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Post by vbprisoner on Jan 8, 2018 9:59:49 GMT -5
I understand that mental health issues should be dealt with care and importance but a question comes to mind: People in America are BLESSED and yet people have mental issues? If you have running water, electricity 24/7, roof over your head, food that you can buy for $1, why commit suicide? If someone needs to escape a certain area, there are no rebels who will attack you on route like what happens in some countries. You can simply take a bus. So why commit suicide when you have so much compared to many countries around the world? Again I don't mean to sound pessimistic but just a question I need an answer to. You obviously do not know anybody with a mental illness after that statement.
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Post by BuckysHeat on Jan 8, 2018 11:18:31 GMT -5
I find her #6 to be probably the saddest comment she made. I have said it before, this is SUPPOSED to be a place where people who have a common interest come to discuss their passion and what they love. Yet you have innumerable trolls who have nothing better to do than be nasty little people looking to tear everything and everybody down here, it is no wonder she states what she does.
As far as mental illness, it comes in many forms and can hit any age. My 12 year old daughter for example, she was on a great team last year but was miserable the entire time for a variety of reasons (no, it was not pressure, it was everything else). This year with the same club she is on a different team who had their first tourney yesterday, my wife and I have never seen her as happy as she was yesterday playing. She loves the game, loves her teammates, loves her coaches.
That is what sports are supposed to be about, enjoyment of what you can do, enjoyment of what your child/friend/sibling/spouse can do. One of my favorite quotes is this one from the movie Vision Quest - "It ain't the six minutes... it's what happens in that six minutes" and I try to remember this whenever I watch.
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Post by trainermch on Jan 8, 2018 11:28:43 GMT -5
I find her #6 to be probably the saddest comment she made. I have said it before, this is SUPPOSED to be a place where people who have a common interest come to discuss their passion and what they love. Yet you have innumerable trolls who have nothing better to do than be nasty little people looking to tear everything and everybody down here, it is no wonder she states what she does. As far as mental illness, it comes in many forms and can hit any age. My 12 year old daughter for example, she was on a great team last year but was miserable the entire time for a variety of reasons (no, it was not pressure, it was everything else). This year with the same club she is on a different team who had their first tourney yesterday, my wife and I have never seen her as happy as she was yesterday playing. She loves the game, loves her teammates, loves her coaches. That is what sports are supposed to be about, enjoyment of what you can do, enjoyment of what your child/friend/friend/spouse can do. One of my favorite quotes is this one from the movie Vision Quest - "It ain't the six minutes... it's what happens in that six minutes" and I try to remember this whenever I watch.Ā This post brought a smile to my face. Then I played the video clip, which is a scene I recalled well, but then got another smile as I pressed the arrow for the next video and it was the AAU NC match for my daughterās team.
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Post by vbnerd on Jan 8, 2018 11:29:36 GMT -5
I understand that mental health issues should be dealt with care and importance but a question comes to mind: People in America are BLESSED and yet people have mental issues? If you have running water, electricity 24/7, roof over your head, food that you can buy for $1, why commit suicide? If someone needs to escape a certain area, there are no rebels who will attack you on route like what happens in some countries. You can simply take a bus. So why commit suicide when you have so much compared to many countries around the world? Again I don't mean to sound pessimistic but just a question I need an answer to. This has to be by far the most ignorant thing ive ever read on this site, and that says alot. Your severe lack of understanding and empathy towards mental health is really concerning. If you think that just because we can live of comfortable life when it comes to materealistic things, that our societys mental health should be ok, you should really take a basic psychology class ? ? ? The poster asks a question, admitting s/he doesn't know the material, and instead of anyone offering answers or insight s/he is attacked for asking the question. If anyone wants to understand the rotting culture of volleytalk, that's it, right there. A LOT OF people don't understand mental illness. Many people don't want to talk about it, don't want to know, or dont't care, but here posters attack the person who asks for information instead of those who don't want to understand. Instead of "well, that's not really how mental illness works" we get "this has to be by far the most ignorant thing I've ever read on this site" - they were asking the question! Let's be honest, any serious conversation about issues more significant that who's mascot would win in a fight is going to go off the rails here. Mental health? It's challenging to find an informed and open minded discussion about that anywhere in our society, so the only mistake in Mongolia's post is thinking that s/he could find that here.
