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Post by Ballislife on Jul 31, 2019 11:24:45 GMT -5
Hodson was on Victoria Garrick's podcast recently. Interesting to hear her speak about the moments that were hush hush for so long. I wonder if Dunning feels like crap given everything that went wrong with her. Super sad to listen to esp when she talks about feeling excluded from the championship game. Yikes. Finally hearing it from her voice is eye opening. Excluded from the championship game!? She excluded herself the whole year but wanted some spotlight when the team she used to play on made it to that stage. Let’s not kid ourselves; that podcast is a total one sided perspective from someone who had a hard time knowing they were no longer the center of attention. How many games was she at the whole year? One, that happened to be televised.
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Post by Disc808 on Jul 31, 2019 11:29:27 GMT -5
I wonder if Dunning feels like crap given everything that went wrong with her. Super sad to listen to esp when she talks about feeling excluded from the championship game. Yikes. Finally hearing it from her voice is eye opening. There is so much of this we will never know. I'm sure if lawsuits were mentioned, Dunning was told to stop communication. I know people make mistakes but I feel like Dunning is the scapegoat in this situation. She had 2 concussions in the USA gym, I wonder if Karch/USA staff addressed that or if any of that was discussed in length with stanford’s Medical staff/coaching staff prior to her concussions in NCAA (Not trying to blame anyone here, just speculating as to why that detail was never talked about much)
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Post by ShaneM2005 on Jul 31, 2019 11:33:38 GMT -5
I wonder if Dunning feels like crap given everything that went wrong with her. Super sad to listen to esp when she talks about feeling excluded from the championship game. Yikes. Finally hearing it from her voice is eye opening. Excluded from the championship game!? She excluded herself the whole year but wanted some spotlight when the team she used to play on made it to that stage. Let’s not kid ourselves; that podcast is a total one sided perspective from someone who had a hard time knowing they were no longer the center of attention. How many games was she at the whole year? One, that happened to be televised. I don't think that's a fair assessment. Hodson played the first six(?) games of the season from what I recall so I would argue that she was still part of the team for that season. How do you know she only attended one game the whole year outside of the ones she played in? More like you only noticed her at one because it was televised. #perspective I enjoyed watching her play. Just wish things would have turned out differently for her obviously.
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Post by ShaneM2005 on Jul 31, 2019 11:35:33 GMT -5
I wonder if Dunning feels like crap given everything that went wrong with her. Super sad to listen to esp when she talks about feeling excluded from the championship game. Yikes. Finally hearing it from her voice is eye opening. There is so much of this we will never know. I'm sure if lawsuits were mentioned, Dunning was told to stop communication. I know people make mistakes but I feel like Dunning is the scapegoat in this situation. I'm sure Dunning was told to stop communication once the university knew the lawsuit was coming. His hands are tied at that point in my opinion. Perhaps he could have handled things differently prior to that, but you have to realize the position he's put in once it gets to that point.
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Post by Disc808 on Jul 31, 2019 11:36:41 GMT -5
Excluded from the championship game!? She excluded herself the whole year but wanted some spotlight when the team she used to play on made it to that stage. Let’s not kid ourselves; that podcast is a total one sided perspective from someone who had a hard time knowing they were no longer the center of attention. How many games was she at the whole year? One, that happened to be televised. Thanks for the vivid example of the kind of support she received from the school and program as she dealt with debilitating depression from being forced to play through concussions and other injuries. Sort of lends a lot more credence to her story. While I don’t agree with the shaming from the original poster, I also don’t think it’s fair to vilify the entire program
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Post by Disc808 on Jul 31, 2019 11:38:44 GMT -5
While I don’t agree with the shaming from the original poster, I also don’t think it’s fair to vilify the entire program Did you listen to the interview? Yeah all of it. You think all the players were shunning her on their own accords?
