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Post by stevieofmb on Jan 22, 2014 17:45:26 GMT -5
I just saw Tri Bourne and Casey Jennings practicing together in Manhattan Beach. Is this a new team since Doherty is now supposedly teaming with Lucena rather than Jennings? Is John Hyden retiring?
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Post by ronnielott on Jan 23, 2014 10:03:46 GMT -5
I was hoping CJ would pick up Bourne after getting last second duped (I use the work duped although it made total sense for Nick/Ryan to pair up from an FIVB points standpoint) by Doherty. The word I heard was that after Doherty decided to go with Nick last minute CJ then assumed he would go with Brunner only to have Brunner pick Todd Rodgers (why play with Todd at this point?) So that left CJ the odd man out. Glad to hear CJ picked up Bourne as he seems to be improving and is young. I think they can get some decent results. Not sure about Hyden...
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jan 23, 2014 11:51:06 GMT -5
I would assume the only reason for this is because Hyden didn't want to play international and CJ does?? (Bourne too)
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Post by guest2 on Jan 23, 2014 13:02:40 GMT -5
I was hoping CJ would pick up Bourne after getting last second duped (I use the work duped although it made total sense for Nick/Ryan to pair up from an FIVB points standpoint) by Doherty. The word I heard was that after Doherty decided to go with Nick last minute CJ then assumed he would go with Brunner only to have Brunner pick Todd Rodgers (why play with Todd at this point?) So that left CJ the odd man out. Glad to hear CJ picked up Bourne as he seems to be improving and is young. I think they can get some decent results. Not sure about Hyden... So Nick actually dumped Theo for Ryan? WOW! Theo was a much better blocker than Ryan statistically so I wonder what it is that Nick thinks he can get from Ryan but not Theo (probably international points WHICH IS WHY THE FIVB ENTRY SYSTEM IS SO MUCH BS!!!!) Ryan is a better server. Are there other advantages I am not seeing, definitely not the most pro-Ryan guy out there. Also why Theo then goes to Todd (I know they are buddies but still) over Casey or someone younger, I have no idea. Id like to see Tri Bourne take a shot at playing defense. It would be a struggle but he is young and very athletic and down the road could be part of a Jake/Casey type team. |
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Post by klazk on Jan 23, 2014 13:16:53 GMT -5
it made total sense for Nick/Ryan to pair up from an FIVB points standpoint Not sure I agree with this. Lucena only has 106 more FIVB points than Jennings. And if Doherty had stuck with Jennings, the only person Nick could have teamed with to knock Doherty/Jennings into the qualifier would have been Rogers (which wasn't going to happen). Additionally, Jennings has a lot worse finishes to drop, so he had the ability to gain additional entry points faster than Lucena with identical finishes. Jennings has that 2nd from Sao Paulo that is going to bolster his points for at least 6 more tournaments. So unless they know something about a change in entry points calculation that hasn't been made public yet, that argument doesn't really seem to hold water. |
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Post by volleyballjim on Jan 23, 2014 13:38:37 GMT -5
LOVE the "Ryan", but man, his ball control is still AA at times, I swear (Was that JUST my few views of him with Todd?)....Casey is so solid, I'd have to take Casey/Ty ANY day over Lucena/Ryan....
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Post by ronnielott on Jan 23, 2014 21:16:05 GMT -5
it made total sense for Nick/Ryan to pair up from an FIVB points standpoint Not sure I agree with this. Lucena only has 106 more FIVB points than Jennings. And if Doherty had stuck with Jennings, the only person Nick could have teamed with to knock Doherty/Jennings into the qualifier would have been Rogers (which wasn't going to happen). Additionally, Jennings has a lot worse finishes to drop, so he had the ability to gain additional entry points faster than Lucena with identical finishes. Jennings has that 2nd from Sao Paulo that is going to bolster his points for at least 6 more tournaments. So unless they know something about a change in entry points calculation that hasn't been made public yet, that argument doesn't really seem to hold water. Yeah, I'm not the expert on points but I heard Nick/Ryan wouldn't have to be in the country quota matches. The reason may be is because this year country quotas are being held in the U.S. which gives up to 4 teams a chance to make it. So the Nick/Ryan pairing gives them enough points so they don't have to deal with the quota where they could easily lose out to any of the 3 other teams. Apparently CJ/Ryan pairing would have had them battling in the country quota matches. Correct me if I'm wrong, again this is what I've heard... |
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Post by klazk on Jan 24, 2014 6:22:17 GMT -5
I have no inside knowledge in terms of FIVB changing entry rules.
