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Post by Cubicle No More ... on Apr 27, 2015 16:40:48 GMT -5
If the NCAA had a problem with it they wouldn't allow collegiate athletes on the World League rosters... travel is paid for, hotel is paid for, money is only given to the team if they win, governing body is USAV... exact same as PVL. as i understand it, the 'amateurism' requirements of the ncaa have a specific exception that would allow student athletes to compete while representing their national teams, even if the competition were for prize money. the student just would not be allowed to accept any monies/benefits, other than actual/necessary expenses. NCAA Bylaw 12.2.3.2.4 Exception—Olympic/National Teams. "It is permissible for an individual (prospective student-athlete or student-athletes) to participate on Olympic or national teams that are competing for prize money or are being compensated by the governing body to participate in a specific event, provided the student-athlete does not accept prize money or any other compensation (other than actual and necessary expenses). (Adopted: 8/8/02)" Here's a link to the 2009 bylaws. There's probably a more updated version, butthe gist of the rule likely remains the same: www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/D110.pdf
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Post by touch12ft on Apr 27, 2015 20:57:33 GMT -5
Tend to agree with the Ohana, which is why I opened up the dialogue in the first place. World league (Micah, etc.) has a very specific written exception. Pvl may be sanctioned by USAV but it's def not a feeder for the NAt team. It's 'A regional indoor pro league sanctioned by USA Volleyball'. And I can't really imagine guys would be on a roster without their prior consent. Again, wasn't even going to say anything until the roster got pulled from their site- which just looked fishy. Best of luck to everyone entering playoffs and hopefully no harm no foul.
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Post by payfor4get4 on Apr 27, 2015 21:54:37 GMT -5
The ncaa rules are already ridiculous and overly applied to small sport athletes without limited knowledge posting board people fishing for issues. Move along
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vb01
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Posts: 132
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Post by vb01 on Apr 27, 2015 22:16:14 GMT -5
Bottom line: the PVL is not a professional league, regardless of what is posted on their website it just isn't... clearly they want to be and I honestly hope it grows to that but the reality is that it's just not there yet.
Professional: (of a person) engaged in a specified activity as one's main paid occupation rather than as a pastime. "a professional boxer" synonyms: paid, salaried "a professional rugby player"
Sorry witch-hunters... time to move on. Lewis is #1 and they EARNED it.
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vb01
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Post by vb01 on Apr 27, 2015 22:24:07 GMT -5
Here's what we should be asking... who's "touch12ft"? His only posts are about this topic so clearly he's got a gripe with Lewis. Maybe a MPSFer? But why would an MPSFer follow Great Lakes Lightning on facebook since he claims to have seen that post. So he's probably someone from the Great Lakes Region... Lewis or Loyola... clearly Lewis wouldn't post this about themselves... poor form Peter... poor form.
