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Post by n00b on Jan 4, 2018 16:14:21 GMT -5
Essentially, one-in-three. Wow. It's been 1 in 4-ish in recent years. This was a spike. We'll see if it's an outlier or the new normal. Is the 10 medical retirements a spike as well? That seems like a lot. |
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Post by ned3vball on Jan 4, 2018 16:29:01 GMT -5
Of the 99 Senior Aces from the HS class of 2014 that just graduated, a full THIRTY-TWO(!!!!) transferred schools, or otherwise quit or medically retired prior to 4 years of play. That's the first time a class has broken 30 since I've been monitoring. The class of 2015 is currently at 24; however, there's still a lot of offseason left and several rumored departures in that group. Attrition is even worse at the D3 level where players do not need to chase the scholarship. I monitor the NESCAC league. Over the last 8 years, 88 classes, 388 freshman, only 217(55.93%) lasted 4 years. Pick a school you like in general, not just for volleyball. edit: I should add I think a very, very, small number transfer at D3 level, they just move on to other things. the general point remains, playing 4 years of a college varsity sport is a tough trick. |
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Post by n00b on Jan 4, 2018 16:38:28 GMT -5
Of the 99 Senior Aces from the HS class of 2014 that just graduated, a full THIRTY-TWO(!!!!) transferred schools, or otherwise quit or medically retired prior to 4 years of play. That's the first time a class has broken 30 since I've been monitoring. The class of 2015 is currently at 24; however, there's still a lot of offseason left and several rumored departures in that group. Attrition is even worse at the D3 level where players do not need to chase the scholarship. I monitor the NESCAC league. Over the last 8 years, 88 classes, 388 freshman, only 217(55.93%) lasted 4 years. Pick a school you like in general, not just for volleyball. So perhaps early recruiting isn't the root of the problem like many seem to think. It seems like kids are more apt to transfer today regardless of how their recruiting process happened. Payton Caffrey was a very late commit to West Virginia. That didn't help. |
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Post by Heisenberg on Jan 4, 2018 17:11:59 GMT -5
Attrition is even worse at the D3 level where players do not need to chase the scholarship. I monitor the NESCAC league. Over the last 8 years, 88 classes, 388 freshman, only 217(55.93%) lasted 4 years. Pick a school you like in general, not just for volleyball. So perhaps early recruiting isn't the root of the problem like many seem to think. It seems like kids are more apt to transfer today regardless of how their recruiting process happened. Payton Caffrey was a very late commit to West Virginia. That didn't help. I’m not familiar with her recruiting process. Did she have a bunch of other good options? Could have taken it for other reasons other than it being her favorite school/coach? Just playing devil’s advocate. |
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Post by Brutus Buckeye on Jan 4, 2018 20:15:23 GMT -5
Of the 99 Senior Aces from the HS class of 2014 that just graduated, a full THIRTY-TWO(!!!!) transferred schools, or otherwise quit or medically retired prior to 4 years of play. That's the first time a class has broken 30 since I've been monitoring. The class of 2015 is currently at 24; however, there's still a lot of offseason left and several rumored departures in that group. Attrition is even worse at the D3 level where players do not need to chase the scholarship. I monitor the NESCAC league. Over the last 8 years, 88 classes, 388 freshman, only 217(55.93%) lasted 4 years. Pick a school you like in general, not just for volleyball. edit: I should add I think a very, very, small number transfer at D3 level, they just move on to other things. the general point remains, playing 4 years of a college varsity sport is a tough trick. Yes, it's very frustrating. I have a few D3 schools nearby, and they each recruit a class of 8-12 players. Two or three might stick around all four years. It's not always the benchwarmers that quit either. Sometimes it's the star players. Injuries, time consumption, sparse crowds, etc take their toll. |
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Post by c4ndlelight on Jan 4, 2018 20:30:08 GMT -5
Attrition is even worse at the D3 level where players do not need to chase the scholarship. I monitor the NESCAC league. Over the last 8 years, 88 classes, 388 freshman, only 217(55.93%) lasted 4 years. Pick a school you like in general, not just for volleyball. So perhaps early recruiting isn't the root of the problem like many seem to think. It seems like kids are more apt to transfer today regardless of how their recruiting process happened. Payton Caffrey was a very late commit to West Virginia. That didn't help. I think it's apples and oranges - most players going D3 are going for the school and not a scholarship or to play volleyball. Just because someone commits late doesn't mean she wasn't impacted by early recruiting. The landscape changes for a late commit (especially a late bloomer) with so many scholarships spoken for by junior year. |
