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Post by mnvb56 on Oct 21, 2011 15:41:24 GMT -5
It is my understanding that those regional rankings only take into account results through Oct 16th. New rankings will come out next week. Also, these rankings are published by the same committee that helps to select and seed the NCAA tournament (each region has a committee that spend countless hours seeding their region then the regional chairs spend what has been repeatedly described as the world's longest conference call in an attempt to compare teams from various regions with multiple criteria to set the final NCAA tournament field). So, yes, they are the rankings that determine at-large selections to the NCAA tournament (kind of). Although, that becomes an increasingly complicated situation, especially in New England. There are 8 automatic qualifier conferences, but only four conferences represented in the NCAA's first rankings. If top-seeds get upset in their conference tournament, then it really shakes things up. Plus, how does that late in the season loss effect their new place in the rankings? The Hall of Fame Tournament (http://athletics.mtholyoke.edu/sports/wvball/2011-12/hof/halloffame) could shine more light on the rankings in New England (and help some teams make a stronger case for being ranked or ranked higher) but could also muddle it even further. The thing to remember is that rankings are far from a perfect science. There are several criteria used to ranked teams and they are often at odds with each other. Also, teams are forced to play a schedule that is largely determined over 6 months prior to a match even being played. Next, it is impossible to account for all of the numerous situations that can effect the outcome of single matches such as which team had a player sick or hurt, or which STUDENT-athlete spent the last three nights studying for an exam or writing a paper or working on a project. Some teams play each other multiple times, some play each other once, others never get the chance to set foot in the same gym. Plus, some teams just match up better against some teams but not as well to others. havervb--Thank you so much for taking the time to try and explain the process--it is certainly more complicated than I thought! I guess I will just hope for the best for the rest of the season and see what happens
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Post by rogue VB fan on Oct 21, 2011 15:47:31 GMT -5
I watch a lot of Northern Sun (D2) and Big Ten (D1) matches. The speed of play, skills, and volleyball knowledge seem to be similar. The biggest difference is that D1 hitters are taller while keeping the same speed, skill, and knowledge. So in the matches, you would tend to have D1 players hitting over D2 and D3 blocks. Even the best defensive D3 teams would be hard pressed to survive that assault.
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Post by Momof2D3 on Oct 21, 2011 21:04:40 GMT -5
In tonight's action - Volleyball Hall of Fame
Brandeis def. Smith, 3-0 Amherst def. MIT, 3-1 Springfield def. Bowdoin, 3-0 Colby def. Bridgewater State, 3-0 Mount Holyoke def. Gordon, 3-1 Tufts def. Westfield State, 3-0 Williams def. Wheaton, 3-0 Middlebury def. Wellesley, 3-1
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Post by d3follower on Oct 21, 2011 23:51:22 GMT -5
It is my understanding that those regional rankings only take into account results through Oct 16th. New rankings will come out next week. Also, these rankings are published by the same committee that helps to select and seed the NCAA tournament (each region has a committee that spend countless hours seeding their region then the regional chairs spend what has been repeatedly described as the world's longest conference call in an attempt to compare teams from various regions with multiple criteria to set the final NCAA tournament field). So, yes, they are the rankings that determine at-large selections to the NCAA tournament (kind of). Although, that becomes an increasingly complicated situation, especially in New England. There are 8 automatic qualifier conferences, but only four conferences represented in the NCAA's first rankings. If top-seeds get upset in their conference tournament, then it really shakes things up. Plus, how does that late in the season loss effect their new place in the rankings? The Hall of Fame Tournament (http://athletics.mtholyoke.edu/sports/wvball/2011-12/hof/halloffame) could shine more light on the rankings in New England (and help some teams make a stronger case for being ranked or ranked higher) but could also muddle it even further. The thing to remember is that rankings are far from a perfect science. There are several criteria used to ranked teams and they are often at odds with each other. Also, teams are forced to play a schedule that is largely determined over 6 months prior to a match even being played. Next, it is impossible to account for all of the numerous situations that can effect the outcome of single matches such as which team had a player sick or hurt, or which STUDENT-athlete spent the last three nights studying for an exam or writing a paper or working on a project. Some teams play each other multiple times, some play each other once, others never get the chance to set foot in the same gym. Plus, some teams just match up better against some teams but not as well to others. havervb--Thank you so much for taking the time to try and explain the process--it is certainly more complicated than I thought! I guess I will just hope for the best for the rest of the season and see what happens This FAQ about the D-III selection process could help, too. It has a link to the Pre-Championship Manual at the bottom.
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Post by mnvb56 on Oct 22, 2011 13:25:07 GMT -5
havervb--Thank you so much for taking the time to try and explain the process--it is certainly more complicated than I thought! I guess I will just hope for the best for the rest of the season and see what happens This FAQ about the D-III selection process could help, too. It has a link to the Pre-Championship Manual at the bottom. Thank you! There was a lot of helpful information there--and although my daughter plays in the New England area, this website seems to cover DIII volleyball in the Midwest, where a number of her former teammates are competing, so it was fun to read more about their teams, too. Thanks for the link.
