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Post by mln59 on Feb 7, 2019 7:03:45 GMT -5
So, here's an example of why a real live teacher is necessary. Just from my knowledge of individual words, I self-crafted the following: "Where is his younger brother?" and doing a one-to-one correspondence of words, I translated it as: "Nar shi ta de didi ma?" (I left out tones in this post.) I tried to do a literal translation. When I asked a Chinese friend of mine, she said she had no idea what the hell I was saying. Like all languages, you can't always do a literal translation. One-to-one correspondence doesn't always work. There's a way to ask that question but you can't do it the way I did. In Spanish, if you want to ask someone what his name is, you don't ask, "What is your name?" Instead, you say, "How are you called?" or "How do you call yourself?" or your friend was messing with you |
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Post by Wolfgang on Feb 10, 2019 18:10:58 GMT -5
So, I know BoPoMoFo -- the Taiwan-based Mandarin pronunciation system. With BoPoMoFo, I should be able to pronounce 99% of all characters out there -- provided they show the BoPoMoFo symbols. I'm starting with children's books.
Having said that, I'm still terrible at pronunciation. A lot of weird stuff like pronouncing "j" while smiling and your teeth clenched and your tongue flattened against the back of said teeth. WTF?!?!
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Post by XAsstCoach on Feb 10, 2019 23:27:25 GMT -5
So, here's an example of why a real live teacher is necessary. Just from my knowledge of individual words, I self-crafted the following: "Where is his younger brother?" and doing a one-to-one correspondence of words, I translated it as: "Nar shi ta de didi ma?" (I left out tones in this post.) I tried to do a literal translation. When I asked a Chinese friend of mine, she said she had no idea what the hell I was saying. Like all languages, you can't always do a literal translation. One-to-one correspondence doesn't always work. There's a way to ask that question but you can't do it the way I did. In Spanish, if you want to ask someone what his name is, you don't ask, "What is your name?" Instead, you say, "How are you called?" or "How do you call yourself?" or your friend was messing with you No, not messing with him. If Wolfgang said “Nar shi ta de didi?”, he’d be asking “Which is his (or her, depending on the radical 她 or 他) younger brother?” The “ma” was unnecessary. 哪是他的弟弟，哪是她的弟弟 If he is asking “Where is his younger brother?”, should be “Ta de didi zai nar?” 他的弟弟在哪 Something about Chinese grammar that you cannot do a 1 on 1 literal translation. Forget what it was, but it doesn’t work like that. |
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Post by mln59 on Feb 11, 2019 9:03:15 GMT -5
or your friend was messing with you No, not messing with him. If Wolfgang said “Nar shi ta de didi?”, he’d be asking “Which is his (or her, depending on the radical 她 or 他) younger brother?” The “ma” was unnecessary. 哪是他的弟弟，哪是她的弟弟 If he is asking “Where is his younger brother?”, should be “Ta de didi zai nar?” 他的弟弟在哪 Something about Chinese grammar that you cannot do a 1 on 1 literal translation. Forget what it was, but it doesn’t work like that. or you're in on it as well. |
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Post by Wolfgang on Feb 14, 2019 14:34:25 GMT -5
So, I can read 99.999999% of all Chinese characters out there in the world -- so long as the BoPoMoFo pronunciation guides are also shown. Of course, I have no idea what those characters mean. Nevertheless, this has been a very empowering experience. Just 2 weeks of study and I can read out loud all Chinese characters. ALL!
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Post by Wolfgang on Feb 19, 2019 2:19:14 GMT -5
I'm really proud of myself.
I think I may have to find a Chinese conversation partner or someone who can correct all my tone mistakes.