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Post by Disc808 on Jul 31, 2019 11:40:18 GMT -5
Yeah all of it. You think all the players were shunning her? No, and she clearly stated that. By program I assumed you meant the players too. Look I agree that this was not handled well, but I also think these problems need to be addressed with all schools and staffs.
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Post by n00b on Jul 31, 2019 11:43:32 GMT -5
Excluded from the championship game!? She excluded herself the whole year but wanted some spotlight when the team she used to play on made it to that stage. Let’s not kid ourselves; that podcast is a total one sided perspective from someone who had a hard time knowing they were no longer the center of attention. How many games was she at the whole year? One, that happened to be televised. I don't think that's a fair assessment. Hodson played the first six(?) games of the season from what I recall so I would argue that she was still part of the team for that season. How do you know she only attended one game the whole year outside of the ones she played in? More like you only noticed her at one because it was televised. #perspective I enjoyed watching her play. Just wish things would have turned out differently for her obviously. The topic of "I need to take care of myself and get away from volleyball" was talked about at length in the podcast. I wasn't there, but I assume that's what happened mid-season that year. Whether that was the right or wrong thing for her to do, that move undoubtedly would ruffle feathers within the team (as the podcasters admitted). At that point, Haley being at the Final Four would've been a distraction. Haley was going through some extremely tough stuff and needed to put herself before the team and that's fine. Then the team had an opportunity to accomplish something great (winning a national championship). It is perfectly reasonable for them to not want any distractions.
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Post by Ballislife on Jul 31, 2019 11:56:29 GMT -5
The topic of "I need to take care of myself and get away from volleyball" was talked about at length in the podcast. I wasn't there, but I assume that's what happened mid-season that year. Whether that was the right or wrong thing for her to do, that move undoubtedly would ruffle feathers within the team (as the podcasters admitted). At that point, Haley being at the Final Four would've been a distraction. Haley was going through some extremely tough stuff and needed to put herself before the team and that's fine. Then the team had an opportunity to accomplish something great (winning a national championship). It is perfectly reasonable for them to not want any distractions. There is a stark difference between a program that ostracizes an injured player from the team under the guise of putting the team first, versus a program that embraces a teammate in need, supports her to get the medical help she needs, and still includes her. Not to be too Disney-esque, but you don't leave a teammate behind. You don't kick them to the curb when it suits you. That is complete BS. There are a lot of ways they could have handled it, and it sounds like they did it wrong just about every step of the way. So you fully support someone after they file a lawsuit against you?
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Post by Ballislife on Jul 31, 2019 12:25:30 GMT -5
So you fully support someone after they file a lawsuit against you? Either you just put the cart way before the horse, or you are saying that Stanford expected a lawsuit very early on (like while she was still playing sophomore year or even before), which makes their actions a whole huge level worse. Way to put words in my mouth. Saying this whole thing is the coaches fault is a joke. All athletes at a high level go through some sort of physical or mental struggle. Some can deal with it and others can’t. That’s all this is, and continually downplaying the efforts that the Stanford coaches put into someone financially, medically, and athletically is ridiculous. Cuz remember the narrative used to be that the medical staff had no idea what they were talking about, and now it’s because they were pressured by coaches. Someone like Dunning or Denise don’t have that kind of personality, they always looked out for the best interest of their players and for someone to say otherwise is preaching a false narrative. The fact that this is even brought up is dumb, so I’m gonna follow my own advice and stop giving credence to something that has no standing on The Future of Stanford volleyball.
