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Post by vbcoltrane on Mar 31, 2021 23:19:00 GMT -5
Can't believe the Badgers will back into the championship like this. Sh*f Eh, it's wacky Covid year, so why not? They've won every match available to them and they're a good team. So be it. And, I'm not a Wisky fan - at all (from MN, NW undergrad, IL law school).
I would never put any onus on Wisconsin to not accept the championship. It is what it is.
If anything, it was up to the conference to decide, early, that they wouldn't award a regular season championship -- as soon as they saw that Covid would affect equal schedules. The record books easily could have said "2020 - No conference champion crowned due to unequal schedules in light of Covid pandemic."
But, the B1G front office didn't do that. So, there has to be a champion and it just happens to be Wisconsin.
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Post by notwvb on Apr 1, 2021 6:35:26 GMT -5
Can't believe the Badgers will back into the championship like this. Sh*f JK, Badger fans. 13-0 = 11-0 > 14-2. |
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Post by bprtbone on Apr 1, 2021 6:40:39 GMT -5
B1G Standings - 4/1/21| Team | Record | | Wisconsin | 13-0 | | Nebraska | 14-2 | | Minnesota | 13-2 | | Ohio State | 15-3 | | Purdue | 13-5 | | Penn State | 9-5 | | Illinois | 6-10 | | Michigan | 4-7 | | Indiana | 5-15 | | Northwestern | 3-9 | | Michigan State | 3-10 | | Iowa | 4-14 | | Maryland | 4-14 | | Rutgers | 4-14 |
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Post by gibbyb1 on Apr 1, 2021 7:07:45 GMT -5
B1G Standings - 4/1/21| Team | Record | | Wisconsin | 13-0 | | Nebraska | 14-2 | | Minnesota | 13-2 | | Ohio State | 15-3 | | Purdue | 13-5 | | Penn State | 9-5 | | Illinois | 6-10 | | Michigan | 4-7 | | Indiana | 5-15 | | Northwestern | 3-9 | | Michigan State | 3-10 | | Iowa | 4-14 | | Maryland | 4-14 | | Rutgers | 4-14 |
Does this include the two matches Wisconsin just had forfeited to them? |
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Post by gibbyb1 on Apr 1, 2021 7:20:46 GMT -5
Can't believe the Badgers will back into the championship like this. Sh*f Putting aside that none of "all this" is in anyone's control, and that the badgers were sickened by an MSU squad that was infected but didn't know it, everybody else in conference has beaten everybody else up. If one team had risen above the rest, I might understand your point. But given that hasn't exactly happened, the scenarios by which the badgers would have given up their lead, given the schedule, are pretty unlikely. Not impossible, but not particularly likely. So I'm not sure the badgers "backed in," as much as every other team "backed away." Given the outcomes before us, all the badgers would have needed to do to have a share of the title was to split with PSU and NEB. They could have lost their remaining game against Minn and it wouldn't matter. I think it's likely given recent history (but not certain!) that they would have been able to split. Of course, PSU and Minn have also been affected by COVID, and by injuries, but so have the badgers. They haven't had Hilley against Minn, or Haggerty and Civita for long stretches. They have started second string outsides against the illini. The badgers, nor any other team created this situation, but they had to live with it. The rules can only go so far to normalize it. I say, on to the tournament! Which I pray is not affected by these problems. I like Wisconsin. I believe they had the best team in the league and I picked them to win the league and believe they were the most likely to win it if a full schedule was played. The league needs a winner to declare automatic bid, by virtue of their policy as to how to decide Wisconsin will get that bid. There are some realities however that would be impossible to overlook no matter who it involved, or what team you are a fan of. NONE of these realities were in the control of Wisconsin. The biggie of course is that their 5 toughest challenges were cancelled. 5 matches vs Nebraska, PSU, and Minnesota can’t be overstated. If you asked Wisconsin to drop the 5 matches that would prevent them from winning the title, it would be those 5. Also two of the wins they do have were forfeited to them. They’d have won both, but still. In my opinion Wisconsin should be the team to get the automatic bid because of how they said they would determine that. No team should be considered a conference champion in my opinion. I have zero issues with Wisconsin or their fans if they choose to celebrate this as a conference championship. I believe coach Sheffield would say “it is what it is, and we did everything we could within what we had control of” |
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Post by vbkahuna on Apr 1, 2021 7:27:01 GMT -5
B1G Standings - 4/1/21| Team | Record | | Wisconsin | 13-0 | | Nebraska | 14-2 | | Minnesota | 13-2 | | Ohio State | 15-3 | | Purdue | 13-5 | | Penn State | 9-5 | | Illinois | 6-10 | | Michigan | 4-7 | | Indiana | 5-15 | | Northwestern | 3-9 | | Michigan State | 3-10 | | Iowa | 4-14 | | Maryland | 4-14 | | Rutgers | 4-14 |
Does this include the two matches Wisconsin just had forfeited to them? Yes, it does. What's interesting is what it DOESN'T include: Canceled: 2 matches against Nebraska Canceled: 1 match against Minnesota (Wisconsin won 3-1 in the one they did play) Canceled: 2 matches against Penn State Look, I agree that Wisconsin has a terrific team... but the title for "Big 10 Champion" this year should have a big fat asterisk next to it when you got it without playing those specific 5 matches. (Sorry, gibbyb1, I didn't see your post as I was writing mine. Our thoughts are identical.) |
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Post by gibbyb1 on Apr 1, 2021 7:36:21 GMT -5
Does this include the two matches Wisconsin just had forfeited to them? Yes, it does. What's interesting is what it DOESN'T include: Canceled: 2 matches against Nebraska Canceled: 1 match against Minnesota (Wisconsin won 3-1 in the one they did play) Canceled: 2 matches against Penn State Look, I agree that Wisconsin has a terrific team... but the title for "Big 10 Champion" this year should have a big fat asterisk next to it when you got it without playing those specific 5 matches. (Sorry, gibbyb1, I didn't see your post as I was writing mine. Our thoughts are identical.) It’s a little inconceivable to me that someone would take issue with my post or see it as putting Wisconsin down. Someone will. |
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Post by bprtbone on Apr 1, 2021 7:53:18 GMT -5
Does this include the two matches Wisconsin just had forfeited to them? Yes, it does. What's interesting is what it DOESN'T include: Canceled: 2 matches against Nebraska Canceled: 1 match against Minnesota (Wisconsin won 3-1 in the one they did play) Canceled: 2 matches against Penn State I'm assuming those matches were canceled because of COVID reasons; so they are not forfeits and do not count towards the standings. |
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Post by vbkahuna on Apr 1, 2021 7:54:54 GMT -5
Actually, I find the Badger fans on Volley Talk to be among the most rational here, but what you and I said had to be said. Yes, it's a weird year, but the cancelation of those 5 matches definitely tarnishes the "champion" title. You earn the respect of that title when you beat the best of the rest in your league, not by the lucky accident of not having played them.