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Post by Steve vb on Feb 28, 2019 23:46:49 GMT -5
I'm really proud of myself. I think I may have to find a Chinese conversation partner or someone who can correct all my tone mistakes. I studied Chinese in China for quite a few years. My suggestions (that I wish I would have realized earlier) are: 1. Concentrate on speaking and listening and be able to recognize Chinese characters. Reading is infinitely faster to pick up than writing because it is much easier to recognize an image than to have to recreate an image. 2. Become very familiar with pinyin. Chinese children learn pinyin before Chinese characters. When writing on smart phones or computers, Chinese people input using pinyin and then select the correct Chinese character. 3. Learn phrases instead of single words. 4. Write simple sentences using Chinese words that you already know, then read the sentences, then record yourself speaking those sentences. 5. Take advantage of free Chinese lessons on Youtube. Mandarin Corner is a good one in my opinion. The owner of that site is pretty inspiring. 6. Accept that learning a foreign language is a process that does not have a final ending. During the first year, it is very discouraging. Push through the first year and it will become much easier after that. |
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Post by Steve vb on Mar 1, 2019 10:01:01 GMT -5
I studied Chinese in China for quite a few years. My suggestions (that I wish I would have realized earlier) are: 1. Concentrate on speaking and listening and be able to recognize Chinese characters. Reading is infinitely faster to pick up than writing because it is much easier to recognize an image than to have to recreate an image. 2. Become very familiar with pinyin. Chinese children learn pinyin before Chinese characters. When writing on smart phones or computers, Chinese people input using pinyin and then select the correct Chinese character. 3. Learn phrases instead of single words. 4. Write simple sentences using Chinese words that you already know, then read the sentences, then record yourself speaking those sentences. 5. Take advantage of free Chinese lessons on Youtube. Mandarin Corner is a good one in my opinion. The owner of that site is pretty inspiring. 6. Accept that learning a foreign language is a process that does not have a final ending. During the first year, it is very discouraging. Push through the first year and it will become much easier after that. Great advice! My biggest problem is the incorporation of tones. I can remember the pinyin words but always forget the proper tones. If the bopomofo is provided, I can read anything. Literally anything. I kid you not. Of course, I’m reading the bopomofo and not the actual Chinese characters. I will have to take a look at mandarin corner on YouTube. I’ve been using 3 apps, 1 book of the most common Chinese characters (to make my own flash cards), and a Chinese children’s book to read bopomofo out loud. As for the tones, I believe the key is speaking out loud. On sites like Mandarin Corner, you can repeat each phrase or word and that repetition is eventually helpful. |
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Post by Steve vb on Mar 2, 2019 20:06:26 GMT -5
As for the tones, I believe the key is speaking out loud. On sites like Mandarin Corner, you can repeat each phrase or word and that repetition is eventually helpful. I took a look a Mandarin Corner. It's a very useful youtube channel. The only thing I don't like about it is that it uses Simplified Chinese characters, while I like the traditional. But that's okay. I've been making my own flashcards and instead of using the Chinese characters they show me, I look up the real traditional ones on another site. But I've been using Mandarin Corner for my base of Chinese phrases, beginning with the Sentence Starters. I've been watching and repeating the phrases after the teacher (in the video) and then I proceed to make my own flashcards from the lessons. I also write down the bopomofo pronunciation guides for each word/phrase by using a bopomofo site. Hmm, traditional Chinese characters... You DO like challenges. I've heard that "FluentU" might teach using traditional characters. Here's their website: www.fluentu.com/blog/chinese/2017/07/19/chinese-online-course/ |
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Post by holidayhusker on Mar 2, 2019 20:14:31 GMT -5
Je pense que le lanquage français est magnifique.
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Post by Wolfgang on Mar 4, 2019 1:36:00 GMT -5
The funniest thing about learning a foreign language is that, from time to time, my IQ drops several points. For example, I know that in my own language, English, synonyms and idioms exist. And yet, when I'm studying Chinese and encounter a different word or way of saying the same thing, I get a bit angry because, you know, synonyms shouldn't exist.
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Post by XAsstCoach on Mar 4, 2019 2:11:06 GMT -5
The funniest thing about learning a foreign language is that, from time to time, my IQ drops several points. For example, I know that in my own language, English, synonyms and idioms exist. And yet, when I'm studying Chinese and encounter a different word or way of saying the same thing, I get a bit angry because, you know, synonyms shouldn't exist. Living and working in China for the past 12-13 years, I find at times that it may be easier to express what I want to say in Chinese rather than English. Unfortunately, when this happens its usually around my English speaking customers. |
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Post by Wolfgang on Mar 5, 2019 16:31:12 GMT -5
So, I've only been studying Mandarin Chinese for the past 3 weeks, but pretty intensely. I'm obviously not fluent and probably only know 0.000001% of what a five year old kid knows, but when I watched some videos of Chinese people talking, I've been able to make out words and phrases here and there. It's a very satisfying feeling.
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Post by Wolfgang on Mar 7, 2019 0:56:15 GMT -5
My wife says that, for some reason, whenever I speak Chinese during my study sessions, I sound like a girl. Higher pitch. I told her I can’t help it. All those tones. And also, probably some lack of self-confidence.
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Post by rockhopper on Mar 7, 2019 10:18:46 GMT -5
Here's my Chinese language regimen: 1. On the toilet: A Chinese learning app that I use on my iPad. 2. Early afternoon: A How-to-Speak-Chinese book. I create flash cards. Refer to flash cards at least once per hour throughout the day. 3. Late afternoon: A How-to-Read-and-Write-Chinese book. I create flash cards. Refer to flash cards at least once per hour throughout the day. In between, read a book (currently: Oryx and Crake (by Margaret Atwood), exercise, and play video games. Why don't you start playing Chinese video games? |
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