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Post by vbjustice on Jul 31, 2019 12:36:11 GMT -5
The topic of "I need to take care of myself and get away from volleyball" was talked about at length in the podcast. I wasn't there, but I assume that's what happened mid-season that year. Whether that was the right or wrong thing for her to do, that move undoubtedly would ruffle feathers within the team (as the podcasters admitted). At that point, Haley being at the Final Four would've been a distraction. Haley was going through some extremely tough stuff and needed to put herself before the team and that's fine. Then the team had an opportunity to accomplish something great (winning a national championship). It is perfectly reasonable for them to not want any distractions. There is a stark difference between a program that ostracizes an injured player from the team under the guise of putting the team first, versus a program that embraces a teammate in need, supports her to get the medical help she needs, and still includes her. Not to be too Disney-esque, but you don't leave a teammate behind. You don't kick them to the curb when it suits you. That is complete BS. There are a lot of ways they could have handled it, and it sounds like they did it wrong just about every step of the way. All of what @sbvb said
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Post by vbjustice on Jul 31, 2019 12:49:40 GMT -5
[/quote] Saying this whole thing is the coaches fault is a joke. All athletes at a high level go through some sort of physical or mental struggle. Some can deal with it and others can’t. That’s all this is...[/quote] I listened to the podcast the whole way through and she stated her depression was a result of her head injury. ballislife
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 12:51:39 GMT -5
I have no horse in this race, but the recency of hearing Hodson's story on the podcast may give me a bias toward her. Plus, she was the one injured and battling for her life and health.
I don't really blame Stanford and its coaching staff entirely, mostly because I do think this is common among coaches at all levels of sport. I think a lot of the concern about football continuing to expand its schedule, including the small playoff, is that a lot of the players are held together with duct tape. Money and control are still the biggest factors, but some do legitimately care about athlete's well being. But, this attitude of shake it off, rub some dirt on it, toughen up, etc. has been pervasive and has finally started to get the attention it warrants. Add to that the fact that the understanding of concussions, post concussion, depression, etc. are all still very lightly understood and not always easy to identify. And, the players don't help the staff/trainers as much as they could (and should) due to their own competitiveness.
All-in-all, I think there's enough blame to go around. I don't know the reasons for Hodson's exclusion from the Final Four that year, if it had to do with a potential lawsuit, or what. But, I would think that was something pretty easy and benign to accommodate from the school. I don't think it'd be a distraction at all. If you don't want her on the bench, then put her in the parents' section.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 13:10:08 GMT -5
Yes. I found a lot of that interview to be fascinating, even beyond the concussion/depression side of it. Really good work by Garrick. Not sure she's a journalist by trade, but a pretty good job in that interview.
I agree that asking an athlete if they can continue after a concussion is a bad process. And, agree, great imagery there from Hodson. I think the NFL, at least in theory, is trying to get this right with its supposedly neutral observer on head injury. Athletic trainers have to be equipped to identify those things, and I assume they are. But, if there is pressure from coaches on the trainers then perhaps athletic departments should be sure to make clear who the trainers report to in their employment, and make sure it isn't the coaches. I assume all of this is being done. But, if it isn't...fix it.
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Post by n00b on Jul 31, 2019 13:32:40 GMT -5
The topic of "I need to take care of myself and get away from volleyball" was talked about at length in the podcast. I wasn't there, but I assume that's what happened mid-season that year. Whether that was the right or wrong thing for her to do, that move undoubtedly would ruffle feathers within the team (as the podcasters admitted). At that point, Haley being at the Final Four would've been a distraction. Haley was going through some extremely tough stuff and needed to put herself before the team and that's fine. Then the team had an opportunity to accomplish something great (winning a national championship). It is perfectly reasonable for them to not want any distractions. There is a stark difference between a program that ostracizes an injured player from the team under the guise of putting the team first, versus a program that embraces a teammate in need, supports her to get the medical help she needs, and still includes her. Not to be too Disney-esque, but you don't leave a teammate behind. You don't kick them to the curb when it suits you. That is complete BS. There are a lot of ways they could have handled it, and it sounds like they did it wrong just about every step of the way. There was a 2.5-month gap where Hodson wasn't around at all. If she was pushed away from the program in September, I totally agree with you. That interview made it sound like in September, she let the team know that she needed to be away from the team for mental health reasons. That is a totally fine decision if she needed to do it. But she wanted to be a part of the final four 2.5 months later, after the team has been thriving without her. Declining that request is NOT kicking her to the curb because she exited on her own volition.
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