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Post by moderndaycoach on Sept 19, 2023 14:34:01 GMT -5
This honestly is a great move for her and where she stands with herself, it is obvious her head is all over the place and we all know you can not compete at a high level if you aren't 100% there to begin with. She may find herself some opportunity to be back around a "team" environment where she likely feed off that comradery and different kinds of support from a group rather than being basically 1 on 1 with a coach and trainer. This may present another opportunity to learn how to lead again and gain some confidence back. If the bigs don't shake out accordingly, perhaps there is even potential to find a diamond big in the rough playing in the league a la Alix, although much more unlikely with the explosion of college beach. The first part simply isn't true, throughout the history of sports there are dozens of examples of players competing and winning while distracted, less than fully committed etc. But why is it a good move anyway? She goes from competing against, and to be, the best in the world to playing a level which will likely be lower than college indoor. And for lower middle class money. She could go get a teaching certificate and make more. If we take money out of the equation the point of sports is to compete and win, not to be in a trust circle and do choreographed high fives in front of 412 fans in Grand Rapids. Like your criticism of Kerri this is a heavily gendered take. No chance Miles Partain making the same decision would have been applauded the same way I swear you argue just for the sake of arguing. This is a good move for her, she is clearly not winning or playing her best while distracted. Those that do win while distracted are a minority and usually very special and motivated cases. We have seen that she is not winning or playing at a high level while distracted, and the fact she keeps bringing it up, only solidifies that this is a good decision for her personally. Once again your evaluation of talent is just absolute trash, without question I respect your knowledge and history of the game, but if there is one thing for sure you have absolutely zero eye for talent/player evaluation or seeing beyond the surface. Lower level than college, please, it may not be the level of international pro play, but the level of play of these leagues is still going to be a high level of play and they would handle the majority of college teams, perhaps simply just off veteran experience while also still being extremely physically capable. Also where are you getting these teaching numbers from? Teachers are quitting because the paychecks are basically poverty, you want to tell me she could go make more money being a manager of a Jimmy Johns sure I might believe you, but certainly not more than a teacher with 60k base, sponsorships, and a potential pot split for wining while also goin back to play the AVP. The point is she is not winning, and she is struggling to figure out how to get back there, if she was winning a change wouldn't be made. The fact you so easily dismiss her trying something else to get her head right in and offseason while also making extra money is crazy and disrespectful. But I am sure you would dog her just as hard if she decided to keep compounding negative thoughts while playing poorly saying how far she fell off or something ridiculous. Also I am pretty confident it would probably be the same split of opinion if Miles was not winning either and tried switching things up to correct it, but they are in totally different situations so your random hypothetical is nothing more than goalpost moving to validate your argument. And KWJ is old and young players who are the next generation of fans don't know who she is, get over it.
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Post by haze on Sept 19, 2023 15:08:55 GMT -5
LOVB seems to have much better names associated with it. Not sure of the money but will be interesting which becomes the alpha league
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Post by ajm on Sept 19, 2023 15:40:11 GMT -5
She won't be able to keep her international points without a documented medical issue or pregnancy. Actions speak louder than words. I don't think she's walking away from beach. But it sure looks like she's walking away from high-level international beach as her primary professional volleyball goal. If that weren't the case, she'd be playing in World Champs, which she qualified for. Nothing wrong with that if she's no longer interested. I must be missing where she is going to stop playing international competition for an extended period of time. What is the timeframe she would be gone for her to lose ALL her points? Because my understanding of this is she is going to play indoor in the offseason for some extra cash. I guess it depends on what you mean by offseason. Is August, September, and October considered offseason? Not when those are the biggest events of the FIVB and AVP season. Maybe she got a huge signing bonus from the Grand Rapids Rise, who knows? What about February through May, the months the PVF is supposed to be playing? In 2023, there were four Elite16s and three Challengers, five of which Sponcil played. Oh, and she earned $22.5K during those months. I wouldn't consider that offseason either, at least not internationally. Her last event was in July, so assuming she's taking a break from beach until at least June 2024, she'll have to play three FIVB events in June and July to avoid losing entry points. Then August/September will be AVP Gold Series, then back to offseason again? I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens, but my read is that she's planning to significantly cut back on international beach play.
