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Post by Mocha on Oct 7, 2019 11:58:15 GMT -5
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Post by kaygirl97 on Oct 9, 2019 21:28:39 GMT -5
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Post by Mocha on Oct 9, 2019 23:44:26 GMT -5
I now have a craving for Hot Pockets. π
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Post by mikegarrison on Oct 9, 2019 23:52:12 GMT -5
I now have a craving for Hot Pockets. π I can honestly say I have never craved a Hot Pocket. Probably related to never having even tasted a Hot Pocket. (I do generically like piroshkis, pasties, empanadas, tamales, samosas, bao, etc. etc. Every culture seems to have this same idea.)
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Post by Phaedrus on Oct 10, 2019 8:25:28 GMT -5
The is a quickie made for TV movie debuting on USA this Saturday focused on the two celebrity moms.
The people don't mess around
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Post by volleyguy on Oct 10, 2019 9:17:40 GMT -5
I now have a craving for Hot Pockets. π I can honestly say I have never craved a Hot Pocket. Probably related to never having even tasted a Hot Pocket. (I do generically like piroshkis, pasties, empanadas, tamales, samosas, bao, etc. etc. Every culture seems to have this same idea.) You're missing out, Garrison.
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Post by jake on Oct 10, 2019 13:32:37 GMT -5
I'm a little confused.
Does a private institution that receives Federal/State $$$ (i.e. Stanford/U.So Cal) come under the same recruiting requirements (scrutiny) as a public institution??? IOW,...can a student's parents buy their son or daughter a position on a school's volleyball team at a private school lawfully?
Anyone.
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Post by mikegarrison on Oct 10, 2019 13:36:24 GMT -5
I'm a little confused. Does a private institution that receives Federal/State $$$ (i.e. Stanford/U.So Cal) come under the same recruiting requirements (scrutiny) as a public institution??? IOW,...can a student's parents buy their son or daughter a position on a school's volleyball team at a private school lawfully? Anyone. I don't think the legal problems here are actually due to "buying a place into a university". They are due to doing it corruptly, with money "under the table".
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Post by volleyguy on Oct 10, 2019 13:54:43 GMT -5
I'm a little confused. Does a private institution that receives Federal/State $$$ (i.e. Stanford/U.So Cal) come under the same recruiting requirements (scrutiny) as a public institution??? IOW,...can a student's parents buy their son or daughter a position on a school's volleyball team at a private school lawfully? Anyone. I don't think the legal problems here are actually due to "buying a place into a university". They are due to doing it corruptly, with money "under the table". The legal charges actually have to do with both. Payments made, and other actions taken, in order to get a student admitted with falsified information or fraudulent intent resulted in a charge of "honest services fraud" and disguising the payment as a donation resulted in charges of tax evasion.
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Post by mikegarrison on Oct 10, 2019 15:36:02 GMT -5
I don't think the legal problems here are actually due to "buying a place into a university". They are due to doing it corruptly, with money "under the table". The legal charges actually have to do with both. Payments made, and other actions taken, in order to get a student admitted with falsified information or fraudulent intent resulted in a charge of "honest services fraud" and disguising the payment as a donation resulted in charges of tax evasion. What I'm saying is that if they just outright, with no fraud and no pretense that is was a beneficial donation, just said "I'll give you $1M if you'll let my kid in the school", then would it be illegal? It's not clear to me here where bribery ends and just making a legal purchase begins.
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Post by jake on Oct 10, 2019 16:01:13 GMT -5
The legal charges actually have to do with both. Payments made, and other actions taken, in order to get a student admitted with falsified information or fraudulent intent resulted in a charge of "honest services fraud" and disguising the payment as a donation resulted in charges of tax evasion. What I'm saying is that if they just outright, with no fraud and no pretense that is was a beneficial donation, just said "I'll give you $1M if you'll let my kid in the school", then would it be illegal? It's not clear to me here where bribery ends and just making a legal purchase begins. Right! When a public institution takes a large donation in exchange to have their kid placed on that's schools, i.e., volleyball team, is that fraud? Now,...that same scenario, except, the donation goes to a private institution who receives tax payers $$$ for research work. Is that also fraud? I have always assumed a private institution is exempt from criminal action when everything is done openly. This may not apply as soon as the private institution receives/accepts tax payers (or public) $$$ for doing work.
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Post by pepperbrooks on Oct 10, 2019 16:10:27 GMT -5
The legal charges actually have to do with both. Payments made, and other actions taken, in order to get a student admitted with falsified information or fraudulent intent resulted in a charge of "honest services fraud" and disguising the payment as a donation resulted in charges of tax evasion. What I'm saying is that if they just outright, with no fraud and no pretense that is was a beneficial donation, just said "I'll give you $1M if you'll let my kid in the school", then would it be illegal? It's not clear to me here where bribery ends and just making a legal purchase begins. You're correct. If they hadn't defrauded the admissions system by falsely claiming to be athletes, and the parents had just "Here's money, get my kid in," there would have been no problem.
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Post by mikegarrison on Oct 10, 2019 16:24:00 GMT -5
What I'm saying is that if they just outright, with no fraud and no pretense that is was a beneficial donation, just said "I'll give you $1M if you'll let my kid in the school", then would it be illegal? It's not clear to me here where bribery ends and just making a legal purchase begins. You're correct. If they hadn't defrauded the admissions system by falsely claiming to be athletes, and the parents had just "Here's money, get my kid in," there would have been no problem. That's not quite what I'm saying either. Let's consider a purely for-profit school. They let anybody in. You show up, pay your money, and start your classes. There is absolutely nothing illegal about this. Now let's take a "selective" school. If you walk up to the admissions officer and say, "I'll pay you $100K if you make sure my kid gets in", that's bribery. Why? It's because you are subverting the admissions officer from doing his/her job fairly. You are paying them essentially to *not* do the job that the school is already paying them to do. But if the school has an announced, open policy that anyone who pays the school $1M will get in as a student, and then any remaining places will be available on a selective basis, would that be illegal? I think not. Jake's question about public versus private schools gets to another idea, which is that public schools are generally set up to serve the public fairly and equally, which usually is not intended to mean "the rich first, and everybody else second". So some things may be illegal for them due to the charter they are operating under, but might not be illegal for a school that is not operating under that sort of charter.
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Post by ciscokeed on Oct 10, 2019 16:59:08 GMT -5
Hell they can make a better salary welding. Letβs support trade schools!
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Post by dunninla3 on Oct 10, 2019 17:11:26 GMT -5
The interesting thing, regarding human nature, is that I personally know a family that donated $10M to a top 10 school that they've had connections with for three decades, and what do you know, their child was admitted. When this Varsity Blues came down, they didn't think for a second that they were part of a broader problem. And perhaps they weren't. It's not a "problem" if it is simply a natural and normal part of how the world works. Their attitude was -- Oh wow, can you believe what those people did?
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