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Post by trainermch on Jan 8, 2018 11:31:10 GMT -5
This has to be by far the most ignorant thing ive ever read on this site, and that says alot. Your severe lack of understanding and empathy towards mental health is really concerning. If you think that just because we can live of comfortable life when it comes to materealistic things, that our societys mental health should be ok, you should really take a basic psychology class ? ? ? The poster asks a question, admitting s/he doesn't know the material, and instead of anyone offering answers or insight s/he is attacked for asking the question. If anyone wants to understand the rotting culture of volleytalk, that's it, right there. A LOT OF people don't understand mental illness. Many people don't want to talk about it, don't want to know, or dont't care, but here posters attack the person who asks for information instead of those who don't want to understand. Instead of "well, that's not really how mental illness works" we get "this has to be by far the most ignorant thing I've ever read on this site" - they were asking the question! Let's be honest, any serious conversation about issues more significant that who's mascot would win in a fight is going to go off the rails here. Mental health? It's challenging to find an informed and open minded discussion about that anywhere in our society, so the only mistake in Mongolia's post is thinking that s/he could find that here. That wasnāt a real question. It was a lecture.
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Post by agturnedhorn on Jan 8, 2018 11:49:29 GMT -5
Former player parent here. If you guys knew the damage you do on here, you would never post another playerās name. These girls are human. They come from good homes with good parents where they were taught to treat others as you want to be treated. They are in college now where they are on their own for the first time and trying to find their way in this world. They see your comments and question everything about life when adults that are mostly coaches attacking them. You may not think it is an attack, but to young adults and the parents that raised them, it is an attack. I know they are a celebrity of sorts when they are Texas volleyball players, so you think you have the right to critique their every move, but they really donāt see themselves on the pedestal you guys put them on. Be kind and remember they are just people.
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Post by alhorford90 on Jan 8, 2018 11:50:18 GMT -5
This has to be by far the most ignorant thing ive ever read on this site, and that says alot. Your severe lack of understanding and empathy towards mental health is really concerning. If you think that just because we can live of comfortable life when it comes to materealistic things, that our societys mental health should be ok, you should really take a basic psychology class ? ? ? The poster asks a question, admitting s/he doesn't know the material, and instead of anyone offering answers or insight s/he is attacked for asking the question. If anyone wants to understand the rotting culture of volleytalk, that's it, right there. A LOT OF people don't understand mental illness. Many people don't want to talk about it, don't want to know, or dont't care, but here posters attack the person who asks for information instead of those who don't want to understand. Instead of "well, that's not really how mental illness works" we get "this has to be by far the most ignorant thing I've ever read on this site" - they were asking the question! Let's be honest, any serious conversation about issues more significant that who's mascot would win in a fight is going to go off the rails here. Mental health? It's challenging to find an informed and open minded discussion about that anywhere in our society, so the only mistake in Mongolia's post is thinking that s/he could find that here. "So why commit suicide when you have so much compared to many countries around the world?" That's the question you expect posters to answer in a critical yet thoughtful manner? Hmm I could also ask why would Ebony grieve for a dead friend when she has so much compared to citizens of many countries? I could literally go through every post on here and say well why do care about a loss or a win or the sport of volleyball when you have so much compared to other countries. The poster isn't really asking a question.
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Post by vbprisoner on Jan 8, 2018 11:56:59 GMT -5
This has to be by far the most ignorant thing ive ever read on this site, and that says alot. Your severe lack of understanding and empathy towards mental health is really concerning. If you think that just because we can live of comfortable life when it comes to materealistic things, that our societys mental health should be ok, you should really take a basic psychology class ? ? ? The poster asks a question, admitting s/he doesn't know the material, and instead of anyone offering answers or insight s/he is attacked for asking the question. If anyone wants to understand the rotting culture of volleytalk, that's it, right there. A LOT OF people don't understand mental illness. Many people don't want to talk about it, don't want to know, or dont't care, but here posters attack the person who asks for information instead of those who don't want to understand. Instead of "well, that's not really how mental illness works" we get "this has to be by far the most ignorant thing I've ever read on this site" - they were asking the question! Let's be honest, any serious conversation about issues more significant that who's mascot would win in a fight is going to go off the rails here. Mental health? It's challenging to find an informed and open minded discussion about that anywhere in our society, so the only mistake in Mongolia's post is thinking that s/he could find that here. They may have stated they did not understand mental illness, and that is fair, but then WHY follow up with the statement about people in America... It's like someone coming on this board and saying they don't really understand volleyball during a match thread, and then stating, "That player in the different colored jersey doesn't ever get kills. She should be replaced!"