Doherty/Jennings or Doherty/Lucena would be the 3rd best US team in terms of the current points system. So a scenario where one would be in a new format of CQ where the other would not seems unlikely to me.
BUT FIVB has done stranger things.
I just wish that if there were new entry/CQ rules that FIVB would release them.
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Post by guest2 on Jan 24, 2014 7:40:50 GMT -5
it made total sense for Nick/Ryan to pair up from an FIVB points standpoint Not sure I agree with this. Lucena only has 106 more FIVB points than Jennings. And if Doherty had stuck with Jennings, the only person Nick could have teamed with to knock Doherty/Jennings into the qualifier would have been Rogers (which wasn't going to happen). Additionally, Jennings has a lot worse finishes to drop, so he had the ability to gain additional entry points faster than Lucena with identical finishes. Jennings has that 2nd from Sao Paulo that is going to bolster his points for at least 6 more tournaments. So unless they know something about a change in entry points calculation that hasn't been made public yet, that argument doesn't really seem to hold water. I think the points are relevant to why Nick would go with Ryan instead of Theo. In terms of Ryan choosing Nick over Casey, that's really just commons sense because Nick is a much better player than Casey at this point in their careers. This far from the start of the season, when a player who is clearly superior to your partner asks you to play, I think you have to go with the better player, and here that is Nick. Casey had a couple great finishes last year (Manhattan and Sao Paolo) but when not playing with Phil, hasn't finished higher than 5th on the FIVB since 2010 and didn't finish higher than 5th, other than Manhattan, on the AVP last year. Casey can still bring it once in a while, but he has been on the decline for a while now. He'll be 39 mid summer and last year really felt like a last hurrah for him. |
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jan 24, 2014 8:13:43 GMT -5
Not sure I agree with this. Lucena only has 106 more FIVB points than Jennings. And if Doherty had stuck with Jennings, the only person Nick could have teamed with to knock Doherty/Jennings into the qualifier would have been Rogers (which wasn't going to happen). Additionally, Jennings has a lot worse finishes to drop, so he had the ability to gain additional entry points faster than Lucena with identical finishes. Jennings has that 2nd from Sao Paulo that is going to bolster his points for at least 6 more tournaments. So unless they know something about a change in entry points calculation that hasn't been made public yet, that argument doesn't really seem to hold water. Yeah, I'm not the expert on points but I heard Nick/Ryan wouldn't have to be in the country quota matches. The reason may be is because this year country quotas are being held in the U.S. which gives up to 4 teams a chance to make it. So the Nick/Ryan pairing gives them enough points so they don't have to deal with the quota where they could easily lose out to any of the 3 other teams. Apparently CJ/Ryan pairing would have had them battling in the country quota matches. Correct me if I'm wrong, again this is what I've heard... that's kind of cool! |
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Post by guest2 on Jan 24, 2014 14:30:32 GMT -5
Yeah big well done to the FIVB for that. Should benefit domestic tours if they schedule the same weekend as the FIVB too, because fewer teams will travel
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Post by msg on Jan 27, 2014 16:27:50 GMT -5
Patience will be the key for Casey Jennings next run at the Olympics. I believe with the current system (it could be changing as I am writing this) Norceca's count as WT points. I heard Josh Binstock say that you can play Norceca until you reach 1600 WT points. Norceca finishes I am sure count for less than WT finishes but it is still something. With that said USA can start 6-7 teams deep in international competition and have teams outside the top 4 Bourne/Jennings Keenan/Mayer maybe guys like Stafford and Will play together gain international points through the Norceca system and wait their turn for WT events. An injury here or there and players that grind Norcecas can find themselves well positioned in the big leagues later in the season
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Post by guest2 on Jan 27, 2014 16:31:27 GMT -5
Patience will be the key for Casey Jennings next run at the Olympics. I believe with the current system (it could be changing as I am writing this) Norceca's count as WT points. I heard Josh Binstock say that you can play Norceca until you reach 1600 WT points. Norceca finishes I am sure count for less than WT finishes but it is still something. With that said USA can start 6-7 teams deep in international competition and have teams outside the top 4 Bourne/Jennings Keenan/Mayer maybe guys like Stafford and Will play together gain international points through the Norceca system and wait their turn for WT events. An injury here or there and players that grind Norcecas can find themselves well positioned in the big leagues later in the season Divine intervention will be the key for Casey's next run at the Olympics. |
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Post by klazk on Jan 27, 2014 21:10:37 GMT -5
950 would be the most points an individual could get from NORCECAs under current system. That would include winning the continental final at end of season. Without that final 840 would be the most.
So 1600 maybe for a team but not an individual.
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