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Post by network155 on Jan 10, 2019 0:29:23 GMT -5
Food for thought - because I see a lot of listing Plummer's accolades, which include her 3x All-American status, 2 National Championships, NFOY, 2x NPOY - would Plummer have two NC if she wasn't surrounded by 3 AA in 2016 and 4 in 2018? Would she be a 3x First Teamer, NFOY, NPOY if she had a different setter? This question can clearly apply to any player on this thread, and I'm not discrediting her talent, but if the argument for Plummer is solely based on her accolades, we need to give credit where it's due. She didn't win those things on her own. Are you serious with this question? Than this goes for every volleyball player, and every good player on any team sports including baseball, basketball, and football. But it takes a great player to lead her team to the championships, and for that she deserves all the accolades!
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Post by beachbomb on Jan 10, 2019 2:19:42 GMT -5
No Hunter? I don't anything about cepero, so how does she compare to hunter? that was a tough one...we have had incredible setters. Anderson, Hunter, Johnson, Cepero, Andicott, etc. Who to pick? Cepero was NPOY. i see you didn't put Cook on that list... i agree
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Post by saywho on Jan 10, 2019 12:07:04 GMT -5
No Hunter? I don't anything about cepero, so how does she compare to hunter? that was a tough one...we have had incredible setters. Anderson, Hunter, Johnson, Cepero, Andicott, etc. Who to pick? Cepero was NPOY. I'd add Holloway to the list, even though it was just a year's sampling size. And I think she actually may have been the best of the bunch but just didn't stick around to prove it. Cepero was good because of her size but I was never super crazy about her actual setting talent. It definitely wasn't bad, I just didn't think she was phenomal. She did win NPOY though as a sophomore, which I think at the time was the only time a sophomore had done so. Had Metcalf actually played that year, she probably would've gotten the nod for npoy.
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Post by karellen on Jan 10, 2019 12:16:33 GMT -5
Micha Hancock
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Post by bballnut90 on Jan 10, 2019 12:53:41 GMT -5
If I made a roster itd have:
Plummer-no brainer pick at outside. 2x champion and 2x POY with a season left
Foecke-2x MOP, 2x champion, lacks individual honors but balled out in a massive way in every semifinal/championship
Ajanaku-POY candidate 2 years, very physical middle who won a title. Was huge in leading Stanford back to the semis after a drought.
Washington-another POY candidate and likely a 4x 1st team all american if she didnt miss so many games as a freshman. Outstanding attacker.
Hamson-I dont think she stacks up well with the likes of many outsides, but she was dominant as a RS attacker and led BYU to a title game appearance. Didnt include Blair Brown since she was only playing for 1 year (2010).
Lauren Carlini-toss up for me between her and Hancock, but I think what she accomplished at Wisconsin was truly remarkable...the program went 5 straight years without a tournament appearance and she led an unheralded group to a title appearance where they put up a huge fight against a loaded Penn State team. Carlini was a standout every year even though she never made it back despite coming close (two 5 set losses and an injury as a soph)
Hentz-best libero in the nation all 3 years IMO. Just a ridiculous digger and has 2 titles to her name.
2nd team: OH-Vansant, stud outside for Wash OH-Eckerman, another beast on the outside all 4 years MB-Rettke, statistically just incredible as a middle. Likely a 4x 1st Teamer. MB-Alhassan, immensely physical and a dominant force at Florida. Led team to first Final Four in 14 years. RS-Nwanebu, the 2 years when she was on were incredible. Arguably the weakest of the bunch though. S-Hancock, easily could be on 1st team L-Hagglund, incredible defender
Noteworthy: S: Poulter SSS
OH: Bricio Jupiter Danielson RJP
RS: Bergsma Ariel Scott Lowe
MB: Chiaka Adams
L: JWO
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Post by bballnut90 on Jan 10, 2019 12:56:16 GMT -5
that was a tough one...we have had incredible setters. Anderson, Hunter, Johnson, Cepero, Andicott, etc. Who to pick? Cepero was NPOY. I'd add Holloway to the list, even though it was just a year's sampling size. And I think she actually may have been the best of the bunch but just didn't stick around to prove it. Cepero was good because of her size but I was never super crazy about her actual setting talent. It definitely wasn't bad, I just didn't think she was phenomal. She did win NPOY though as a sophomore, which I think at the time was the only time a sophomore had done so. Had Metcalf actually played that year, she probably would've gotten the nod for npoy. Cepero wasnt a very strong setter IMO. Stellar blocker and a good attacker, but I would've given POY to Pilakowski or Porter/Livingston over Cepero in 2000. Cepero was an excellent player, but I'd rate her behind Nepo and Hunter. Holloway was a stronger technical setter than Cepero too.
