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Post by gr8ful on Apr 30, 2012 14:25:47 GMT -5
I wouldn't mind bagging a couple of players from LBSU and Hawaii and backhand slap their backsides in a playful manner....is there anything wrong with that?
Folks, you're debating strategy in a team competition....the real debate should be professionals playing on the collegiate level which I thought was against the rules....seriously, if a college football player receives compensation in any manner - be it endorsement, earnings, tattoos, etc they are banned....last I checked some of the birds playing "college" beach volleyball received pay despite an "amateur" title. Next, the last time I checked if a college student who participates at the Division One Level decides at the end of the season transfers schools mid academic year they are not permitted to play for a season and had to sit....I guess we are saying indoor volleyball at one university is a different sport than sand volleyball at another university - is that what the rule is....so, instead of worrying about "strategy" and putting my fourth team out against a one team maybe the discussion should be why aren't all college athletes and programs treated the same by the NCAA....seriously....if I'm a program that is ineligible for bowl games because a player was allowed to borrow a car and I see this crap happening I file a massive lawsuit against the NCAA....somebody get me Glave's number, wait I have it.....
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Post by geddyleemarvin on Apr 30, 2012 14:37:51 GMT -5
I wouldn't mind bagging a couple of players from LBSU and Hawaii and backhand slap their backsides in a playful manner....is there anything wrong with that? Folks, you're debating strategy in a team competition....the real debate should be professionals playing on the collegiate level which I thought was against the rules....seriously, if a college football player receives compensation in any manner - be it endorsement, earnings, tattoos, etc they are banned....last I checked some of the birds playing "college" beach volleyball received pay despite an "amateur" title. Next, the last time I checked if a college student who participates at the Division One Level decides at the end of the season transfers schools mid academic year they are not permitted to play for a season and had to sit....I guess we are saying indoor volleyball at one university is a different sport than sand volleyball at another university - is that what the rule is....so, instead of worrying about "strategy" and putting my fourth team out against a one team maybe the discussion should be why aren't all college athletes and programs treated the same by the NCAA....seriously....if I'm a program that is ineligible for bowl games because a player was allowed to borrow a car and I see this crap happening I file a massive lawsuit against the NCAA....somebody get me Glave's number, wait I have it..... What the hell are you talking about? If an amateur plays in a pro tournament and wins money, they're allowed to keep enough of it to pay expenses. Prize money can also be put in a trust fund that the player can't touch for X amount of years. NCAA has no problem with that. And nobody is getting endorsement $$. Players do not have to sit out a year (unless it's a transfer to a school in the same conference), this isn't football or basketball. The NCAA ruled that Summer Ross was eligible for sand volley immediately for two reasons: One, she had already completed a full year at Washington (she enrolled early); Two, the NCAA considers sand volleyball a completely different sport than indoor. Put Corey's number back in your rolodex and slowly back away. Edit: I was incorrect about putting winnings into a trust fund - that's not allowed. Amateurs have to turn down any prize money outside of "reasonable expenses" - usually the entry fee, mileage to and from competition, etc. |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Apr 30, 2012 14:58:11 GMT -5
I'm a total idiot?? Awarding more points for #1, then #2, and so on down the line-up. Now that's idiotic!! Totally devalues the importance of having depth on a team. Why not just have each school represented by one pair. I've proposed the only solution that prevents 'sand-bagging'. Every pair plays every pair on the opposing team. That is the only way to do it and remove all subjectivity. Weighted point system - now that would be idiotic. Sheesh. No other sport uses or would use such an idiotic point system. The negativity is killing me! If the point system is set up correctly it could work to push coaches into seeding teams correctly. Maybe 20, 18, 15, 11, and 6 pts or some amount that gives more weight to the higher teams. What's wrong with that? (For the sake of discussion...and inevitably getting a certain someone's panties in a bunch). Limiting the mobility of pairs is the easiest rule to enforce I guess. Fans don't want to count points. Keep it simple. Sent from my MB860 using ProBoards you are proposing a system that rewards some wins more than others - show me another scoring system like that in collegiate sports? the 1st team win is worth more than the 4th team win - arrgghh. seriously, think about the message that sends. If my #4 batter hits a home run it's worth 2 runs, but if my #8 hitter hits a banger it's only worth a run. IMO, it's just creating a more flawed system. |
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Post by gr8ful on Apr 30, 2012 18:11:37 GMT -5
O.k....will give since the NCAA rules that beach Volleyball is a completely different sport that clears it up, I knew she graduated high school early, but didn't realize she started college in January 2011
- I can send over the entire boring PPT of NCAA rules and regulations regarding this if you would like....next, regarding payouts - it's a bit of a gray area....overall, you just answered my question perfectly though...NCAA will always treat lesser sports differently....especially given only football and basketball bring revenue to a university...if a player, or family, receives any special treatment in anyway then it is grounds for punishment..I'm just glad that there are no contributions made to athletes in other sports in college besides the football and basketball....