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Post by Momof2D3 on Oct 23, 2011 8:42:48 GMT -5
Hall of Fame Saturday results:
Smith def. Bridgewater State, 3-2 Bowdoin def. Gordon, 3-0 Middlebury def. MIT, 3-0 Amherst def. Brandeis, 3-0 Smith def. Westfield State, 3-0 Bowdoin def. Brandeis, 3-0 Tufts def. Williams, 3-0 MIT vs. Bridgewater State, 3-0 Westfield State def. Mount Holyoke, 3-0 Colby def. Wheaton, 3-1 Wellesley def. Williams, 3-2 Tufts def. Springfield, 3-1 Colby def. Mount Holyoke, 3-0 Wheaton def. Gordon, 3-2 Wellesley def. Amherst, 3-0 Springfield def. Middlebury, 3-1
So to summarize some of the tougher games with regionally ranked teams
Springfield 3 - Bowdoin 0 (25-22, 25-22,25-22) Tufts 3 - Springfield 1 (29-27, 25-21, 21-25, 25-23) Middlebury 3 - Wellesley 1 (25-21, 25-18, 13-25, 25-20) Springfield 3 - Middlebury 1 (19-25, 27-25, 25-22, 25-17) Wellesley def. Amherst, 3-0 (25-15, 25-20, 35-33) Amherst def. MIT, 3-1 (20-25, 25-12, 25-14, 27-25) Wellesley def. Williams, 3-2 (13-25, 25-17, 14-25, 25-13, 15-8)
Interesting scores in the Wellesley-Williams match.
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Post by mnvb56 on Oct 24, 2011 18:40:56 GMT -5
Since this seems to be the thread with posters knowledgeable about DIII volleyball, I thought I would post this here: Do they release an RPI for DIII teams? And if so, when? Thanks!
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Post by d3follower on Oct 25, 2011 1:30:23 GMT -5
Since this seems to be the thread with posters knowledgeable about DIII volleyball, I thought I would post this here: Do they release an RPI for DIII teams? And if so, when? Thanks! There are a couple of sites that track unofficial D-III numbers. D-III uses unique primary selection criteria, none of which is RPI. The NCAA publishes regional rankings during the last three weeks of the season. Those rankings, formed by eight separate regional committees using the primary criteria, are the basis for selection purposes. The national committee (the eight regional chairs) then has control of the rankings prior to selection day.
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Post by tmb on Oct 25, 2011 4:01:17 GMT -5
Rich Kern post a Pablo Ranking for all 430 D3 teams. I am pretty sure you have to pay the $20 membership fee to see it but you get tons of useful info for every level. www.richkern.com
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Post by Not Me on Oct 25, 2011 7:06:24 GMT -5
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Post by The Bofa on the Sofa on Oct 25, 2011 9:22:51 GMT -5
Since this seems to be the thread with posters knowledgeable about DIII volleyball, I thought I would post this here: Do they release an RPI for DIII teams? And if so, when? Thanks! RPI in D3 would be an odd duck. From a national perspective, it would be pretty much useless, given the massive disparity in schedules due to regionalization. Sure, the top schools in D3 are awesome about scheduling tough, but that is really limited to the very top. And even outside the non-conference, there are some massive disparities in conference schedules. Given the RPI dependence on win/loss records, I wouldn't put any stock on what comes out, at least nationally. Then again, given the D3 regional approach in the tournament, you could probably get some reasonable results if you restrict it to regional rankings. Since teams in the midwest are not competing with teams on the east coast for tournament slots, it really doesn't matter how those teams are ranked relative to each other. Or you could use Pablo rankings as a guide, which does not have the regional bias issue
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Post by mnvb56 on Oct 25, 2011 9:23:08 GMT -5
Thanks d3follower, N.E. D3, Not Me and Bofa--I was aware of the regional rankings and Pablo rankings--was just wondering if there were RPI rankings as well. I hadn't really thought through the differences in how regional DIII volleyball is and how at-large teams are chosen for the NCAA's so I appreciate the explanations-- I'll get this yet
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Post by mnvb56 on Oct 25, 2011 9:27:59 GMT -5
Rich Kern post a Pablo Ranking for all 430 D3 teams. I am pretty sure you have to pay the $20 membership fee to see it but you get tons of useful info for every level.www.richkern.com I agree--we used his free recruiting registry for our DD and subscribed to the pay site as kind of a "thank you" for the excellent service the free recruiting site provided. Now we are hooked on all of the information that the www.richkern.com site provides (and I think we are only scratching the surface there!) and just renewed our subscription.
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Post by The Bofa on the Sofa on Oct 25, 2011 9:41:56 GMT -5
Another thing I just realized about D3 RPI is that almost 15% of the matches of D3 teams are against non-D3 opponents. IIRC, these types of results are ignored in D1 RPI, but some teams in D3 play more than half of their matches against non-D3 teams (for example, Nebraska Wesleyan's conference is all NAIA except for them)
Teams like that can't be treated at all successfully with RPI. Not enough D3 matches to draw a conclusion. Pablo, OTOH, handles inter-divisional matches very well, especially in the D2/D3/NAIA ranks (not as good with D1 because there aren't as many interdivisional matches)
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Post by Momof2D3 on Oct 25, 2011 14:24:57 GMT -5
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