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Jim Dietz
Freshman
"Neighbor is not a geographic term, it is a moral concept." Joachim Prinz, rabbi
Posts: 85
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Post by Jim Dietz on Jan 8, 2018 13:01:30 GMT -5
I never post, but mental health is worth an exception. I wrote this and shared it in a different volleyball forum two years ago. Mental health issues are sneaky problems.... *** Would you trade places with me?
Iām coach of a 40-6 record, ranked 4th in the country, made it all the way to the national title game, wound up Runner-Up, best performance in school history. Add to that a couple likely All-Americans, four all-region selections, the Conference Player of the Year and then me being honored as Conference Coach of the Year and an NJCAA District Coach of the Year. On top of that almost ZERO drama within the team, backed by great support from their parents, as well as my athletic department and the other coaches within our department. As far as a season goes, what a run, a thrill ride with 14 wonderful hard-working players that deserved every moment of success this year. This is the description of an almost perfect season, itās a dream season which any coach would enjoy.
Except I didnāt.
Yes, you read that correctly. I didnāt enjoy much of our season. It was a grind, it was miserableāthere was little joy in it. You can read that againāitās not mistyped and you didnāt read it wrong.
Iāve debated whether to post this, whether as an article or a blog-post, looking for reasons not to, mainly because this is personal, it affects meāitās real. Iāve revised my thoughts now several timesāso this is something like the tenth attempt, and it was this constant revision that made me realizeāyes, this is important, very important, because if this is something worth writing over and over, itās worth sharing.
There are tons of coaching articles about knees, elbows, ice or heat, physical health in general, but whenās the last time you saw someone discuss the subject of mental health out into the open. Itās a dirty subject. We talk about athletes needing to be toughābut what does that mean? Everyone says they support mental health issuesāand then Facebook-share posts saying ārepost this if you know someone who suffers from a mental health disorderā, as if that really does anything. You know whatāit doesnāt. I can share a dog picture just as easy and show as much true commitment. Then againādo you know anybody who suffers mental illness? Anyone willing to talk about it at all?
My mom, my sister, my wifeāall were/are health professionals, so Iām really aware of this sort of thing, the causes, the symptoms, the treatments. Thatās not me patting myself on the back. The opposite reallyābecause I know enough to be cocky, enough to thinkāthat would never happen to me.
Itās a long descent into depression. It went slow for meālike a frog in a pot with the temp gradually turned up until it boils to death and never notices it. HeckāI could justify a bunch of it BECAUSE of coachingā¦lack of sleep, weight gain (lot of fast food when out recruitingā¦), sore joints, or a lack of desire to do anything other than sleepāletās face it, good lazy days on a couch CAN be wonderful. It starts just a little at a timeā¦youāre the frog. And then youāre in denial, figuring you just need to push through the grind, that the mind can triumph over the bodyās weaknessānever thinking that itās your own mind that is the enemy. It all feels normal, no different than the day before, no need to worry about that water boiling all around you.
You can deny it by getting a doctor to treat things like energy or sleep. I changed my diet to more healthy food (including going vegetarian twice and giving up pop/caffeine twice as well), tried to live with a fixed sleep cycle, a bunch of little things to fix the lack of energy and willpower. It seemed to workābut those are the high points, the ones where depression takes its knee off your throat, stops turning up that pots temperatureā¦because sooner or later, the other shoeās going to drop and you head back down into a depressed state, and start the cycle of solutions or stages of despair once again. Sometimes that despair can cause suicidal thoughts. Iāve learned though that it isnāt at the bottom that you think about suicide reallyāitās on the way up from the bottom, when you start rising, the point where you still remember the thought but are regaining energy, have the power to take action. Donāt panicāIām not nor was I ever suicidalābut itās a scary thought to feel despondent and uncaring about your own personal situation, especially since I firmly believe that enough work, enough practice will make you successful. But not with this.