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Post by OOTCDUDE on Apr 30, 2012 19:47:44 GMT -5
I wouldn't mind bagging a couple of players from LBSU and Hawaii and backhand slap their backsides in a playful manner....is there anything wrong with that? OK, George W (butt slapper) Bush wannabe... |
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Post by OOTCDUDE on Apr 30, 2012 19:49:38 GMT -5
I wouldn't mind bagging a couple of players from LBSU and Hawaii and backhand slap their backsides in a playful manner....is there anything wrong with that? OK, George W (butt slapper) Bush wannabe... |
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Post by salsolomon on May 1, 2012 7:59:04 GMT -5
How does Tennis deal with this issue? THey have many more years of experience setting #1, #2 etc.
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Post by beachvolleymike on May 1, 2012 9:25:58 GMT -5
How does Tennis deal with this issue? THey have many more years of experience setting #1, #2 etc. Someone mentioned that tennis teams just can't move players up/down more than 1 spot. But if a coach kept sandbagging for an extended amount of time then there is no stopping them with that rule. Sent from my MB860 using ProBoards |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on May 1, 2012 20:40:08 GMT -5
look at the rankings of USC/UCLA for a tennis match - players do not play in order of their rankings: - but I don not know the pecking order rules for tennis.
Singles
1. #2 Steve Johnson (USC) def. #17 Nick Meister (UCLA) 3-6, 6-1, 6-2
2. #73 Clay Thompson (UCLA) def. #25 Ray Sarmiento (USC) 7-6(4), 6-4
3. #18 Daniel Nguyen (USC) def. Dennis Novikov (UCLA) 6-3, 6-1
4. #60 Emilio Gomez (USC) def. #71 Marcos Giron (UCLA) 6-4, 6-3
5. #46 Adrien Puget (UCLA) vs. #53 Yannick Hanfmann (USC) 6-3, 3-6, 6-5, unfinished
6. Dennis Mkrtchian (UCLA) def. Roberto Quiroz (USC) 3-6, 6-4, 6-3
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Post by ciscokeed on May 2, 2012 13:23:04 GMT -5
How about running a double elimination tournament. Run your 1's, 2's, 3's in a double elim format. Bye out both #1's. Crossover your 2's and 3's. Score the tournament according to finish. Also run a double elim with your 4's and 5's. Do the same format of crossing over. You get more matches this way- with every team being guaranteed a minimum of 2 matches. A bit longer to run, but ends up being totally fair with how you partner up, and stays true to the origins of beach volleyball....OR someone smarter than me tweaking this format- what do y'all think??
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Post by sevb on May 2, 2012 13:24:58 GMT -5
Anyone familiar with beach volleyball knows that sandbagging is as common as the deep dish!! What makes anyone think this wouldn't carry over into the college game??
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Post by geddyleemarvin on May 2, 2012 15:35:22 GMT -5
Anyone familiar with beach volleyball knows that sandbagging is as common as the deep dish!! What makes anyone think this wouldn't carry over into the college game?? I wouldn't say it's all that common. You do not want to get tagged as a sandbagger on the California beaches. Also, deep dish is disappearing... |
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Post by sevb on May 2, 2012 15:45:54 GMT -5
Also, deep dish is disappearing... Praise the Lord... Brent Frohoff will likely be devastated however! |
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Post by mikegarrison on May 2, 2012 15:46:36 GMT -5
People keep saying this is a legal strategy, but is it? On the AVCA website there is a PDF with a rule (or was it just a rule proposal?) that said, "The line-up shall always be based on order of ability. 'Matching up' is prohibited. Players must compete in order of ability with the best doubles team on the team playing at the No. 1 position, the second best at No. 2, and so on through all positions."
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Post by klazk on May 3, 2012 14:50:41 GMT -5
All due respect to GLM, I don't think the earlier posts about sand bagging in CBVA events and golf is apples to apples to this discussion. Those are events where a single player or team is trying to win. The discussion here is about a group of teams trying to win an event. Not the same thing.
I think this is strategy. What is the difference between moving a "#1 team" to the #2 spot and moving your sixth best player to play with your best and then putting players 2 & 3 together and 4 and 5 together? You are accomplishing the same thing in a different way. You are lessening the level of your top team in order to strengthen the #2 and #3 teams. Is this "sand bagging" too?
It is a slippery slope. Honestly, I think the closest thing to "fair" in trying to prevent this is to reveal team placement one at a time in a pre match meeting. Coach A reveals placement and players of one of their teams then Coach B reveals placement of one of theirs and so on until all ten spots are filled. Home team gets go second in terms of revealing. For neutral sites or championships, it could go to the higher seed or you could flip a coin.
For all I know, maybe it is done that way (or something similar) now.
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