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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2020 14:23:43 GMT -5
Well for one their coaches advocated hard, players were also voicing their desire to play. You do t think their coaches weren’t pushing hard to play? Heck they all made public statements advocating to play. What are parents going to do that coaches and AD’s couldn’t and actually did? As for transparency, this wasn’t good or clear enough???”The health, the safety, the wellness — both physical and mental — of our student-athletes was going to be at the top of our list,” Big Ten Commissioner Kevin Warren said in an interview on Big Ten Network after the conference’s announcement. “As things evolved, you look at the numbers of cases that are spiking, the numbers of deaths — not only in our country and our states where many of our schools are located but worldwide. The point is that was happening 5 days earlier when scheduled were released. Nothing new happened, except the NCAA stating schools cannot require signing of COVID waivers. An explaination is definitely warranted. One really important 'new' thing happened (and I've posted about it a lot); the medical advice changed, specifically in regards to myocarditis. 5 B1G athletes who had COVID were diagnosed with the condition. If you want one factor that changed things, that was it.
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Post by n00b on Aug 16, 2020 14:29:24 GMT -5
The point is that was happening 5 days earlier when scheduled were released. Nothing new happened, except the NCAA stating schools cannot require signing of COVID waivers. An explaination is definitely warranted. One really important 'new' thing happened (and I've posted about it a lot); the medical advice changed, specifically in regards to myocarditis. 5 B1G athletes who had COVID were diagnosed with the condition. If you want one factor that changed things, that was it. It might be, but the Big Ten commissioner denied that it was the deciding factor, internationally turning to vague language. 'There has been a lot of discussion about myocarditis, so there has been discussion as of late," Warren said. "That's not the primary reason. All of those items from a medical standpoint, you have to consider. "I know there's been a lot of discussion about that, but overall when it comes down to it, it's just the litany of things that created this state of uncertainty that we need more clarity on from a health, wellness and medical standpoint."
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2020 14:33:56 GMT -5
One really important 'new' thing happened (and I've posted about it a lot); the medical advice changed, specifically in regards to myocarditis. 5 B1G athletes who had COVID were diagnosed with the condition. If you want one factor that changed things, that was it. It might be, but the Big Ten commissioner denied that it was the deciding factor, internationally turning to vague language. 'There has been a lot of discussion about myocarditis, so there has been discussion as of late," Warren said. "That's not the primary reason. All of those items from a medical standpoint, you have to consider. "I know there's been a lot of discussion about that, but overall when it comes down to it, it's just the litany of things that created this state of uncertainty that we need more clarity on from a health, wellness and medical standpoint." Warren wouldn't give you a straight answer if you asked him if the sky was up... The question was, what changed in that window. The answer is, the focus on the heart issues (including, but not limited to, this: www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/29613946/former-florida-state-center-michael-ojo-27-dies-workout ).
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Post by vbcoltrane on Aug 16, 2020 14:34:02 GMT -5
Absurd. How could it be any more transparent??? The Big Ten needs to meet with and explain this to PARENTS? So embarrassing Absurd why, exactly? Professional athletes pay agents and/or lawyers to represent their interests. Through High school athletes have parents to advise them and protect their interests. Then, for the years they are college athletes, there is an attempt to bury the parents role and outlaw professional representation to isolate naive, inexperienced athletes fresh out of high school. Gee, I wonder why is it that college athletes get taken advantage of? Somebody needs to advocate for these players and demand some answers. Who else is going to do it? The players union they aren't allowed to have? The conferences and schools that are fighting to not share any revenue with them or to give them adequate healthcare? What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football."
I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them.
It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position.
And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"?
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Post by gibbyb1 on Aug 16, 2020 14:40:14 GMT -5
Absurd why, exactly? Professional athletes pay agents and/or lawyers to represent their interests. Through High school athletes have parents to advise them and protect their interests. Then, for the years they are college athletes, there is an attempt to bury the parents role and outlaw professional representation to isolate naive, inexperienced athletes fresh out of high school. Gee, I wonder why is it that college athletes get taken advantage of? Somebody needs to advocate for these players and demand some answers. Who else is going to do it? The players union they aren't allowed to have? The conferences and schools that are fighting to not share any revenue with them or to give them adequate healthcare? What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football."
I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them.
It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position.
