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Post by digdugg on Sept 7, 2014 12:55:40 GMT -5
Despite their best finish of the year, I do not see this team staying together. They seem like they hate each other - Carambula's body language was a joke - did not even care they were getting pasted. No high fives on effort plays between each other, heads hangin low. They did not even talk after the match. Carambula is more talented then Camacho but seem to be basically the same dude...
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Post by klazk on Sept 7, 2014 20:25:22 GMT -5
Carambula is more talented then Camacho but seem to be basically the same dude... I don't think so. I admit his on court demeanor leaves something to be desired at times. But there are plenty of other times I've seen him and Slick talking and going over strategy in a professional manner. Adrian also has helped other teams in the past by giving advice and coaching. A couple years ago in cincy he stayed after being eliminated to give a sky ball demonstration and lesson to both adults and kids. He then went and played six on six with a bunch of volunteers and some other players. Would Camacho do any of those things?
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Post by vballjj on Sept 8, 2014 7:36:39 GMT -5
Dana would with some incentive
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Post by digdugg on Sept 8, 2014 8:09:01 GMT -5
Carambula is more talented then Camacho but seem to be basically the same dude... I don't think so. I admit his on court demeanor leaves something to be desired at times. But there are plenty of other times I've seen him and Slick talking and going over strategy in a professional manner. Adrian also has helped other teams in the past by giving advice and coaching. A couple years ago in cincy he stayed after being eliminated to give a sky ball demonstration and lesson to both adults and kids. He then went and played six on six with a bunch of volunteers and some other players. Would Camacho do any of those things?
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Post by guest2 on Sept 8, 2014 8:13:31 GMT -5
Dana and Adrian definitely have some similarities in terms of the way they sometimes behave when behind in matches, Nick Lucena does it too. Its sort of a continuum of bad behavior though. Dana is an extreme case though.
I do dispute that Adrian is more physically talented than Dana. Adrian is a little bit taller, but not much, and I dont see another area where Adrian has a physical advantage, at least not an innate one. The only reason Dana hasnt enjoyed as much success as Adrian is his personality (although cutting his teeth on big court probably didnt help)
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Post by digdugg on Sept 8, 2014 8:14:24 GMT -5
klazk - that is good info on Carambula - then he definitely is not Camacho. I would like to see this team stay together. I am impressed w/ slick's passing - they both set really well - slick jumps super well and should be a more dominant block which I think is what Adrian is so frustrated with...Adrian looks like he was in better physical shape last year...I don't know though...was anyone there to see that match in person? Body language seemed to indicate that this partnership has a serious and, perhaps, irreparable rift...
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Post by guest2 on Sept 8, 2014 8:22:47 GMT -5
Some partnerships succeed despite that. Smith/Stoklos were notorious for saying some pretty nasty stuff to each other and they did fairly well.
I think Adrian probably gets frustrated because Stafford had so much talent and sometimes its like he isnt there. For a guy like Adrian, who in many ways has maximized his talent (although there is still room to improve in some areas) that has to be frustrating. Adrian would be insane to dump Slick though. What conceivable partner could he get who would be close to as good
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Post by digdugg on Sept 8, 2014 8:24:45 GMT -5
guest2 - my comment re: talent was more in regards to results. I don't think you could argue that Adrian's results in the AVP are certainly better - I believe he has two semifinals and a few quarterfinals just in the last two years w/ slick and, in non-AVP 2012, got a 2nd and 3rd w/ Grotowski and Halverson...Dana's highest finish is 13th (twice)...I guess you could say that Dana in his prime with the beforementioned partners may have yielded same results but I am not so sure...
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Post by digdugg on Sept 8, 2014 8:31:51 GMT -5
Adrian would be insane to dump Slick though. What conceivable partner could he get who would be close to as good I agree. I was thinking Slick would do the dumping although I am not sure that would be wise either based on crop of players to replace Carambula... Although (and it wont happen), but Carambula / Brunner would be a dynamic and interesting pairing...
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Post by Semp12 on Sept 8, 2014 8:35:27 GMT -5
They may hate each other on the court time to time, but 3rd place is still 3rd place. Guys in general can put the "drama" on the side and stick it out for results.
Edit: Adrian also has the better past results, but again, gets hated on because he is far from a stereotypical looking beach volleyball player. Not considering which position has an excess of players (blockers vs. defenders) I would say Adrian has more proven success with a variety of athletes and can continue to do so at a high level.
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Post by guest2 on Sept 8, 2014 9:08:41 GMT -5
guest2 - my comment re: talent was more in regards to results. I don't think you could argue that Adrian's results in the AVP are certainly better - I believe he has two semifinals and a few quarterfinals just in the last two years w/ slick and, in non-AVP 2012, got a 2nd and 3rd w/ Grotowski and Halverson...Dana's highest finish is 13th (twice)...I guess you could say that Dana in his prime with the beforementioned partners may have yielded same results but I am not so sure... I dont think he would have done as well either (although he did get that second at Manhattan with Strickland). I was referring to physical talent as in, jump, agility, etc. Dana's attitude would prevent him from both getting and keeping those partners so even if he did play with Slick or Grotowski, he wouldnt be able to keep them. I do think Slick will eventually dump Adrian, but the only good option out there (meaning a player who could conceivably win, but is not already with a partner superior to Slick, is Casey Jennings and he and Slick already had a run together. Definitely agree with Semp12 about guys being able to put aside personal animosity when the results are coming. I saw Crabb playing some defense on Sunday and I wonder whether a Slick/Crabb team might have some potential. If Slick could avoid the mental issues that would be a hard team to score on
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Post by crawdaddy on Sept 8, 2014 9:14:14 GMT -5
Speaking of potential defenders, what's the other Crabb brother doing? Has he been competing on the beach this summer at all and how is his beach game?
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Post by JB Southpaw on Sept 8, 2014 9:41:51 GMT -5
Adrian put in serious effort this off season in training. At the beginning of the AVP season, Adrian looked in very good shape compared to years previous. (just my thoughts here, no info to back these coming statements up) There could be some outstanding animosity between them in the way this year has gone. Slick decided to play internationally with Montgomery & also that 1st AVP. They don't train together, Adrian stays in FL, Slick in CA.
Who would dump who for who??
They only player Adrian could really upgrade with is Theo, which Theo was committed to playing FIVB so I think that is out. Also not moving to CA. hurts his chances IMO. Slick could have some options, but not sure any would be better than Adrian. I'd love to see him team with Casebeer & let Jeremy play back row.
Next year is lining up for some changes:
-Todd and Casey J. may hang it up (Todd should, Casey a little up in the air since this lets him earn $ along side his wife) -Young players like Drost & Crabb will have good main draw points. -Some younger guys like DelSol, Hatcher, Paullin & Kessel get more training in.
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Post by JB Southpaw on Sept 8, 2014 9:43:52 GMT -5
Speaking of potential defenders, what's the other Crabb brother doing? Has he been competing on the beach this summer at all and how is his beach game? Taylor has been hovering around the National indoor team as the 3 or 4th OH. I think he just signed w/ a good French pro team: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/54210/taylor-crabb-arago-de-sete
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Post by guest2 on Sept 8, 2014 11:17:55 GMT -5
Something interesting in that video is that in the first game when its close, Phil/Rosie could not do a thing with Slick when he swung hard, but every time he shot the ball they picked it up. I think Slick needs to play to his physical advantages more. One thing I keep thinking is "why is Theo better than him?" There is no physical reason for it. Its just mental
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