concussions over a few short years) but also because it's been said she has a passion for the beach game as well. Purely speculating and just my opinion, I think losing Eve and Tyler was a big blow, but I think Scoles' decision to transfer had a major effect on this situation as well. She appeared to be incredibly close with both Taylor Borup and Holly Carlton (and the whole team as well - even after she announced her transfer she still showed up at the spring scrimmage and the whole team was sitting with her in the stands during the intermission), and I feel like she was the catalyst for the future of our program. From that point I think it became a domino effect. All-in-all, there has been so much happening with injuries last season and then staffing changes, it became a perfect storm. Every one of the transfers are going to have a major impact on their next program. SaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSave
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Post by chancelucky on May 16, 2018 1:58:14 GMT -5
LaGarde was not ranked. She played for a very small high school and for a relatively low profile club until her junior year. I think Bell was #51 on the Prep Volleyball list or somewhere close to that. fwiw my sense of these things is that there's maybe a top 15 at best and then 60-70 kids who could be ranked in almost random order. Sort of like the SAT where people taking fairly small differences very seriously, there's a tendency to think that being number 40 means that you're way better than number 55. IT's just not the case.
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Post by maɡˈnōlēə on May 16, 2018 7:42:02 GMT -5
Totally off topic but topical nonetheless. Is the rankings system foolproof? Have there been high ranked athletes that didn't pan out at the next level? How they determine rankings? Purely stats? If so are stats consistently being taken across the board? Or are fellow athletes taking them? If so how do we eliminate the bias associated with teammates (often in the same position) taking stats for fellow teammates?
I know that my own daughter had experienced issues with stats taking at the high school level (the numbers don't match the reality for her number of kills but her attempts did match up....hmmmm), honestly small potatoes but it leads me to question the validity of all these rankings. I know many a coach says they can't fully trust kids taking the stats...so if the rankings are based on a faulty system isn't there a lot of questions to be asked about how these kids are getting ranked? Sure you can argue the "eye test" but what happens to the kid that flies just under the radar: good skills, good volleyball IQ...do they get overlooked because of another kid who is "ranked" but plays in a less competitive league/conference or team environment? If put head to head - toe to toe the non ranked kid could run circles around the ranked kid, can that kid ever gain an edge over the ranked kid pre college?
I can't be the only one wondering this. I think I even asked this in another thread awhile ago. .
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Post by Scipio Aemilianus on May 16, 2018 9:54:20 GMT -5
2 years ago they had a recruiting class with 4 top 25 kids and 2 very good assistants. Now 2 new assistants and starting over with a brand new highly ranked recruiting class. What happened? Obviously there was one medical retirement, which always stinks. Why did the rest leave? Did they not pan out? Did they leave because the assistants moved on? Other reasons? Purely speculating and just my opinion, I think losing Eve and Tyler was a big blow I share in this opinion.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2018 11:06:04 GMT -5
Someone already mentioned in a previous post. While losing eve and Tyler were big, I think that losing Julia was the biggest reason why so many of the players chose to transfer. She was a cornerstone player almost like glue for the team. I’m sure that wasn’t the only factor but her and Evans being absent last year obviously showed in games.
I think as a Tar Heel there are a lot of positives to look at. Although Harrison will not be playing this year unless her injury is less severe than first thought, we still bring in a ton of offensive talent to combine with a more mature and prepared defense. I think there are going to be some games that the new team surprises people and some games that are a surprise for not good reasons. But the future does look bright and it starts this year.
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Post by v0lley11 on May 16, 2018 21:34:30 GMT -5
Honestly Eve and Tyler were absolutely the spark-plug to trigger all of this. It would be great to say Julia but in reality it was the coaching change that did it all. Borup was committed since she was a freshman (recruiting coordinator Eve), Holly was her bestfriend and wanted to train with Eve, Mariah needed to medically retire for her overall health and Leath wanted a better experience for her 5th year (she decided before Julia ever left) and as of tomorrow UNC will have their 3rd top 10 recruiting class in 7 years... all 7 years with Eve as recruiting coordinator, and within those 7 years, 2 sweet 16s and 1 Elite 8 which is a common denominator along with when Eve played which they made a sweet 16 appearance.
Things have changed at UNC and a lot of what is posted in this thread is speculation.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2018 22:42:47 GMT -5
Eve and Tyler did have an effect, that can be seen. But, Leath was already planning to leave before the coaching changes happened. There is one cornerstone player gone. If you have followed the 2016, #3 ranked class you would know how close they are to each other. With Julia leaving because of her health and Evans being out the same reason, these girls didn’t really have their core group of friends any more. The sense of togetherness and team chemistry changed, part of that was influenced by leadership changes. And now Joe is having to rebuild that. He has a solid, top 10 class coming and good transfers that will help.
I think Susan and Mike will be very good for the program. I am excited to see how they contribute and the direction they go with recruiting and building the team with Joe.