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Post by moderndaycoach on Sept 19, 2023 15:53:27 GMT -5
I must be missing where she is going to stop playing international competition for an extended period of time. What is the timeframe she would be gone for her to lose ALL her points? Because my understanding of this is she is going to play indoor in the offseason for some extra cash. I guess it depends on what you mean by offseason. Is August, September, and October considered offseason? Not when those are the biggest events of the FIVB and AVP season. Maybe she got a huge signing bonus from the Grand Rapids Rise, who knows? What about February through May, the months the PVF is supposed to be playing? In 2023, there were four Elite16s and three Challengers, five of which Sponcil played. Oh, and she earned $22.5K during those months. I wouldn't consider that offseason either, at least not internationally. Her last event was in July, so assuming she's taking a break from beach until at least June 2024, she'll have to play three FIVB events in June and July to avoid losing entry points. Then August/September will be AVP Gold Series, then back to offseason again? I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens, but my read is that she's planning to significantly cut back on international beach play. What is the qualifications for losing points, as in how long is the breakpoint where she would have to completely start over? _____ “I want to play PVF but AVP is just as much on my radar to go out there and play the sport that I love. That love hasn’t gone away but this opportunity I couldn’t say no especially with my eyes being opened to another joy I have, which is indoor,” Sponcil said. “I can’t say no to an opportunity like this. I’m just as excited for both, and to be able to do both, I’m grateful for it. To be able to do both is a dream. “I’m just taking things one opportunity at a time. Obviously Paris [2024 Olympic Games] and the FIVB, I won’t be playing in those tournaments, but once the next quad hits I can’t say that I won’t go back to the beach. I’m still interested in both but this is where I’m at right now.” Joining the PVF, she said, is the “best of both worlds,” where she can play on the AVP mostly full-time and keep her sand legs in shape come qualifying time for the Los Angeles 2028 Games, should she choose to pursue them. Any fans disappointed they won’t see the best defensive player in the country on the sand any longer can save their disappointment: Sponcil will be back on the sand, and is “looking forward to getting a new partner” in the summer of 2024. ____ Again, I go back to her mentals. She is obviously very self aware what she is doing is not working and needs to change it up for the betterment of herself. I can't see her intentionally putting herself in a bad spot if she seriously is considering making a run at L.A.
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Post by pepperclove on Sept 19, 2023 17:18:16 GMT -5
Except almost no one thought that the reason that Sponcil's team wasn't winning was Sponcil's play. Unless I missed something in the most recent tournaments, Cannon not being good enough was the problem with that team, not Sponcil being distracted. Sure, Sponcil probably could have played better at times, but her play was definitely not the team's biggest issue.
I also think landing a top partner becomes difficult if there are questions about her commitment to beach, which clearly there are.
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Post by haze on Sept 19, 2023 20:42:57 GMT -5
Way to much over analyzing this imho.
To me, the season didn't go how she wanted, she's frustrated, she's also dealing with some things in life, an opportunity came up that really doesn't interfere either her career, she plays in a different environment the sport she still loves, she continues playing AVP. She comes back for the next quad refreshed and renewed.
What's the big deal?
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Post by thevolleybaker on Sept 20, 2023 0:39:29 GMT -5
I take offense, Michigan is great in the winter, for about a month, when there is new snow and it’s pretty. But the skiing is subpar, and the wind chill sucks, and feb-April are cold wet and ugly, and damn, I may see your point. But I still resent you pointing it out to me. Only people live in Michigan like the winters there, and it's only about half of the people that live there. I've spent half my life living in winters like those, amd quite honestly it isn't bad, but then middle of January hits, and you still realize you have at least 2 and a half more months before seeing any nice temperatures starts weighing on you It does have the largest Chaldean community in the U.S. and our weddings are pretty fun if you can score an invite 😉
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Post by dunninla3 on Sept 20, 2023 0:45:09 GMT -5
My take is that Sponcil just got tired of grinding it out for 5th and 9ths with a substandard partner. There are plenty of uber competitive athletes that would have pulled the plug after the disaster in Phoenix, but Sponcil carried on, until now. Cancil by and large only podiumed in events where most of the top teams didn't play.
Anyone is free to disagree but I saw Sponcil at times in late 2021 play the equal of Schoon, Duda, certainly better than Mel or Mariafe, entering the argument for best little in the world. This is because she reworked her attack game, something I think Davenport can take credit for influencing, as it was her weakness prior. Imagine Tom Brady playing for a team with fumble fingered receivers and a line that couldn't protect him from getting sacked 6 times a game. That had to suck.
Carrying a partner on your back might not seem like much for the first 20 paces, but by pace 200 you're exhausted and about to collapse. But it was her best option in Spring 2021. Immediately I was pulling my hair out at how poorly Cannon played and their very low finishes.
So, Sponcil has decided to pull the plug on the failed experiment. She can regroup mentally, have actual fun playing Indoor for a few months, then initiate plan B for LA 2028 Beach cycle.
