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Post by goGopherBill on Feb 8, 2011 15:34:37 GMT -5
I d be more upset if he wasn't considered..and I can find out.
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Post by bkedane on Feb 8, 2011 18:07:16 GMT -5
I d be more upset if he wasn't considered..and I can find out. He wasn't considered. I do not know, but you can check, whether he submitted an application or letter of interest. |
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Post by ugopher on Feb 8, 2011 21:29:02 GMT -5
I posted this on the Jobs thread, but thought it was relevant here too. Scott Swanson visited South Carolina recently about their vacancy. I figured with the rash of posts hoping he lands on his feet, that people here would be interested in this information. Ah, he did not visit SC about their vacancy. Hopes to, but nothing yet. |
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Post by abugslife on Feb 9, 2011 1:00:16 GMT -5
I posted this on the Jobs thread, but thought it was relevant here too. Scott Swanson visited South Carolina recently about their vacancy. I figured with the rash of posts hoping he lands on his feet, that people here would be interested in this information. Ah, he did not visit SC about their vacancy. Hopes to, but nothing yet. I have to agree with you ugopher on that one. Scott did not visit SC as of yet. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 2:09:38 GMT -5
. . . However, you can not tell me that this is a fatal path when it has already worked elsewhere. The right coach will come in and maintain what Mike is leaving and get recruits to continue the success just like Elliot did when he was at USC and Mick was still with the national team. Hugh can even help his cause by inviting the top high school kids to national team workouts just like Mick did. Those kids were not trying out for the national team, they were trying out for USC. After two years with an interim coach, USC won mulitple national championships. Forgive my ignorance here, which I freely admit, but would Hugh be inviting top high school kids in for a tryout at the same times of the year, and with the same frequency that any coach of a Division 1 women's team could invite them in for a tryout? And would Hugh's contact with them count against Minnesota's limits on recruiting contacts? Would Hugh become a "representative of Minnesota's athletic interests" during the interim period. If not, why not? |
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Post by Keystonekid on Feb 9, 2011 6:16:10 GMT -5
. . . However, you can not tell me that this is a fatal path when it has already worked elsewhere. The right coach will come in and maintain what Mike is leaving and get recruits to continue the success just like Elliot did when he was at USC and Mick was still with the national team. Hugh can even help his cause by inviting the top high school kids to national team workouts just like Mick did. Those kids were not trying out for the national team, they were trying out for USC. After two years with an interim coach, USC won mulitple national championships. Forgive my ignorance here, which I freely admit, but would Hugh be inviting top high school kids in for a tryout at the same times of the year, and with the same frequency that any coach of a Division 1 women's team could invite them in for a tryout? And would Hugh's contact with them count against Minnesota's limits on recruiting contacts? Would Hugh become a "representative of Minnesota's athletic interests" during the interim period. If not, why not? Hugh could and will have unlimited access to hs kids who are training in usa programs and coaches are already unhapy about that |
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Post by Phaedrus on Feb 9, 2011 6:52:04 GMT -5
Hugh could and will have unlimited access to hs kids who are training in usa programs and coaches are already unhappy about that But again, there is a precedence with Mick Haley and USC. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 7:12:56 GMT -5
Forgive my ignorance here, which I freely admit, but would Hugh be inviting top high school kids in for a tryout at the same times of the year, and with the same frequency that any coach of a Division 1 women's team could invite them in for a tryout? And would Hugh's contact with them count against Minnesota's limits on recruiting contacts? Would Hugh become a "representative of Minnesota's athletic interests" during the interim period. If not, why not? Hugh could and will have unlimited access to hs kids who are training in usa programs and coaches are already unhapy about that I'm confused about how that could be. Here are a few rules (or at least what I believe are the rules -- they came from the NCAA website, but they may be out of date, or incomplete): "13.02.13 Recruiting. Recruiting is any solicitation of a prospective student-athlete or a prospective student-athlete's relatives (or legal guardians) by an institutional staff member or by a representative of the institution's athletics interests for the purpose of securing the prospective student-athlete's enrollment and ultimate