And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"?
100 percent. Painful decision, not particularly difficult IMO. I hate it as a competitor, I’d hate it as a parent, but it requires zero explanation beyond what they did. I have a child who is a division 1 athlete I’m disappointed they didn’t get to compete in the spring but understood completely
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Post by gibbyb1 on Aug 16, 2020 14:45:15 GMT -5
New things happen everyday. You don’t think they were continuing to meet, discuss, review data 24/7 after announcing schedule? This pandemic has been incredibly fluid, thousands of decisions have been made, only to change days later. not to mention that since they released schedules, kids were going back to school, getting sick, research on myocarditis came out, and maybe most importantly It was ruled that the waivers schools were asking kids to sign, wouldn’t be valid. It was over when that happened. I can’t imagine anything needing LESS explanation than the cancelling of fall sports, not to mention that they actually did explain why. And I think the waiver piece is exactly why parents felt the need to get involved. Student athletes weren’t being treated as adults, capable of making health and safety decisions for themselves. So the university felt required to be the ones making parental decisions for athletes. And they obviously are going to be extremely conservative so they don’t get sued into oblivion. [/quote Decisions get made for us every day, adult or not. I see nothing unique here regarding these athletes. Reality reminder- 20 million people lost their jobs, not their season, their jobs that pay rent, feed kids........ it sucks for those athletes and us as fans, but this is small potatoes in the big scheme
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Post by brooselee on Aug 16, 2020 14:47:33 GMT -5
I really don’t see how the schools “owed” the parents any explanation other then one put out publicly. Schools are allowed to do what they feel is in their best interest. As long as there is no right violated and no one group is being discriminated(meaning only football, for example) schools/conferences are free to do what is best.
If the schools are concerned about the 5 years medical insurance thing, then they have the right to hold off and hope things get better. It is definitely not cheap to pay insurance for 100’s maybe even 1000’s of athletes after they leave school. Schools do not have to divulge this kind of concern to the public. Every business have concerns that are kept in house.
With schools having no money and now medical insurance added to the expense, it’s a pretty tough situation to deal with. That does not include the liability the school have to remedy if the athletes were to suffer career ending illness. Potential earning for some of theses players are in the 100 of millions.
I’m certain there will be parent out there that will say they want their kids to play and then turn around then sue the schools for letting their kids play. Schools are in a big loss/lose situation. The SEC/ACC/whomever else will be in a fight if they choose to play without waivers sign by the players.
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Post by n00b on Aug 16, 2020 14:51:00 GMT -5
What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football." I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them. It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position. And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"? 100 percent. Painful decision, not particularly difficult IMO. I hate it as a competitor, I’d hate it as a parent, but it requires zero explanation beyond what they did. I have a child who is a division 1 athlete I’m disappointed they didn’t get to compete in the spring but understood completely I think the only thing parents/players have a right to be upset about is that they waited so long that it became impractical to transfer to the SEC and play. Whether the system is right or wrong is a completely different discussion, but the current reality is that millions of dollars could be at stake while SEC athletes play, perform well, and improve their draft stock while the Big Ten sits out.
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Post by brooselee on Aug 16, 2020 15:27:21 GMT -5
Everybody is in a fluid situation....not just the athletes. Kids returning to class are in the same wait and see mode. Everybody with a job are also on edge on whether they will be let go. Many are taking pay cuts and reduced hours. The athletes are not in a situation unique to them . They are not the only on being hurt by all these uncertainties so they should not be making like they deserve special treatment.
What about students who needed one more semester to graduate from medical school? What about those who are close to graduating and now only online classes are offered and cannot fulfill the requirement with an online class. What about business being locked down ...reopened ...then lockdown again? These businesses are in constant state of uncertainty too.
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Post by oldnewbie on Aug 16, 2020 15:34:51 GMT -5
Absurd why, exactly? Professional athletes pay agents and/or lawyers to represent their interests. Through High school athletes have parents to advise them and protect their interests. Then, for the years they are college athletes, there is an attempt to bury the parents role and outlaw professional representation to isolate naive, inexperienced athletes fresh out of high school. Gee, I wonder why is it that college athletes get taken advantage of? Somebody needs to advocate for these players and demand some answers. Who else is going to do it? The players union they aren't allowed to have? The conferences and schools that are fighting to not share any revenue with them or to give them adequate healthcare? What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football."
