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Post by newbeach on Feb 12, 2020 12:33:55 GMT -5
I thought it would be useful if there was a thread to discuss the 2020 NCAA Beach Volleyball season.I realize there are some specific team threads, but this thread can be used to discuss competition, post matches, results, and any other relevant topics that is not specific to one team.
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Post by newbeach on Feb 12, 2020 12:53:44 GMT -5
I have a question regarding how players are listed as freshman, red-shirt freshman, graduate student etc. Can anyone explain it to me? For example, Hailey Harward is listed as a GS. She played beach for 3 seasons at Long Beach (though I believe, she didn't play much last year, if at all due to injury?), and is now a graduate student at USC. Is this because she finished her indoor eligibility, and does it have anything to do with her finishing her degree? I know you have 5 years to play 4. Also, I get it when a player transfers in their senior year (indoor) and then plays beach at another school in the same school year (e.g. 2019/2020) the player would be listed as a senior. This player could then have another year as a graduate student (since technically they would still be within the 5 year maximum overall, and in their second year of beach)? I also am sometimes confused when players are listed as a red-shirt freshman, for example? Are they a red-shirt sophomore afterwards, or just a sophomore? Do they forego a graduate season, or are they still entitled to "5 years to play 4"? Also, I have a question on Tia Miric being listed as a junior for Cal Poly. I know this is her third year at Cal Poly, so that makes sense. However, she also played a year of indoor at Western University in Canada prior to going to Cal Poly. westernmustangs.ca/sports/womens-volleyball/roster/tia-miric/22768Does this just mean that she is done next season and would not eligible for a graduate year? I may be misinformed. Does anyone have the definitive answer?
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Post by eyelander on Feb 12, 2020 15:01:33 GMT -5
I have a question regarding how players are listed as freshman, red-shirt freshman, graduate student etc. Can anyone explain it to me? For example, Hailey Harward is listed as a GS. She played beach for 3 seasons at Long Beach (though I believe, she didn't play much last year, if at all due to injury?), and is now a graduate student at USC. Is this because she finished her indoor eligibility, and does it have anything to do with her finishing her degree? I know you have 5 years to play 4. Also, I get it when a player transfers in their senior year (indoor) and then plays beach at another school in the same school year (e.g. 2019/2020) the player would be listed as a senior. This player could then have another year as a graduate student (since technically they would still be within the 5 year maximum overall, and in their second year of beach)? I also am sometimes confused when players are listed as a red-shirt freshman, for example? Are they a red-shirt sophomore afterwards, or just a sophomore? Do they forego a graduate season, or are they still entitled to "5 years to play 4"? Also, I have a question on Tia Miric being listed as a junior for Cal Poly. I know this is her third year at Cal Poly, so that makes sense. However, she also played a year of indoor at Western University in Canada prior to going to Cal Poly. westernmustangs.ca/sports/womens-volleyball/roster/tia-miric/22768Does this just mean that she is done next season and would not eligible for a graduate year? I may be misinformed. Does anyone have the definitive answer? Not sure if this will help regarding Tia Miric, but when Carly Kan transferred time Hawai’i for beach, she had already completed four years of indoor with Missouri. She played 2 years of beach here, listed as a junior her 1st year here and a senior her 2nd. Maybe it’s because beach follows indoor and although it’s in a different calendar year, it’s still within the same school year?
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Post by Leftrightapproach on Feb 12, 2020 17:08:30 GMT -5
I have a question regarding how players are listed as freshman, red-shirt freshman, graduate student etc. Can anyone explain it to me? For example, Hailey Harward is listed as a GS. She played beach for 3 seasons at Long Beach (though I believe, she didn't play much last year, if at all due to injury?), and is now a graduate student at USC. Is this because she finished her indoor eligibility, and does it have anything to do with her finishing her degree? I know you have 5 years to play 4. Also, I get it when a player transfers in their senior year (indoor) and then plays beach at another school in the same school year (e.g. 2019/2020) the player would be listed as a senior. This player could then have another year as a graduate student (since technically they would still be within the 5 year maximum overall, and in their second year of beach)? I also am sometimes confused when players are listed as a red-shirt freshman, for example? Are they a red-shirt sophomore afterwards, or just a sophomore? Do they forego a graduate season, or are they still entitled to "5 years to play 4"? Also, I have a question on Tia Miric being listed as a junior for Cal Poly. I know this is her third year at Cal Poly, so that makes sense. However, she also played a year of indoor at Western University in Canada prior to going to Cal Poly. westernmustangs.ca/sports/womens-volleyball/roster/tia-miric/22768Does this just mean that she is done next season and would not eligible for a graduate year? I may be misinformed. Does anyone have the definitive answer? Not sure if this will help regarding Tia Miric, but when Carly Kan transferred time Hawai’i for beach, she had already completed four years of indoor with Missouri. She played 2 years of beach here, listed as a junior her 1st year here and a senior her 2nd. Maybe it’s because beach follows indoor and although it’s in a different calendar year, it’s still within the same school year? It is based on degree/eligibility. Harward is a grad student because she's completed her Bachelors and is going for a Masters degree, Kan was still completing undergraduate studies therefore a Junior/Senior.