participation in the institution's intercollegiate athletics program." "13.02.14 Representative of Athletics Interests. A "representative of the institution's athletics interests" is an individual, independent agency, corporate entity (e.g., apparel or equipment manufacturer) or other organization who is known (or who should have been known) by a member of the institution's executive or athletics administration to: (Revised: 2/16/00) (a) Have participated in or to be a member of an agency or organization promoting the institution's intercollegiate athletics program; (b) Have made financial contributions to the athletics department or to an athletics booster organization of that institution; (c) Be assisting or to have been requested (by the athletics department staff) to assist in the recruitment of prospective student-athletes; (d) Be assisting or to have assisted in providing benefits to enrolled student-athletes or their families; or (e) Have been involved otherwise in promoting the institution's athletics program." "13.01.4 Recruiting by Representatives of Athletics Interests. Representatives of an institution's athletics interests (as defined in Bylaw 13.02.13) are prohibited from making in-person, on- or off-campus recruiting contacts, or written or telephonic communications with a prospective student-athlete or the prospective student-athlete's relatives or legal guardians. Specific examples of exceptions to the application of this regulation are set forth in Bylaw 13.1.2.2 (see Bylaw 13.1.3.5.1.1)." If Hugh takes this job, why isn't he a "Representative of Athletics Interests," and as such, prohibited from making contacts per 13.01.04? Is there an exception for the National Team? |
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Post by karellen on Feb 9, 2011 7:21:44 GMT -5
Until he signs a contract, he is not a Minnesota coach. Therefore, NCAA rules do not apply.
NCAA DI coaches can not work athletes out (try outs) during the recruiting process, so the fact that Hugh can train kids, get to know them and - more importantly - they can get to know him, could be a huge advantage.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 7:41:44 GMT -5
Until he signs a contract, he is not a Minnesota coach. Therefore, NCAA rules do not apply. NCAA DI coaches can not work athletes out (try outs) during the recruiting process, so the fact that Hugh can train kids, get to know them and - more importantly - they can get to know him, could be a huge advantage. I don't understand why, if there were, in fact, a verbal agreement between Hugh and Minnesota for Hugh to become Head Coach in two years (and I have absolutely no knowledge as to whether there is or isn't such an agreement, or will or won't be such an agreement), would not fit within the subsection (e) of the definition of Representative of Athletics Interests: . If there were such an agreement, Hugh certainly would be promoting Minnesota's athletic interests by agreeing to become its coach in two years. The fact that it wasn't a written agreement might be the out, but that sounds like a "wink wink, nod nod" situation that is unfair, and that I can appreciate that some would want the NCAA would address. |
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Post by Keystonekid on Feb 9, 2011 7:55:21 GMT -5
Until he signs a contract, he is not a Minnesota coach. Therefore, NCAA rules do not apply. NCAA DI coaches can not work athletes out (try outs) during the recruiting process, so the fact that Hugh can train kids, get to know them and - more importantly - they can get to know him, could be a huge advantage. I don't understand why, if there were, in fact, a verbal agreement between Hugh and Minnesota for Hugh to become Head Coach in two years (and I have absolutely no knowledge as to whether there is or isn't such an agreement, or will or won't be such an agreement), would not fit within the subsection (e) of the definition of Representative of Athletics Interests: . If there were such an agreement, Hugh certainly would be promoting Minnesota's athletic interests by agreeing to become its coach in two years. The fact that it wasn't a written agreement might be the out, but that sounds like a "wink wink, nod nod" situation that is unfair, and that I can appreciate that some would want the NCAA would address. Pretty cut and dry, he cant be held to the NCAA rules that institutions must follow, if he isnt an employee of an institution. While I dont believe he will be talking to kids in the USA pipeline about coming to Minnesota (ethical issue IMO) he will be developing relationships with those kids, and yes, that is a huge advantage. Hugh is a great coach, but there are several great coaches in that league. If you expect him to walk in and out recruit, out coach, Cook, Rose, Hambly etc..... I think youre mistaken. |
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Post by bkedane on Feb 9, 2011 8:10:07 GMT -5