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Post by donut on Jan 10, 2019 12:56:58 GMT -5
If I made a roster itd have: Plummer-no brainer pick at outside. 2x champion and 2x POY with a season left Foecke-2x MOP, 2x champion, lacks individual honors but balled out in a massive way in every semifinal/championship Ajanaku-POY candidate 2 years, very physical middle who won a title. Was huge in leading Stanford back to the semis after a drought. Washington-another POY candidate and likely a 4x 1st team all american if she didnt miss so many games as a freshman. Outstanding attacker. Hamson-I dont think she stacks up well with the likes of many outsides, but she was dominant as a RS attacker and led BYU to a title game appearance. Didnt include Blair Brown since she was only playing for 1 year (2010). Lauren Carlini-toss up for me between her and Hancock, but I think what she accomplished at Wisconsin was truly remarkable...the program went 5 straight years without a tournament appearance and she led an unheralded group to a title appearance where they put up a huge fight against a loaded Penn State team. Carlini was a standout every year even though she never made it back despite coming close (two 5 set losses and an injury as a soph) Hentz-best libero in the nation all 3 years IMO. Just a ridiculous digger and has 2 titles to her name. 2nd team: OH-Vansant, stud outside for Wash OH-Eckerman, another beast on the outside all 4 years MB-Rettke, statistically just incredible as a middle. Likely a 4x 1st Teamer. MB-Alhassan, immensely physical and a dominant force at Florida. Led team to first Final Four in 14 years. RS-Nwanebu, the 2 years when she was on were incredible. Arguably the weakest of the bunch though. S-Hancock, easily could be on 1st team L-Hagglund, incredible defender Noteworthy: S: Poulter SSS OH: Bricio Jupiter Danielson RJP RS: Bergsma Ariel Scott Lowe MB: Chiaka Adams L: JWO So you're only looking at the last 5-ish years?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2019 13:02:36 GMT -5
If I made a roster itd have: Plummer-no brainer pick at outside. 2x champion and 2x POY with a season left Foecke-2x MOP, 2x champion, lacks individual honors but balled out in a massive way in every semifinal/championship Ajanaku-POY candidate 2 years, very physical middle who won a title. Was huge in leading Stanford back to the semis after a drought. Washington-another POY candidate and likely a 4x 1st team all american if she didnt miss so many games as a freshman. Outstanding attacker. Hamson-I dont think she stacks up well with the likes of many outsides, but she was dominant as a RS attacker and led BYU to a title game appearance. Didnt include Blair Brown since she was only playing for 1 year (2010). Lauren Carlini-toss up for me between her and Hancock, but I think what she accomplished at Wisconsin was truly remarkable...the program went 5 straight years without a tournament appearance and she led an unheralded group to a title appearance where they put up a huge fight against a loaded Penn State team. Carlini was a standout every year even though she never made it back despite coming close (two 5 set losses and an injury as a soph) Hentz-best libero in the nation all 3 years IMO. Just a ridiculous digger and has 2 titles to her name. 2nd team: OH-Vansant, stud outside for Wash OH-Eckerman, another beast on the outside all 4 years MB-Rettke, statistically just incredible as a middle. Likely a 4x 1st Teamer. MB-Alhassan, immensely physical and a dominant force at Florida. Led team to first Final Four in 14 years. RS-Nwanebu, the 2 years when she was on were incredible. Arguably the weakest of the bunch though. S-Hancock, easily could be on 1st team L-Hagglund, incredible defender Noteworthy: S: Poulter SSS OH: Bricio Jupiter Danielson RJP RS: Bergsma Ariel Scott Lowe MB: Chiaka Adams L: JWO As I "liked" the above, I feel that it was pretty 'spot-on'; save for one "noteworthy". S: Gray (Really!)