How can you tell? How do you know the difference between a bad day, just being tired, or if you have depression? Is that sudden surge of energy from being rested or are you manic? Are you cleaning your office because it is a mess or have you developed obsessive-compulsive disorder? Are you yelling at players because you are competitive or are you having rage issues? Heckāhow can you diagnose any of theseābecause everything is in your mind. You canāt, at least not right away. You just keep grinding ahead, letting doctors know how you are doing, trying different things to see what works, what doesnāt. Medicine is an art as much as it is a science and mental health issues are massively more complicatedābecause we are all unique, all individuals, so that what gives me respite will not necessarily work for anyone else.
Sure, I thought it was mentalāmental in the sense that it was just the grind of recruiting, coaching, the travel, the paperwork and that Iām not 25 anymore. Like I saidādenial. But thereās that frog boiling againāover Labor Day weekend, I realized it had been two months since I went on a ādateā with my wife. Of course, itās volleyball season, so thatās ānormal,ā right? But those little things started piling upāI stopped taking our dogs for walksā¦too much effort. I stopped helping with laundry and dishes--too tired. I stopped playing Xbox with my sonā¦again, too tired. Think about thatā¦too tired to sit and press buttons with my fingers. It got to the point that I didnāt even care to watch stuff on TV or anything elseātoo much effort, just easier to sleep or lay on a couch and do nothing.
Iām lucky. My wife is a health professional, I have friends who are as well. They saw the changes in me and said something, suggesting I could be suffering from depression. The fact I didnāt want to play board games or video games, watch violent movies, or have anything to do with volleyballā¦that was too much, so six weeks ago, I ābroke downā and got help---I finally realized they were right.
That realization created another big problem. I feel like Iām damaged somehow, that simply by writing this, I lessen who I am as a person, that others will read this and then if they meet me, think, āThatās that suicidal angst guyāsteer clear of him.ā At best, the feelingās that awkward one you go through junior high with when you are awkward in every which way, except now Iām an adult, Iāve lived it already and know it sucks. To get help, the afflicted person has to realize thereās a problem, and given the frog analogy, thatās hard to do. I didnāt realize any of this until now, this year, when, with hindsight, Iāve suffered this for years, maybe even most of adulthood in which case itās taken a quarter-century for me to realize thereās a problem.
What about others around you? Have you known them that long? If it isnāt obvious to me for 25 years, is it obvious to someone else after six months or two years or a decade? Do your players suffer from this? Think of the normal stress in a teenās lifeānow add in a mental illness. It can be overwhelming for a teen because every teen in the world is absolutely sure no one else has ever, EVER, gone through what they are experiencing. There are signs that something could be going on: mood swings, intense feelings, radical weight change, headaches, or choosing to use drugs, hoping for an escape from their feelings. I think itās a good checklist for adults, too. Do the signs mean they have something going on? Not necessarilyāletās face it, teens go through mood swings, body changes, etc. anyways, but those signs offer us a chance to let parents or qualified adults know whatās going on, so that they can check and see if the feelings are normal or symptomatic of a real health problem.
So how do you help? It dependsāand it can depend on you. I suppose the very first stepās admitting somethingās up, that thereās a problem. Itās easier said than doneāafter all, how many people like admitting they are wrong, especially to themselves? With a broken bone, itās an easy solutionāput it in a cast, let it heal. With mental health, depression, thereās no set solution, no perfect way to fix what could be a short-term problem or could be something Iāll live with the rest of my life. Thatās scary to think about. For me, I donāt like the idea of artificially chemically altering my body (other than with caffeine), so my doctorās working to minimize the need for drugs, hoping we can manage it through a substantially altered diet and a change in other habits (which may be tougher to deal with than medicineā¦). Thereās also talk-therapy which can get to the root of issues a different way, too, and it doesnāt work like you see on TVāI know that now. Ditto for pharmacological solutions. I just made the assumption that what Iād seen, what Iād read was the truth because I didnāt want to deal with any of it (thereās my denial again). If Iād accepted five years ago what I know now, maybe, just maybe, I wouldnāt have allowed myself to get to this point, forgetting to enjoy my amazing team, my loving family, and everything else awesome out there in the world.
