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Post by LuckyVB on Jan 5, 2004 23:27:57 GMT -5
I stand corrected. You're right Wolfgang. Liotta was in "Field of Dreams". Wasn't he in "GoodFellas" too or am I completely out of it?
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Post by LuckyVB on Jan 5, 2004 23:30:51 GMT -5
One more comment. I would think that someone with as much money as Selig could get a better haircut.
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Post by Gorf on Jan 6, 2004 0:10:38 GMT -5
I'm not a Pete Rose fan, and hell, I'm not even a baseball fan. I wouldn't know an infield double if it hit me in the face with a shovel. But, there's nothing wrong with gambling or betting. We do it all the time. When we run a yellow light, we're betting that it won't turn red before we cross that intersection or that there's no cop around to catch you. When we put money in that stock or mutual fund, we're speculating that we won't lose it all. As long as people understand that casino gambling and sports betting are designed so that the house almost always wins, it's not a problem to me. Except blackjack and a few other games, the player has very little advantage over the house. Whenever I got to Vegas, I play blackjack and my only goal is to win enough to cover the cost of my trip. Of course, I can afford the trip myself, but it's just fun to play this way. So what if Rose bet on baseball? As long as he didn't let it interfere with his play on the field and impair his judgment, then I have no problems with it. If, however, there are conflict of interest issues, there may be a problem. There's a pretty good movie on baseball and betting. It's called "Eight Men Out" and it stars, I believe, John Cusack. An excellent movie. Many of the guys bet on baseball, including the playoff games they played, but they could never prove that they "threw" the games. Their stats were incredible. I've been a Pete Rose fan since the days of my youth watching the Red on the telly. That said, the issue is not whether gambling is good or bad, legal or illegal. It is against the MLB rules, has been against the rules for a long time. Pete was fully aware that his gambling was against the rule and he knew exactly what the penalties would be if he was caught gambling on baseball. It may be the case that the penalties for gambling on baseball (especially if betting on your own team) are harsher than the penalties paid by other players for what could easily be considered worse acts in baseball, but that doesn't alter the fact that the penalties for gambling ought to be well known by players and other folks involbed with MLB teams. |
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Post by Gorf on Jan 6, 2004 0:13:01 GMT -5
Still, Bull Durham is the best baseball flick. Harold Robbins was terrific. I did like Bull Durham but I thought Bang The Drum Slowly was a better movie. |
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Post by Gorf on Jan 6, 2004 0:14:25 GMT -5
One more comment. I would think that someone with as much money as Selig could get a better haircut. I'm sure he could get a better hair cut but perhaps he doesn't care to get one. |
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Post by Wolfgang on Jan 6, 2004 0:32:11 GMT -5
I stand corrected. You're right Wolfgang. Liotta was in "Field of Dreams". Wasn't he in "GoodFellas" too or am I completely out of it? Yes, Ray Liotta was in "Goodfellas," one of my favorite movies of all time. Loved the part where he rails on his babysitter. He was also in "Corrina, Corrina," one of the most underrated movies and unseen movies of all time. Great flick. He was also the FBI guy in "Hannibal" who got a lobotomy and had portions of his brains cooked by Mr. Hannibal Lecter himself. Ray was also in "Narc," another great flick. In short, he's a pretty good actor. |
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Post by Gorf on Jan 6, 2004 0:51:08 GMT -5
Did you know that "flick" was sometimes used in comic books as a "swear word"? It seems in the "old days" before the priting processes were significantly improved the "L" and the "I" when hand written a bit extra close to each other appeared to bleed together when printed to form another letter (the last vowel that isn't the "sometimes Y".) |
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Post by FormerDICoach on Jan 6, 2004 2:14:43 GMT -5
Growing up in Cincinnati, I was a HUGE Big Red Machine fan. Every Saturday that the Reds were in town, we were at Riverfront Stadium cheering for Morgan, Geronimo, Perez, Foster, Gullett, Concepcion. I absolutely LOVED the competitive nature of all those athletes, Pete included. I admit that I have lost a lot of respect for Pete. His egotistical behavior has turned away quite a few fans. But selflessness is not a requirement for induction. (The HOF would be almost empty if they removed the players with an ego problem!)