One thing I do see as a potential hazard for Wisconsin as a consequence of not having played those matches is that they will not be as battle-hardened going into the playoffs. Yes, they are the legitimate favorite based on overall talent, but may not be as sharp and toughened as they would have been if they had played those matches. Very similar to being an excellent unbeaten team from a much weaker conference.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2021 8:06:37 GMT -5
John Cook said they had bigger goals than a B1G Championship... seems like VT needs a little bit of that mantra lol
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Post by bprtbone on Apr 1, 2021 8:23:36 GMT -5
What's curious to me is who actually asked for this, and why now? Is Northwestern doing the honorable thing by admitting that the cancellations were not COVID related and offering the forfeits? (At the time, it was stated that the postponements were mutually agreed upon) Did the conference request and require this? Did one of the coaches push for this? Who benefits most from this development?
It doesn't sound like something Sheff would have pushed for and it doesn't materially improve Wisconsin's position, unless you believe the "conference championship" has meaning this season. They are very likely going to go undefeated anyways. But for Indiana the two "wins" vaults them out of the basement of the B1G and saves them from an embarrassing historical footnote. Would Aird be this petty?
ETA: On the other hand, Wisconsin was quick to post the two wins on their record while Indiana is still showing 3-15. Maybe it was Sheff?
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Post by gibbyb1 on Apr 1, 2021 8:31:47 GMT -5
Actually, I find the Badger fans on Volley Talk to be among the most rational here, but what you and I said had to be said. Yes, it's a weird year, but the cancelation of those 5 matches definitely tarnishes the "champion" title. You earn the respect of that title when you beat the best of the rest in your league, not by the lucky accident of not having played them. One thing I do see as a potential hazard for Wisconsin as a consequence of not having played those matches is that they will not be as battle-hardened going into the playoffs. Yes, they are the legitimate favorite based on overall talent, but may not be as sharp and toughened as they would have been if they had played those matches. Very similar to being an excellent unbeaten team from a much weaker conference. On the whole I believe badger fans on Here to be reasonable as well, but there’s always an outlier. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2021 9:57:26 GMT -5
What's curious to me is who actually asked for this, and why now? Is Northwestern doing the honorable thing by admitting that the cancellations were not COVID related and offering the forfeits? (At the time, it was stated that the postponements were mutually agreed upon) Did the conference request and require this? Did one of the coaches push for this? Who benefits most from this development? It doesn't sound like something Sheff would have pushed for and it doesn't materially improve Wisconsin's position, unless you believe the "conference championship" has meaning this season. They are very likely going to go undefeated anyways. But for Indiana the two "wins" vaults them out of the basement of the B1G and saves them from an embarrassing historical footnote. Would Aird be this petty? ETA: On the other hand, Wisconsin was quick to post the two wins on their record while Indiana is still showing 3-15. Maybe it was Sheff? It wasn't exactly a secret that Northwestern was canceling for non-COVID reasons. Not only did the Wisconsin beat writer say as much, Northwestern players said so. It doesn't have to have been anyone asking for anything. If anyone did ask for a forfeit, I am guessing it had everything to do with annoyance/frustration with Northwestern over their non-COVID cancelations. |
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Post by Rutgers fan on Apr 1, 2021 10:04:32 GMT -5
What’s the reason for the canceling?
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Post by haterade on Apr 1, 2021 10:10:18 GMT -5
What's curious to me is who actually asked for this, and why now? Is Northwestern doing the honorable thing by admitting that the cancellations were not COVID related and offering the forfeits? (At the time, it was stated that the postponements were mutually agreed upon) Did the conference request and require this? Did one of the coaches push for this? Who benefits most from this development? It doesn't sound like something Sheff would have pushed for and it doesn't materially improve Wisconsin's position, unless you believe the "conference championship" has meaning this season. They are very likely going to go undefeated anyways. But for Indiana the two "wins" vaults them out of the basement of the B1G and saves them from an embarrassing historical footnote. Would Aird be this petty? ETA: On the other hand, Wisconsin was quick to post the two wins on their record while Indiana is still showing 3-15. Maybe it was Sheff? It’s probably not that complicated.... All these coaches have bonuses for winning the conference championship. If you know NW didn’t cancel because of Covid and the two extra wins makes it less likely the B1G says you haven’t played enough. Send an email, take the Ws and the $ |
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