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Post by newbeach on Feb 13, 2020 16:28:09 GMT -5
Not sure if this will help regarding Tia Miric, but when Carly Kan transferred time Hawai’i for beach, she had already completed four years of indoor with Missouri. She played 2 years of beach here, listed as a junior her 1st year here and a senior her 2nd. Maybe it’s because beach follows indoor and although it’s in a different calendar year, it’s still within the same school year? It is based on degree/eligibility. Harward is a grad student because she's completed her Bachelors and is going for a Masters degree, Kan was still completing undergraduate studies therefore a Junior/Senior. Tia was just an example, but I am curious overall at how athletes are classed. Yes, for Carly Kan she transferred to Hawaii in the same school year, after her indoor eligibility was done. She started beach the following semester. Therefore, she was classed as a junior, and then the following year was her senior year, but then was classed as a graduate student, presumably because she had entered her masters program? Tia on the other hand, used one year of eligibility in indoor a couple of years prior to her going to Cal Poly and playing beach. So technically, she was a freshman in the sport of beach volleyball (even though it was really her sophomore year)? I know of another player that was listed as a grad student, even though they were an undergrad still, but they took a semester off (didn't attend Fall camp)? It makes sense for Harward to be listed as a grad student even though she is technically in her fourth year with the sport because she is in graduate studies? Otherwise, she would be listed as a senior? It gets confusing when you have transfer players, red-shirts, two different sports, etc. Can anyone else shed some light on this?
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Post by johnbar on Feb 13, 2020 23:08:41 GMT -5
I am skeptical that a undergraduate (with no baccalaureate) could be listed as grad student. Sounds like a mistake. Taking time off shouldn't be a factor. Please provide details.
Yes, since Harward is a graduate student she is listed as a graduate student. Years in a sport has nothing to do with it.
Edited to add: I think the confusion is because rosters are not consistent in distinguishing between an SA's academic year and the number of years of eligibility they have left.
So a red-shirt sophomore would have two more year of eligibility, even though academically they are a junior.
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Post by sonofdogman on Feb 14, 2020 14:19:29 GMT -5
I am not aware of any official NCAA policy on how class is listed in media. Unless I'm mistaken about that, there isn't any universal answer - different schools may list things in different ways, although I concur that listing anyone as a grad student who hasn't already earned a bachelor's degree would seem to be erroneous.
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Post by burbank55 on Feb 15, 2020 0:10:58 GMT -5
Other possibilities... Someone could be getting a second Bachelor’s degree rather than a Master’s. Also, you could be an undergrad fall semester for indoor and graduate at the end of fall to start a graduate degree during spring semester while playing beach.
I know for USC, Alexandra Poletto was a two year Grad player because she only played 3 years of indoor. I think Belen Castillo might be in a similar situation this year.
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Post by newbeach on Feb 15, 2020 18:02:30 GMT -5
Other possibilities... Someone could be getting a second Bachelor’s degree rather than a Master’s. Also, you could be an undergrad fall semester for indoor and graduate at the end of fall to start a graduate degree during spring semester while playing beach. I know for USC, Alexandra Poletto was a two year Grad player because she only played 3 years of indoor. I think Belen Castillo might be in a similar situation this year. Didn't Alex play four years indoor for CSU? She was injured in her senior year, but definitely played matches. Then, she transferred to USC in her senior year after she finished her indoor. She must have graduated early I am guessing because she was considered at GS instead of still a senior? I remember being confused at Alex's designation as a GS for two seasons (partly because I know Kan was not designated as a GS in her second year at UH). So, while I am not hearing anything definitive, the consensus seems to that a player's designation depends on whether or not they are an undergraduate or post-graduate studies (at least when it comes to the GS designation for a player). In Tia's case, how does that work?Is it similar to a red-shirt player? Even though she played a season of indoor at a Canadian University prior to Cal Poly, was she designated a freshman because beach volleyball is a different sport? Do some players get 6 years, or is it 5 years in total only? Also, for a red-shirt player, do they get 4 years after they red-shirt a year? And if so, are they a senior or GS in the 5th year. Or, again, (assuming indoor eligibility doesn't make a difference) does that depend on if they where they are with their academic studies?