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Post by holidayhusker on Jan 10, 2019 15:13:31 GMT -5
that was a tough one...we have had incredible setters. Anderson, Hunter, Johnson, Cepero, Andicott, etc. Who to pick? Cepero was NPOY. I'd add Holloway to the list, even though it was just a year's sampling size. And I think she actually may have been the best of the bunch but just didn't stick around to prove it. Cepero was good because of her size but I was never super crazy about her actual setting talent. It definitely wasn't bad, I just didn't think she was phenomal. She did win NPOY though as a sophomore, which I think at the time was the only time a sophomore had done so. Had Metcalf actually played that year, she probably would've gotten the nod for npoy. I don't know. I agree to an extent but remember Cepero was a hitter that changed positions and won the NPOY the first year she set.That is very impressive. She really revolutionize the position of blocker/attacker from a setting position also. She made herself a tremendous threat as well as the hitters. She was much like Carlini but back in the day.
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Post by volleyguy on Jan 10, 2019 15:23:45 GMT -5
I'd add Holloway to the list, even though it was just a year's sampling size. And I think she actually may have been the best of the bunch but just didn't stick around to prove it. Cepero was good because of her size but I was never super crazy about her actual setting talent. It definitely wasn't bad, I just didn't think she was phenomal. She did win NPOY though as a sophomore, which I think at the time was the only time a sophomore had done so. Had Metcalf actually played that year, she probably would've gotten the nod for npoy. I don't know. I agree to an extent but remember Cepero was a hitter that changed positions and won the NPOY the first year she set.That is very impressive. She really revolutionize the position of blocker/attacker from a setting position also. She made herself a tremendous threat as well as the hitters. She was much like Carlini but back in the day. Cepero revolutionized the setter position? You've been reading the Husker website, I see (except they used the term "reinvented".) Cepero was a good setter who was also tall and athletic. Hardly revolutionary, except that she played at Nebraska.
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Post by bballnut90 on Jan 10, 2019 16:32:09 GMT -5
I'd add Holloway to the list, even though it was just a year's sampling size. And I think she actually may have been the best of the bunch but just didn't stick around to prove it. Cepero was good because of her size but I was never super crazy about her actual setting talent. It definitely wasn't bad, I just didn't think she was phenomal. She did win NPOY though as a sophomore, which I think at the time was the only time a sophomore had done so. Had Metcalf actually played that year, she probably would've gotten the nod for npoy. I don't know. I agree to an extent but remember Cepero was a hitter that changed positions and won the NPOY the first year she set.That is very impressive. She really revolutionize the position of blocker/attacker from a setting position also. She made herself a tremendous threat as well as the hitters. She was much like Carlini but back in the day. Hardly like Carlini other than that they were both 6-2 and set. Cepero was a better blocker and attacker than Lauren, but Lauren was far and away a better setter than Cepero. Cepero only made 2nd team AA as a junior and couldn't get back to the Final Four as a senior with Holmquist and Pilakowski. Her setting was fine but never at an elite level. Not to downplay Nebraska's tremendous 34-0 season, but that year had to be one of the weakest ever in terms of talent in collegiate volleyball. The two best returning players from 99 both sat out much of the year (Logan and Metcalfe), and 90s powerhouses Florida, Stanford, Long Beach, and Penn State were not nearly as good after graduating huge classes. Not to mention Pacific losing a great class as well. The top teams were Nebraska (led by 3 sophomores), Hawaii led by sophomores and freshmen, USC led by their crop of freshmen, Wisconsin led by upperclassmen, and USC led by upperclassmen. Fast forward a year and almost every team in the top 5-10 is as good or significantly better than they were in 2000 (Nebraska, Long Beach, Stanford, USC, Arizona, Wisconsin, Florida, etc.) I dont think it is a fluke that Cepero went from POY to being a 2nd team AA setter once younger players developed and the competition became stiffer.