Please, PLEASE, take mental health seriously. Problems arenāt always obvious, they are insidious, and often, maybe usually, hidden by those who suffer things like depression. Talk to my playersāthey wouldnāt think I was depressed. Watch videos of us, you wonāt think āHey, heās got depression,ā and youād never know it from me being out recruiting and talking to people with a smile, explaining why weāre one of the best college programs in the country. None of those people know. But itās there. And itās real. Please be more active than simply hitting āshareā on Facebook. Be honest with yourself and your own mental health, look out for your players and staff, and make sure they are all right. Pay equal attention to the mental health side of coaching and sports. Donāt wait, donāt be late realizing how important it is (my mistake). You can make a difference. I promise--I know.
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Jim Dietz
Freshman
"Neighbor is not a geographic term, it is a moral concept." Joachim Prinz, rabbi
Posts: 85
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Post by Jim Dietz on Jan 8, 2018 13:05:21 GMT -5
And this was my follow-up article written eleven months later in November, 2016:
So what about the intervening eleven months and seventeen days since I wrote that article? Well, with the help of friends, family, and our family doctor (who happens to also be a friend), we worked through as many avenues as possible regarding depression, exploring every possible-ism youāve heard of. I even went to counseling at a Wellness Center to see if my ādepressionā was an inability to express grief at the recent deaths of my mother or stepfather, or if it went back to the death of my dad back in ā89. It didnāt work. At that point, knowing my dislike for medication, my doctor eased me into trying a couple to help the situation. They made it worse. Thatās rightāworse. No fault on his part.
I think one of the things people donāt realize unless they are around doctors or nurses a ton is that medicine is every bit an art as it is a science. Think about your trainers, dealing with the physical side of injuries. Symptoms described for each athlete are different, so are pain tolerances, so is the athlete-coach-trainer communications dynamic. Art, not science.
We tried small doses, medium sized, switched meds, all done conscientiously before he determined that the situation needed a serious specialistāso off I went ninety minutes away to a psychiatrist. Dear God, noā¦someone whoās going to put me on a couch and ask about phallic symbols and if ink blots look like butterfliesā¦but the doc said this new doc was the best, used to teach it, do the research, and had thirty-five years experience. So I trusted him. Thereās something else important: Make sure youāre comfortable and trust the people involved in your health decisions.
What a surprise. None of that stuff. Instead, the first thing he did was make me go over my life and what Iād done over the past 10-15 yearsānot trying to probe for the Freudian or Kuebler-Ross stuff. It turns out he was looking from a completely different perspective. Fresh perspectives are often part of a solution, not the problem. When I finished, he started asking odd questions, specific ones: When did I start having trouble with sleep? How often did I cross time zone borders? ā¦things like that. And that last one is an interesting issue; you see, my ādepressionā hit its peak at Nationals last year, two weeks after the switch to Standard Time, and it was two time zones away from home, effectively slamming me three time zones one way, and two on the way back. Five zones in fourteen days.
Now all this was done in a single hour-long session. At the end of it, he tossed my file on his desk and said, āYour problem isnāt depression. Your problem is bio-chemistry.ā Yup, all this work to fight depression and it turns out that wasnāt what we shouldāve been fighting. The psychiatrist said not to blame my normal doc or other peopleāthey were following normal protocol, what fits for 80-90% of the people out there.
Instead, he noted that when this got bad for me in the spring of 2006, the time-switch slowed the growth of the membrane around my brain cells, so that they couldnāt regenerate fast enough to keep the cells functioning effectively (if you know me, youāre thinkingāthat explains a lotā¦hah hah). He described it as taking a dozen electrical wires, putting them close to one another without insulation, then watching sparks fly or electricity go between wires rather than straight ahead continuing through the connection; he explained thatās why my thoughts would jump, why theyād race at bedtime, why I would get massive migraines. It was lost energy which left me physically tired on top of everything. The only way those cells can regenerate is sleepāso I would sleep more (because the sleep was inefficient), but my brain could not catch up. The doctor proscribed a pill (turned out I was allergic to it and had to switch to a second)ānot for depression, but for epilepsy; the pill was designed to thicken cell membranes, what heād identified as my core problem.