I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them.
It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position.
And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"?
To be clear, I didn't say anything about the current answer or whether there was anything more to be learned. I was specifically responding to the assertion that it was absurd for parents to be asking any questions at all on behalf of their kids.
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Post by eazy on Aug 16, 2020 15:41:58 GMT -5
What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football."
I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them.
It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position.
And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"?
To be clear, I didn't say anything about the current answer or whether there was anything more to be learned. I was specifically responding to the assertion that it was absurd for parents to be asking any questions at all on behalf of their kids. It's absurd for parents to be asking on behalf of their kids. These are not 12 year olds, they are old enough to vote and smoke and lots of them are old enough to drink. What percentage of college athletes are going to have agents when they graduate? They should learn how to talk to their coaches like grown up humans.
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Post by big10+4 fan on Aug 16, 2020 15:55:53 GMT -5
Absurd why, exactly? Professional athletes pay agents and/or lawyers to represent their interests. Through High school athletes have parents to advise them and protect their interests. Then, for the years they are college athletes, there is an attempt to bury the parents role and outlaw professional representation to isolate naive, inexperienced athletes fresh out of high school. Gee, I wonder why is it that college athletes get taken advantage of? Somebody needs to advocate for these players and demand some answers. Who else is going to do it? The players union they aren't allowed to have? The conferences and schools that are fighting to not share any revenue with them or to give them adequate healthcare? What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football." I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them. It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position. And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"? The 12-2 vote doesn't seem to be correct. Apparently it was actually 8-6.
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Post by gibbyb1 on Aug 16, 2020 15:56:03 GMT -5
100 percent. Painful decision, not particularly difficult IMO. I hate it as a competitor, I’d hate it as a parent, but it requires zero explanation beyond what they did. I have a child who is a division 1 athlete I’m disappointed they didn’t get to compete in the spring but understood completely I think the only thing parents/players have a right to be upset about is that they waited so long that it became impractical to transfer to the SEC and play. Whether the system is right or wrong is a completely different discussion, but the current reality is that millions of dollars could be at stake while SEC athletes play, perform well, and improve their draft stock while the Big Ten sits out. They waited as long as they could because they wanted to try and see if it was feasible. When you are making decision a regarding the health and well being of your students and community, giving kids time to transfer isn’t a priority, nor should it be. Lastly does anyone believe for a second that university presidents didn’t want to cancel?? It’s a massive financial blow for them. Nobody wanted to play more than they did.
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Post by gibbyb1 on Aug 16, 2020 15:57:33 GMT -5
What do they expect that answer to be? It will be, as it already has been, "we assessed risk, we assessed potential liability, we've looking at the data and the numbers, we've considered protocols and the nature of football."
I totally get if they don't agree with the answer or the result; it sucks to not play. But what magical answer do they want that would make everything okay. There isn't one. They understand how institutional decisions are made; they simply disagree with the outcome. Obviously nothing short of "we were wrong, you can play" will placate them.
It all sucks; but it's not like not playing is some crazy unfounded position.
And the "the conference" isn't some super authority over the schools. Only Neb and Iowa voted not to delay. So why aren't PSU and OSU parents pitching to their own schools instead of blaming "the conference"?
To be clear, I didn't say anything about the current answer or whether there was anything more to be learned. I was specifically responding to the assertion that it was absurd for parents to be asking any questions at all on behalf of their kids. i What question wasn’t answered in regards to why they aren’t playing?
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Post by n00b on Aug 16, 2020 20:26:16 GMT -5
It might be, but the Big Ten commissioner denied that it was the deciding factor, internationally turning to vague language. 'There has been a lot of discussion about myocarditis, so there has been discussion as of late," Warren said. "That's not the primary reason. All of those items from a medical standpoint, you have to consider. "I know there's been a lot of discussion about that, but overall when it comes down to it, it's just the litany of things that created this state of uncertainty that we need more clarity on from a health, wellness and medical standpoint." Warren wouldn't give you a straight answer if you asked him if the sky was up... The question was, what changed in that window. The answer is, the focus on the heart issues (including, but not limited to, this: www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/29613946/former-florida-state-center-michael-ojo-27-dies-workout ). The Big Ten is really missing Jim Delaney.
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