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Post by holidayhusker on Jan 10, 2019 16:32:40 GMT -5
I don't know. I agree to an extent but remember Cepero was a hitter that changed positions and won the NPOY the first year she set.That is very impressive. She really revolutionize the position of blocker/attacker from a setting position also. She made herself a tremendous threat as well as the hitters. She was much like Carlini but back in the day. Cepero revolutionized the setter position? You've been reading the Husker website, I see (except they used the term "reinvented".) Cepero was a good setter who was also tall and athletic. Hardly revolutionary, except that she played at Nebraska. LOL...no..it was all mine and I didn't look in the Husker archives. She in my opinion changed the setting position so that teams began to look at pure athletes that could also attack and block. volley...she wouldn't have won POY as a setter if she wasn't something special. Nice try.
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Post by holidayhusker on Jan 10, 2019 16:39:55 GMT -5
I don't know. I agree to an extent but remember Cepero was a hitter that changed positions and won the NPOY the first year she set.That is very impressive. She really revolutionize the position of blocker/attacker from a setting position also. She made herself a tremendous threat as well as the hitters. She was much like Carlini but back in the day. Hardly like Carlini other than that they were both 6-2 and set. Cepero was a better blocker and attacker than Lauren, but Lauren was far and away a better setter than Cepero. Cepero only made 2nd team AA as a junior and couldn't get back to the Final Four as a senior with Holmquist and Pilakowski. Her setting was fine but never at an elite level. Not to downplay Nebraska's tremendous 34-0 season, but that year had to be one of the weakest ever in terms of talent in collegiate volleyball. The two best returning players from 99 both sat out much of the year (Logan and Metcalfe), and 90s powerhouses Florida, Stanford, Long Beach, and Penn State were not nearly as good after graduating huge classes. Not to mention Pacific losing a great class as well. The top teams were Nebraska (led by 3 sophomores), Hawaii led by sophomores and freshmen, USC led by their crop of freshmen, Wisconsin led by upperclassmen, and USC led by upperclassmen. Fast forward a year and almost every team in the top 5-10 is as good or significantly better than they were in 2000 (Nebraska, Long Beach, Stanford, USC, Arizona, Wisconsin, Florida, etc.) I dont think it is a fluke that Cepero went from POY to being a 2nd team AA setter once younger players developed and the competition became stiffer. nice little speech but....Cepero her sophomore year was a phenom and their record proved that. She was frustrating to coaches because she had issues her following seasons and never achieved or played at the level she did as a sophomore. If you want to say the achievement was due to poor compeitition be my guest but...despite Carlini's talent what is the best she finished with decent talent.
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Post by volleyguy on Jan 10, 2019 16:41:31 GMT -5
Cepero revolutionized the setter position? You've been reading the Husker website, I see (except they used the term "reinvented".) Cepero was a good setter who was also tall and athletic. Hardly revolutionary, except that she played at Nebraska. LOL...no..it was all mine and I didn't look in the Husker archives. She in my opinion changed the setting position so that teams began to look at pure athletes that could also attack and block. volley...she wouldn't have won POY as a setter if she wasn't something special. Nice try. It's even worse that you came up with it all by yourself. She was a key player on a National Championship team. It's not a surprise that she won NPOY and I said nothing to suggest that she wasn't worthy in that particular year. Her impact on the setter position is a different matter altogether. Her sophomore season turned out to be her best one.
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Post by holidayhusker on Jan 10, 2019 16:44:12 GMT -5
LOL...no..it was all mine and I didn't look in the Husker archives. She in my opinion changed the setting position so that teams began to look at pure athletes that could also attack and block. volley...she wouldn't have won POY as a setter if she wasn't something special. Nice try. It's even worse that you came up with it all by yourself. She was a key player on a National Championship team. It's not a surprise that she won NPOY and I said nothing to suggest that she wasn't worthy in that particular year. Her impact on the setter position is a different matter altogether. Her sophomore season turned out to be her best one. She changed the game whether you like it or not. Coaches started looking for big, athletic players who could block the left side as well as set. They also began looking for setters that could score at will. Her sophomore season as I addressed in the previous post was her best . if she could have kept her head on straight she would have been lights out successful.
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