I believe Pete should be inducted into the HOF based on his accomplishments on the field as a player. His gambling (which is LEGAL, as opposed to the dealers, rapists, druggies, and steroid-poppers) occured as a manager, which shouldn't have any bearing on his nomination. -just my opinion-
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Post by cougarize on Jan 6, 2004 2:58:51 GMT -5
Growing up in Cincinnati, I was a HUGE Big Red Machine fan. Every Saturday that the Reds were in town, we were at Riverfront Stadium cheering for Morgan, Geronimo, Perez, Foster, Gullett, Concepcion. I absolutely LOVED the competitive nature of all those athletes, Pete included. I admit that I have lost a lot of respect for Pete. His egotistical behavior has turned away quite a few fans. But selflessness is not a requirement for induction. (The HOF would be almost empty if they removed the players with an ego problem!) I believe Pete should be inducted into the HOF based on his accomplishments on the field as a player. His gambling (which is LEGAL, as opposed to the dealers, rapists, druggies, and steroid-poppers) occured as a manager, which shouldn't have any bearing on his nomination. -just my opinion- Personally I don't want to see Pete Rose get in, he's just a dirty man who is all about himself. But DIcoach is right and his accomplishments should get him in, as much as I hate to say it, you can't deny the facts. |
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Post by Overlycheerful on Jan 6, 2004 3:10:01 GMT -5
I did like Bull Durham but I thought Bang The Drum Slowly was a better movie. Neither DeNiro nor Michael whatshisface were believable as baseball players. This is America, however, and you are entitled to your misguided opinions--as long as you don't repeat that mistake you made with lederhosen. Moriarty. Michael Moriarty. Guthrie alumnus. Your neck of the woods. |
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Post by Overlycheerful on Jan 6, 2004 3:15:01 GMT -5
He was also in "Corrina, Corrina," one of the most underrated movies and unseen movies of all time. Great flick. Whoopi as a romantic lead didn't make you cringe? The little girl in that movie was great. She was also in that Meg Ryan-Andy Garcia movie. Great in that one, too. As for Liotta, don't forget Operation Dumbo Drop.I meant Something Wild. |
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Post by cougarize on Jan 6, 2004 3:20:24 GMT -5
Why don't we stick to the topic or to volleyball at least? You can exchange your useless banter in other ways in other places. ;D
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Post by Overlycheerful on Jan 6, 2004 3:30:04 GMT -5
I agree! All you folks posting useless banter, stop it! Stop it now!
Didja hear Ray Davies was shot in The French Quarter Monday?
I hear he had to have it removed.
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Post by The Bofa on the Sofa on Jan 6, 2004 9:01:23 GMT -5
The truth is that you can be a rapist or a drug dealer/addict and get into the hall of fame. It seems pretty hypocritical to single out gambling. It has to do with the integrity of the game. Gambling threatens that. The things you mention don't. Thus, from a baseball standpoint, THEY need to control gambling, because society doesn't. So they have. |
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Post by The Bofa on the Sofa on Jan 6, 2004 9:10:08 GMT -5
I believe Pete should be inducted into the HOF based on his accomplishments on the field as a player. Why shouldn't we consider his time as a manager, too? We do for everyone else (who does both). It's just that in most cases, performance as a manager has little effect on the total package (Joe Torre is probably an exception, where his playing days were not quite HOF caliber, but his managing time easily puts him in). OTOH, Rose's actions as a manager are not quite as mundane as most. The HOF takes the whole package. The person is inducted into the HOF. BTW, although gambling is LEGAL in society, it is EPLICITLY prohibited by MLB. Every player knows this. Rule 21(d) is posted for everyone to see inside every clubhouse. Pete knew what he was doing was wrong. He knew the consequences (it is in the rule). He just decided that it didn't apply to him. |
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