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Post by badbunny on Feb 15, 2020 18:16:37 GMT -5
Other possibilities... Someone could be getting a second Bachelor’s degree rather than a Master’s. Also, you could be an undergrad fall semester for indoor and graduate at the end of fall to start a graduate degree during spring semester while playing beach. I know for USC, Alexandra Poletto was a two year Grad player because she only played 3 years of indoor. I think Belen Castillo might be in a similar situation this year. Didn't Alex play four years indoor for CSU? She was injured in her senior year, but definitely played matches. Then, she transferred to USC in her senior year after she finished her indoor. She must have graduated early I am guessing because she was considered at GS instead of still a senior? I remember being confused at Alex's designation as a GS for two seasons (partly because I know Kan was not designated as a GS in her second year at UH). So, while I am not hearing anything definitive, the consensus seems to that a player's designation depends on whether or not they are an undergraduate or post-graduate studies (at least when it comes to the GS designation for a player). In Tia's case, how does that work?Is it similar to a red-shirt player? Even though she played a season of indoor at a Canadian University prior to Cal Poly, was she designated a freshman because beach volleyball is a different sport? Do some players get 6 years, or is it 5 years in total only? Also, for a red-shirt player, do they get 4 years after they red-shirt a year? And if so, are they a senior or GS in the 5th year. Or, again, (assuming indoor eligibility doesn't make a difference) does that depend on if they where they are with their academic studies? Once enrolled full-time in college (any level) the clock begins. Allotted 5 years to use up 4 years of eligibility in one or multiple sports. Redshirt seasons still use up a year on the 5 year clock. In rare cases the NCAA will grant a 6th year of eligibility (i.e., multiple season ending injuries, health related complications, family matters, etc).
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Post by newbeach on Feb 15, 2020 18:29:52 GMT -5
Okay, that is what I thought as far as "5 years to play 4"! Still a little confused though in what some players are designated. I am not sure that it matters if someone is a GS or a senior, really (so long as they are within the 5 years in total once the clock begins), but it can be confusing for the fans!
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Post by badbunny on Feb 15, 2020 18:42:42 GMT -5
Not sure if there’s uniformity in how schools list that information. Typically, if they’re registered for graduate courses they will be listed as GS regardless if it’s year 4 or 5. NCAA “full time student” status / requirements are a little different for undergrad vs grad. Don’t quote me on this b/c things may have changed but it used to be undergrad had to be enrolled (and passing) in 12 credit hours to be full time / eligible — except for their graduating semester when you’re allowed to take 9 credit hours. Grad students (I believe) are considered full time with 9 credit hours — could be different for grad student athletes in which case it would be 12 except for graduating semester.
Typically if you see someone listed as a RS Junior that means they’re using their 3rd year of eligibility but most likely in their 4th year of classes (senior). Again, don’t think there’s uniformity in how schools are required to present this.
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Post by johnbar on Feb 15, 2020 19:12:41 GMT -5
In order to meet NCAA academic eligibility requirements, a "red-shirt senior", in her fifth year, pretty much has to have graduated and enrolled in grad school. That was the case for Inky in 2016.
I think you are more likely to see the "grad student" designation when it is a graduate transfer. I.e., they completed their degree at one school, but use any remaining eligibility at another school (like Madeleine Gates at used her fourth year at Stanford this past year). Or Brittany Howard who used her four years indoor at Stanford, but still had a year of beach to use her (during her fifth year) at Pepperdine.
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Post by newbeach on Feb 15, 2020 23:11:35 GMT -5
Thank you, everyone! Without a required uniformity, it leads to some confusion, but I think I have a better understanding now! johnbar I didn't realize a fifth-year red-shirt senior (as in Inky's case) they would have to be enrolled in grad school, but that makes sense!
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Post by sonofdogman on Feb 16, 2020 8:21:41 GMT -5
Thank you, everyone! Without a required uniformity, it leads to some confusion, but I think I have a better understanding now! johnbar I didn't realize a fifth-year red-shirt senior (as in Inky's case) they would have to be enrolled in grad school, but that makes sense! There are plenty of fifth year seniors who are still undergrads. Maybe not so much in volleyball, but this is not a rule. EDIT: As an example in beach vb, at LSU Toni Rodriguez played indoor only, sat out a season due to a injury, and completed her 4th year of indoor eligibility in her 5th fall on campus. She then joined the beach squad for the first time last spring. She was listed as a senior for both teams during her 5th year and was indeed an undergraduate. She actually missed multiple seasons due to significant injuries, petitioned for, and was granted another year. She graduated, is enrolled in grad school, and is listed now as a grad student for her 6th year on campus.
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