We figured all this out in August. Iād have to do our two-a-day practices, drive to yet another city to meet with the doctor. It was rough trying to do everything, but that was another thing he noted. My body had grown used to the lesser exertions, so I needed to keep going, force my body to be as active as possible while the medications worked. So Iām trying that. Itās been four months and a couple days nowāand just as cool? He said that this is a physical issue, so that once the brain cell membranes are thick enough to regenerate normally, Iāll be able to be taken off the medication and go back to my normal pill-hating self. Iāve got eight months to go and I feel so much better.
If youāre having problemsāstick with it. Keep trying. If you know someone dealing with an issue like this, give them your love and support. You may never hear back āthank youā, but thatās awkward to say sometimesābut if they are a friend or they respect you, those words are in their heart where it matters. I know that.
So I guess that brings this to the end of the piece. Almost. My team qualified for our National Tournament again and itās still going on. Iām here writing this, burning off nervous energy, but mainly because people need to know that recovery from a mental condition can be no different ultimately than an ACL surgery. LLCC plays tonight in our second consecutive Final Four. Our #3 vs. #2. Weāre the underdogāand Iām excited. I want a crack at the title game. Yesterday in the Elite Eight, we came back from a 2-0 deficit to win in five. I was able to enjoy the confidence of my girls. I was able to let them play because that is who we are, itās how we roll, not because I was ambivalent or lacked energy. (Seriously, as of typing this, it is eight hours, twenty-six minutes until first whistleā¦weāre ready for this, players, coaches, and even the parents)
Iāve had some extra energyāenough to walk the dogs, go to Dad-Daughter Day at my daughterās womenās fraternity, and for the first time in my memory, Iāve gone weeks without a migraine (Iāve had two since August, rather than getting 3-4/week)
Please, PLEASE, take mental health seriously. Problems arenāt always obvious, they are insidious, and often, maybe usually, hidden by those who suffer things like depression, but they are there, and please donāt just āshareā on social media. Thatās crap and does nothing. Be honest with yourself and your own mental health, look out for your players and staff, and make sure they are all right. Worry equally about the mental health side of coaching and sports.
NOTE: With the medical stuff, Iām a writer and coach. The psychiatrist also explained everything in medical termsābut the electrical wiring was what I understood and stuck with me. I canāt really help with better medical explanations. Sorry. ā
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Post by BuckysHeat on Jan 8, 2018 13:14:49 GMT -5
I never post, but mental health is worth an exception. I wrote this and shared it in a different volleyball forum two years ago. Mental health issues are sneaky problems.... *** . You will not get a thumbs up or a like or whatever v-talk uses from me because that is not appropriate here. Instead, know that you have my heart felt appreciation for your honesty and best wishes. Thank you for posting.
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Post by shotcaller on Jan 8, 2018 23:21:30 GMT -5
Here's a question. And I want to ask this sincerely and in a careful and meaningful way, but I'm not sure how.
Is it possible that high level athletics are not for everyone? In a highly charged environment where there is a lot of pressure for constant improvement, both on the court and in the classroom, there are sure to be people who struggle with mental health issues. I am not calling this into doubt, nor am I suggesting the conversation should not be had. It is critical that we talk about these things.
But, does it not bring in to question the 'system' we have created? Why should everyone feel the need to perservere? It is ok to quit. You can still enjoy the game in a more social setting, removing the pressures and demands of being a student athlete.
Being a student athlete is not a right, it is a privilege, sometimes I feel like we smudge that line. Should we be catering to every individuals needs and neglecting the team, or catering to the team and expecting people to step into a team environment? The challege here is in the 'health' of the team environment...which I readily see and admit...but surely there comes a point in time where those who struggle to 'keep up with the team' are left behind?