I don't understand why, if there were, in fact, a verbal agreement between Hugh and Minnesota for Hugh to become Head Coach in two years (and I have absolutely no knowledge as to whether there is or isn't such an agreement, or will or won't be such an agreement), would not fit within the subsection (e) of the definition of Representative of Athletics Interests: . If there were such an agreement, Hugh certainly would be promoting Minnesota's athletic interests by agreeing to become its coach in two years. The fact that it wasn't a written agreement might be the out, but that sounds like a "wink wink, nod nod" situation that is unfair, and that I can appreciate that some would want the NCAA would address. Pretty cut and dry, he cant be held to the NCAA rules that institutions must follow, if he isnt an employee of an institution. While I dont believe he will be talking to kids in the USA pipeline about coming to Minnesota (ethical issue IMO) he will be developing relationships with those kids, and yes, that is a huge advantage. Hugh is a great coach, but there are several great coaches in that league. If you expect him to walk in and out recruit, out coach, Cook, Rose, Hambly etc..... I think youre mistaken. I think you're right that McCutcheon will have quite a bit of freedom that other coaches don't. But the explanation can't simply be that it's because he's not an employee of the institution. Most people who count as "representatives of an institution's interests" aren't employees (most get the classification from 13.02.14a) of the institution and yet institutions are on the NCAA hook for the activities of those individuals. This situation, I think, is covered by the NCAAs understanding of National Team situations. But maybe Bearclause can clear things up? |
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Post by karellen on Feb 9, 2011 8:28:51 GMT -5
"Representatives" have a connection to the university based on membership in a booster club, former athlete, former manager, employee, alumni, etc..... Hugh has none of those connections at this time to the best of my knowledge.
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Post by vbnerd on Feb 9, 2011 8:41:50 GMT -5
I don't know the hows and whys, but there is an "olympic exception" that traditionally covers all of the coaches in the HP program, which is volleyball's "Olympic Pipeline." Activity conducted in the execution of their duties for the HP pipeline are exempt from NCAA oversight.
Look at the holiday camp for example, they are working with and evaluating kids, off campus, during the dead period, and those are coaches who are currently working for other schools.
Hugh is the head of the olympic pipeline, and presumably would not be "active" with Minnesota, so why wouldn't he be extended the same courtesy? Now, if he starts inserting himself as the head tryout coach at every HP tryout, I could see some eyebrows being raised, but if he shows up at SoCal and Minnesota, where he'll have homes, then that would be appropriate.
Next Issue. Russ Rose says that winning college volleyball matches is a skill that is separate from being successful on the international level. Will Hugh be likely to train his UM teams for international success, which he knows well, or will he make the adjustment to gear his drills and strategies to maximizing the team's potential in the Big 10?
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Post by itsallrelative on Feb 9, 2011 8:47:33 GMT -5
I don't know the hows and whys, but there is an "olympic exception" that traditionally covers all of the coaches in the HP program, which is volleyball's "Olympic Pipeline." Activity conducted in the execution of their duties for the HP pipeline are exempt from NCAA oversight. Look at the holiday camp for example, they are working with and evaluating kids, off campus, during the dead period, and those are coaches who are currently working for other schools. Hugh is the head of the olympic pipeline, and presumably would not be "active" with Minnesota, so why wouldn't he be extended the same courtesy? Now, if he starts inserting himself as the head tryout coach at every HP tryout, I could see some eyebrows being raised, but if he shows up at SoCal and Minnesota, where he'll have homes, then that would be appropriate. Next Issue. Russ Rose says that winning college volleyball matches is a skill that is separate from being successful on the international level. Will Hugh be likely to train his UM teams for international success, which he knows well, or will he make the adjustment to gear his drills and strategies to maximizing the team's potential in the Big 10? And, can he do it in 20 hours/week in the season, and the limited spring rules??? The other question is recruiting...with the national team, you have to evaluate who you want. Most of those players will play on the national team, as it will increase their earning potential if they play overseas... with a college team, you have to evaluate who you want, then, persuade a 15-16 year old to come to your school (while a Russ Rose, Kevin Hambley Jerrit Elliot, Mick Haley, et al. is trying to persuade them to go to their school). Make a mistake or two, and all of a sudden, you're no longer winning games, and it becomes even tougher. Hugh would definately be a daring choice...but, it will be interesting to watch. |
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