Alix is the best bet at the moment, but that is only a bet, and for whatever reason Alix and Sponcil did not choose to play with each other as the WC team for Worlds. That makes me wonder whether Alix is really committed to Beach, or not.
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Post by guest2 on Sept 20, 2023 5:05:41 GMT -5
The first part simply isn't true, throughout the history of sports there are dozens of examples of players competing and winning while distracted, less than fully committed etc. But why is it a good move anyway? She goes from competing against, and to be, the best in the world to playing a level which will likely be lower than college indoor. And for lower middle class money. She could go get a teaching certificate and make more. If we take money out of the equation the point of sports is to compete and win, not to be in a trust circle and do choreographed high fives in front of 412 fans in Grand Rapids. Like your criticism of Kerri this is a heavily gendered take. No chance Miles Partain making the same decision would have been applauded the same way I swear you argue just for the sake of arguing. Also where are you getting these teaching numbers from? Teachers are quitting because the paychecks are basically poverty, you want to tell me she could go make more money being a manager of a Jimmy Johns sure I might believe you, but certainly not more than a teacher with 60k base, sponsorships, and a potential pot split for wining while also goin back to play the AVP. This is you in a nutshell. Someone makes a point that counters something you said. Now that point happens to be based on easily available information since most teachers in the US are public employees and their salaries are known. Do you: a) spend 30 seconds on a google search that will tell you that I am right and you are wrong? b) dispute the point Anyone who has read any of your posts knows exactly what you will do. Its like you are allergic to learning or trying to.
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Post by moderndaycoach on Sept 20, 2023 8:39:33 GMT -5
I swear you argue just for the sake of arguing. Also where are you getting these teaching numbers from? Teachers are quitting because the paychecks are basically poverty, you want to tell me she could go make more money being a manager of a Jimmy Johns sure I might believe you, but certainly not more than a teacher with 60k base, sponsorships, and a potential pot split for wining while also goin back to play the AVP. This is you in a nutshell. Someone makes a point that counters something you said. Now that point happens to be based on easily available information since most teachers in the US are public employees and their salaries are known. Do you: a) spend 30 seconds on a google search that will tell you that I am right and you are wrong? b) dispute the point Anyone who has read any of your posts knows exactly what you will do. Its like you are allergic to learning or trying to. So seems like just a back and forth pot calling the kettle black over here. There is a teacher shortage for a reason, also why we have wackjobs that are hired because we simply can not find anyone else. If Sponcil were to quit volleyball today, spend the time getting a teaching degree, then getting a first year teaching job, she would be losing money and be lucky to be making 45k before taxes. Not in the least allergic to learning, but also not going to cherry pick facts to support my argument and pretend like there is no dispute to the nonsense.
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Post by moderndaycoach on Sept 20, 2023 8:57:16 GMT -5
My take is that Sponcil just got tired of grinding it out for 5th and 9ths with a substandard partner. There are plenty of uber competitive athletes that would have pulled the plug after the disaster in Phoenix, but Sponcil carried on, until now. Cancil by and large only podiumed in events where most of the top teams didn't play. Anyone is free to disagree but I saw Sponcil at times in late 2021 play the equal of Schoon, Duda, certainly better than Mel or Mariafe, entering the argument for best little in the world. This is because she reworked her attack game, something I think Davenport can take credit for influencing, as it was her weakness prior. Imagine Tom Brady playing for a team with fumble fingered receivers and a line that couldn't protect him from getting sacked 6 times a game. That had to suck. Carrying a partner on your back might not seem like much for the first 20 paces, but by pace 200 you're exhausted and about to collapse. But it was her best option in Spring 2021. Immediately I was pulling my hair out at how poorly Cannon played and their very low finishes. So, Sponcil has decided to pull the plug on the failed experiment. She can regroup mentally, have actual fun playing Indoor for a few months, then initiate plan B for LA 2028 Beach cycle. Alix is the best bet at the moment, but that is only a bet, and for whatever reason Alix and Sponcil did not choose to play with each other as the WC team for Worlds. That makes me wonder whether Alix is really committed to Beach, or not. Exactly, Sponcil is in the age group of long time club players that likely have played volleyball or multiple sports year round since they were little. These kids who are all now approaching 30 are getting burned out, if it is playing, if it is coaching, even those that went into high pressure jobs that are working them the only way the know how and have been taught from high level sports for most of their life. Go back and look at the 30 under 30 list for the last 10 years and count how many aren't coaching anymore. I think this is the best decision she could make for herself, sometimes the hardest decision is the right now.