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Post by chancelucky on May 18, 2018 12:19:25 GMT -5
It was a 3rd Prepvolleyball top 10 recruiting class for UNC. I don't think it's ever going to be possible to say definitively why all those players left and it's quite possible that the individual reasons are quite different. I would, however, say that the former assistants had a vision of turning UNC from a good ACC program to the sort of program that could make the Final Four or even win a national championship. Obviously, this sort of vision isn't all that unusual; it's the dream of most any coach at a major program. What's a bit more unusual is how close it got to being a reality. I also think that a lot of players who committed to UNC bought into that vision. I suspect that part of that vision was that Rackham was very likely to be Sagula's successor. She had started 4 years in the program and helped to raise the program's profile. A similar thing happened after she spent 9 years as an assistant there. She was the recruiting coordinator and Carolina was suddenly competing for recruits with bigger name programs, something that hadn't happened before. Adams had a lower profile, but he brought a more modern approach by pairing video, statistical analysis, and a data-based approach to game planning. One reason that Rackham was highly effective selling UNC was that she was thoroughly invested in both the program and the institution. She wasn't just the logical successor, there was a sense of destiny around it and it brought a kind of institutional mystique that drew on certain Carolina traditions of orderly succession.
I suspect nothing was ever said directly to the players about this, but I also suspect they shared a sense of what was supposed to happen. At some point Rackham would be the coach with Adams as first assistant and Sagula retiring comfortable in the knowledge that he was turning the program over to younger coaches dedicated to building on what had been accomplished there. UNC was unusual, in that, it had the same 3 coaches for 8 years (centuries in D1 volleyball terms), something that added to the sense of inevitability.
At the same time, one can't be an assistant forever. Any ambitious assistant wants at some point to implement his or her own vision. In these situations, you either keep waiting or move that vision to some other place. When Rackham and Adams left, I do think the players looked around and wondered whether this was still the same vision that had brought them to Chapel Hill. The questions were, "Was this going to be a final 4 team in the next year or two?" "Was this what I signed on for?" I think some of the answers were a little unexpected. As an older more traditional coach, Sagula has never warmed up to data analysis or even relying on video as part of systematic skill development. He's more of an "after 30 years of coaching, my gut tells me..." kind of guy. The recruiting also looked quite different. Rackham is a very charismatic recruiter, but I think something that many miss is that she couples that with a sort of levels within levels approach to what she's doing. Instead of younger assistants intent on moving rapidly upwards, he brought in two experienced assistants, one who'd left college coaching for several years and one who'd been a head coach at much smaller programs with good but not inspiring levels of success. One can't say that one approach is better than another, but it was different.
Reasons for leaving and reasons for staying aren't necessarily symmetrical. I do suspect that the latter was impacted by the coaching changes. I've heard Sagula call it a "reset", which is quite different from saying "the faces might be a bit different, but the vision, system, and goals aren't changing." When a 30+ year coach starts talking about doing things differently or resetting, it can be a sign of flexibility and an openness to trying new things, even humility. At the same time, it can be viewed in other ways. It's unusual that the sense of a "Vision" at UNC may have gone with the assistants and players and the coach is talking about a reset, but I haven't heard how the method or approach to this reset is being articulated, as in are we trying to get more skilled instead of more athletic, better defensively, run a faster offense, train differently, etc. My guess is that when the latter happens, the sense of stability/mission will return.
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Post by bvolley17 on May 18, 2018 13:53:57 GMT -5
The general consensus is still that Eve would be our next head coach after Sagula retires, yeah? That is what I always assumed and I would personally love that. I figured that she'd eventually leave to be a head coach and run her own program before ultimately coming back. I worry a little bit about her at Tennessee because if she's successful (which I have zero doubt that she will be tremendously successful), I assume they would throw a lot of money at her to stay as SEC schools can do with all of the football money.
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Post by bvolley17 on May 18, 2018 13:56:22 GMT -5
A little off topic; but, is a subscription to Prep Volleyball worth it? I've always gone back and forth on whether I want to spend the money for it.
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Post by chancelucky on May 18, 2018 14:16:51 GMT -5
If you're interested in the recruiting scene, prep volleyball is the source. I also like the idea of supporting John Tawa. I even root for his son's current baseball team :}
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2018 13:09:18 GMT -5
Probably going to be some stories and write ups about the foreign tour but I did get to listen in and talk with some people close to the program about some learning about the team:
1. Team chemistry seems to be very good. Atherton is likely to run a 5-1. Archer is also an impressive setter.
2. Destiny Cox is the real deal and the likely a freshmen star as she is going to be a 6 rotation OH.
3. Ava and Aristea are the most versatile players and very strong offensively. They will factor into the starting lineup.
4. Fradenburg will be the libero but Hough has demonstrated the ability to also fill the role.
5. No official word on Harrison’s health since that is protected under regulations, but she did go on the tour and at first it had been ruled out.
Camp starts soon and Cox will be headed to the USA JNT. Season is on the way!
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Post by rblackley on May 30, 2018 13:16:04 GMT -5
Ive seen Cox play and she is impressive. Also seen alot of Harrison since my daughter played on the same club team.
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