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Post by Cubicle No More ... on Apr 27, 2015 22:57:49 GMT -5
Bottom line: the PVL is not a professional league, regardless of what is posted on their website it just isn't... clearly they want to be and I honestly hope it grows to that but the reality is that it's just not there yet. Professional: (of a person) engaged in a specified activity as one's main paid occupation rather than as a pastime. "a professional boxer" synonyms: paid, salaried "a professional rugby player" Sorry witch-hunters... time to move on. Lewis is #1 and they EARNED it. except that the definition of a 'professional team' is based on the ncaa bylaws, and not on a dictionary(?) definition ... per the bylaws in the link above, a pro team is one that (1) pays its athletes more than the actual and necessary expenses for participation on the team, or (2) one that " declares itself to be professional." as for the motives of the OP ... i'm intrigued by them as well. still tho, an interesting discussion ...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2015 10:04:36 GMT -5
Personally, I don't think anything wrong has happened. Just my feeling. This seems like really small potatoes and some NCAA rules do seem ridiculous... That said... Aside from some of the opinions on touch12ft's intent, there are really some unsanswered questions. As Cubicle points out, the NCAA bylaws need to be referenced and not a dictionary. Additionally, does anyone know anything about the PVL and how it pays players or just reimburses teams for basic costs? From TeamUSA... "The USA Premier Volleyball League (PVL) is a professional volleyball league made up of teams from among the 40 Regional Volleyball Associations across the United States. The PVL is an adult High Performance initiative based on the USA Volleyball Region system, but operates under a professional sports model. The USA PVL is sanctioned by USA Volleyball (USAV) and will offer tournament play, PVL Conference Championships and a national championship event each year." www.teamusa.org/usa-volleyball/high-performance/usa-pvlProfessional Sports Model? I'm not sure what this means. I just saw this from the Great Plains Region webpage FAQ... "A: The PVL has 4 basic rules for athletes
1. No high school students
2. No current college athletes
3. Athletes must be a member of the region where they play
4. Athletes must be a good role model
(Note: Rules #1 & #2 are due to eligibility issues associated with an athlete maintaining their
amateur status.)"www.gpvb.org/page/premier-volleyball-leagueRule 2 is interesting especially with the note below it. I am not intentionally fanning the flames. I just want to make sure that no one has done anything wrong. I like and respect Lewis and Coach Friend (despite my Loyola fanhood). Good or bad, transparency trumps all. Now who are you touch12ft? Lol.
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vb01
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Post by vb01 on Apr 28, 2015 10:21:22 GMT -5
A couple things stand out here... "A high performance initiative" and "athletes must be members of the usav region which they play for"
1st: so what's the difference between that and the pipeline that feeds in the YNT, MJNT or MNT... 2nd: the fact that the must still be members of their usav region makes me feel as though again, not professional (I realize this is just my opinion.
Lastly, with the federal court ruling this past Fall, my guess is that the NCAA is so busy rewriting their definition of amateurism and trying to appeal the Ed O'Bannon ruling that they probably don't really care about the PVL at this point... and in case you missed it, a federal court ruled that the NCAA definition of amateurism is not legal.
I agree though... transparency.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2015 10:27:14 GMT -5
We play OSU tomorrow night and Shawn Herron is on the Ohio Valley website. Plus Reyes from BYU played in PVL at Open Nationals in 2014. He played in 100 out of 104 sets this season for BYU.
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vb01
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Post by vb01 on Apr 28, 2015 10:29:15 GMT -5
Slurp... slurp...
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Post by blerzz on Apr 28, 2015 14:45:26 GMT -5
Here's what we should be asking... who's "touch12ft"? His only posts are about this topic so clearly he's got a gripe with Lewis. Maybe a MPSFer? But why would an MPSFer follow Great Lakes Lightning on facebook since he claims to have seen that post. So he's probably someone from the Great Lakes Region... Lewis or Loyola... clearly Lewis wouldn't post this about themselves... poor form Peter... poor form. Why would you throw this "Peter" under the bus? Who do you assume this Peter is? What Peter is on Loyola's team?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2015 15:06:36 GMT -5
Peter Pan Movie quote. Hahaha. You kids grow up with 'Jake and the Neverland Pirates' now. And this is why the schools and compliance offices handle this stuff. Not fans and volleytalk.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2015 22:22:59 GMT -5
Yeah. Take the men's volleyball talk somewhere else.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2015 22:36:05 GMT -5
#OnwardLU
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Post by vboldschool on Apr 29, 2015 13:50:06 GMT -5
Sorry witch-hunters... time to move on. Lewis is #1 and they EARNED it. I think you're misinterpreting motives. This isn't a witch hunt, and if you've noticed, Lewis isn't even the topic of conversation. There have been some good informative posts in this thread, regarding both the NCAA rules and definitions, as well as bringing up current NCAA players who have previously competed and/or are on PVL rosters. That's a lot more helpful then saying stuff like, "Bottom line: the PVL is not a professional league, regardless of what is posted on their website ", as if it's an undisputed fact. I'm sorry you don't like the thread, but that doesn't invalidate it.
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