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Post by poorlambourne on Sept 20, 2023 10:16:23 GMT -5
I swear you argue just for the sake of arguing. Also where are you getting these teaching numbers from? Teachers are quitting because the paychecks are basically poverty, you want to tell me she could go make more money being a manager of a Jimmy Johns sure I might believe you, but certainly not more than a teacher with 60k base, sponsorships, and a potential pot split for wining while also goin back to play the AVP. This is you in a nutshell. Someone makes a point that counters something you said. Now that point happens to be based on easily available information since most teachers in the US are public employees and their salaries are known. Do you: a) spend 30 seconds on a google search that will tell you that I am right and you are wrong? b) dispute the point Anyone who has read any of your posts knows exactly what you will do. Its like you are allergic to learning or trying to. $60k is more than the average teacher salary in Grand Rapids. Also, the PVF season is only five months. LA teachers just won a pretty significant pay increase, but PVF + AVP + FIVB + sponsorships + USAV stipend pays more. If you also include giving lessons at ~$100/hr she can make good money.
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Post by moderndaycoach on Sept 20, 2023 10:33:44 GMT -5
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Post by alwaysmoreangle on Sept 20, 2023 10:44:19 GMT -5
Haaaa, I’m not gonna say anything Why? Pavan was a better beach player than Sponcil and so much better at indoor there isn't even a comparison. And unlike Sarah, who quit when she couldn't get a good partner, Sarah stuck it out with Bansley, who was lousy, played with Mel as she redefined inconsistency, then tried Sophie and is now playing with a partner way below her level despite being 37. Sarah is a example of the dedication to the sport that Sponcil just doesn't have. Pavan would be the best available partner if she follows through on playing only AVP for the next few years Calling Bansley lousy is a bit much and Pavan's situation was a bit different from Sponcil's. Pavan has always been a top two Canadian team and thus never had to battle against quota system restrictions. Sponcil taking a step back to re-evaluate and adjust her short term career track shouldn't be labeled quitting with such derision when it may in fact be the most prudent thing for her to do.
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Post by occasionallystupid on Sept 20, 2023 10:45:04 GMT -5
My take is that Sponcil just got tired of grinding it out for 5th and 9ths with a substandard partner. There are plenty of uber competitive athletes that would have pulled the plug after the disaster in Phoenix, but Sponcil carried on, until now. Cancil by and large only podiumed in events where most of the top teams didn't play. Anyone is free to disagree but I saw Sponcil at times in late 2021 play the equal of Schoon, Duda, certainly better than Mel or Mariafe, entering the argument for best little in the world. This is because she reworked her attack game, something I think Davenport can take credit for influencing, as it was her weakness prior. Imagine Tom Brady playing for a team with fumble fingered receivers and a line that couldn't protect him from getting sacked 6 times a game. That had to suck. Carrying a partner on your back might not seem like much for the first 20 paces, but by pace 200 you're exhausted and about to collapse. But it was her best option in Spring 2021. Immediately I was pulling my hair out at how poorly Cannon played and their very low finishes. So, Sponcil has decided to pull the plug on the failed experiment. She can regroup mentally, have actual fun playing Indoor for a few months, then initiate plan B for LA 2028 Beach cycle. Alix is the best bet at the moment, but that is only a bet, and for whatever reason Alix and Sponcil did not choose to play with each other as the WC team for Worlds. That makes me wonder whether Alix is really committed to Beach, or not. Exactly, Sponcil is in the age group of long time club players that likely have played volleyball or multiple sports year round since they were little. These kids who are all now approaching 30 are getting burned out, if it is playing, if it is coaching, even those that went into high pressure jobs that are working them the only way the know how and have been taught from high level sports for most of their life. Go back and look at the 30 under 30 list for the last 10 years and count how many aren't coaching anymore. I think this is the best decision she could make for herself, sometimes the hardest decision is the right now. I actually think this is a big problem that is only gonna grow more endemic. The youth sports culture is downright stupid anymore, regardless of sport. Between the rise of year round aau leagues trying to rake in the cash and every parent thinking they have to get their kid to specialize early and treat their children like future olympians it has gotten just unreal. In addition to future burnout I think it has led to a ton of issues that will only compound. First, the amount of overuse and repetitive stress injuries from early specialization and overtraining in sport has exploded. I know dozens that have had to have major surgeries and have chronic injuries that will be with them for life. A lot of times inexperienced coaches will copy workouts or intensities used by pros despite the injury risk to kids who are still growing. Or use crazy conditioning as a substitute to actually teaching good technique. Second, from a mental health standpoint it can be crushing as you have little else to fall back on. Third it creates a culture with parents that breeds crazy unreal expectations, just because you paid for your kid to be on a travel team doesn’t make them taller or more talented. Sorry for the rant but I do think this is only gonna get worse. And this is all without diving into all the other potential for abuse in youth sports.
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