One experience that I have had on several occassions is that of athletes who show all the 'markers' of mental health issues but refuse help or counselling, efforts are made to 'destigmatize' counselling, but yet they still refuse the help. What as coaches who are we to do in these situations? How can we help? What have people with more experience in this area than me done to help? We do have a responsibility to the individual to help them, but we have a great responsibility to the team. How do we find that balance?
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Post by vbnerd on Jan 9, 2018 12:49:47 GMT -5
? ? ? The poster asks a question, admitting s/he doesn't know the material, and instead of anyone offering answers or insight s/he is attacked for asking the question. If anyone wants to understand the rotting culture of volleytalk, that's it, right there. A LOT OF people don't understand mental illness. Many people don't want to talk about it, don't want to know, or dont't care, but here posters attack the person who asks for information instead of those who don't want to understand. Instead of "well, that's not really how mental illness works" we get "this has to be by far the most ignorant thing I've ever read on this site" - they were asking the question! Let's be honest, any serious conversation about issues more significant that who's mascot would win in a fight is going to go off the rails here. Mental health? It's challenging to find an informed and open minded discussion about that anywhere in our society, so the only mistake in Mongolia's post is thinking that s/he could find that here. "So why commit suicide when you have so much compared to many countries around the world?" That's the question you expect posters to answer in a critical yet thoughtful manner? Hmm I could also ask why would Ebony grieve for a dead friend when she has so much compared to citizens of many countries? I could literally go through every post on here and say well why do care about a loss or a win or the sport of volleyball when you have so much compared to other countries. The poster isn't really asking a question. I'm realistic. This is volleytalk. I don't expect anything to be answered in a critical yet thoughtful manner. However, I don't like to see people slinging feces at someone who may actually be looking for an answer. And you are more than welcomed to ask those questions if you like. I don't know what answers you'd get but hopefully they'd be more appropriate than what you offered.
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Post by alhorford90 on Jan 9, 2018 15:28:45 GMT -5
"So why commit suicide when you have so much compared to many countries around the world?" That's the question you expect posters to answer in a critical yet thoughtful manner? Hmm I could also ask why would Ebony grieve for a dead friend when she has so much compared to citizens of many countries? I could literally go through every post on here and say well why do care about a loss or a win or the sport of volleyball when you have so much compared to other countries. The poster isn't really asking a question. I'm realistic. This is volleytalk. I don't expect anything to be answered in a critical yet thoughtful manner. However, I don't like to see people slinging feces at someone who may actually be looking for an answer. And you are more than welcomed to ask those questions if you like. I don't know what answers you'd get but hopefully they'd be more appropriate than what you offered. I'm not a mental health practitioner but I am someone who has struggled with mental health issues since I was a child. My immediate response after reading Ebony's post was to wish her "health, healing, and peace." I'd prolly add joy as well. I never responded to Mongolia's post because 1. That's not my area of expertise ( Why Americans commit suicide when they have so much? I think you have to really commit to "first world" suicide rates versus the developing nations) and 2. I believe the premise is a fallacy. There are very poor Americans. There are homeless Americans. There are Americans that don't have clean water or food to eat. The conversation was about Ebony as an individual athlete struggling with mental health issues and then the broader conversation of mental health of collegiate and professional athletes. I didn't really think Mongolia's post came from a place of seeking knowledge. I actually felt it was the same wave of thoughtlessness that serves to devalue mental health issues and sweep them under a rug. "You have so much you shouldn't be sad" Though it did cause me to look up the statistics of suicide rates by country. "American's don't have rebel army's patrolling the streets so you shouldn't be sad" was a little bizzare if you truly wanted to know why people commit suicide in "first world" countries. I think you using the responses to Mongolia's post as evidence for the toxic culture of "calling out and shaming and cancelling (delegitimizing)" on Volleytalk is a bit misguided. It does happen frequently and is much more widespread than volleytalk. It's internet wide. But I don't think Mongolia's post is a rallying cry. My questions didn't need answers because they really weren't my questions. They were me extending what I saw to be Mongolia's premise across the board to demonstrate why that question as it was proposed lacks validity.
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Post by Factometer on Jan 10, 2018 17:23:35 GMT -5
I declare her fit for duty and this thread closed.
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