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Post by ProfessorPlum on Jan 4, 2018 20:40:41 GMT -5
So perhaps early recruiting isn't the root of the problem like many seem to think. It seems like kids are more apt to transfer today regardless of how their recruiting process happened. Payton Caffrey was a very late commit to West Virginia. That didn't help. I think it's apples and oranges - most players going D3 are going for the school and not a scholarship or to play volleyball. Just because someone commits late doesn't mean she wasn't impacted by early recruiting. The landscape changes for a late commit (especially a late bloomer) with so many scholarships spoken for by junior year. I was about to post it’s like apples and car batteries. Spot on. And Payton was a 2017 Club kid but a 2016 recruit. That’s a factor on her timing! |
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Post by shesasetter on Jan 5, 2018 0:44:28 GMT -5
To be fair, I don’t think anyone realized the impact she was going to have her freshman campaign. So she’s not really the best example to use in criticizing his recruiting methods. It’s more of an example of the overall flawed recruiting system based solely on the technicals. Anyone that watched the Open level for this age group develop from 12-18 years old knew Payton would make an impact at the college level. Absolutely a no brainer. So I would say your statement is correct in that it shouldn’t be applied just to Poole, but very incorrect when saying “I don’t think anyone realized...”. she was like a high school all American...3rd team. Not exactly obvious. |
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Post by ProfessorPlum on Jan 5, 2018 8:27:21 GMT -5
It’s more of an example of the overall flawed recruiting system based solely on the technicals. Anyone that watched the Open level for this age group develop from 12-18 years old knew Payton would make an impact at the college level. Absolutely a no brainer. So I would say your statement is correct in that it shouldn’t be applied just to Poole, but very incorrect when saying “I don’t think anyone realized...”. she was like a high school all American...3rd team. Not exactly obvious. Just stop. HS AA list? 90% of those lists are regurgitated garbage. High School lists are absolutely the worst. I was talking about club and she was one of the stars on a Top 5 Open team. My point was that if you watched or coached in the age groups open division for 6 years you knew Payton Caffrey was a no brainer impact player at the next level. It certainly worked against her, as noted by others, that she was one year ahead of her club class in high school. She may not of had a lot of offers because of this and because many top programs just recruit technicals like height, reach & ups. They don’t recruit intangibles, like heart, focus, coachability, hard work, competiveness, etc. I get the reason why. They don’t have time and NCAA restricts ability to evaluate intangibles and 6’5” athletic without intangibles is still pretty good. Failure rate is much less. But that’s the point! I’m not working off lazy recruiting or some regurgitated HS AA list. I watched this age group for 6 years and anyone that did is not surprised at all that Payton knocked it out of the park at WVA. The surprise for those of us that watched her development in club was that WVA was her best offer to start with. That is my point. It’s only a surprise to the recruiters that never watched her because she didn’t check enough technical boxes but they look in their own gym and the 6’3” lengthy OH is sitting at the end of the bench using a schollie. Some of these Payton examples and the 6’3” examples you can see from a million miles away if you know the kids, their intangibles and have actually seen them play and develop! Unfortunately the system doesn’t allow coaches to evaluate that. Chris Poole is getting another swing at it. Good for him and Payton. |
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Post by ProfessorPlum on Jan 5, 2018 8:40:17 GMT -5
I think it's apples and oranges - most players going D3 are going for the school and not a scholarship or to play volleyball. Just because someone commits late doesn't mean she wasn't impacted by early recruiting. The landscape changes for a late commit (especially a late bloomer) with so many scholarships spoken for by junior year. I was about to post it’s like apples and car batteries. Spot on. And Payton was a 2017 Club kid but a 2016 recruit. That’s a factor on her timing! And D3 sports is an admissions tool. Many coaches have admissions quotas. They are judged on how many kids they bring into the school. That’s the #1 goal. It’s a totally different dynamic that would totally warp the attrition rate, either by transfer or by the more likely retirement. It’s not really a debate that early recruiting is a problem. The very people that created seem to know it’s not good for either the athlete or the programs but finding a workable solution to fix it is the issue. |
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Post by dgo on Jan 5, 2018 8:46:27 GMT -5
she was like a high school all American...3rd team. Not exactly obvious. Just stop. HS AA list? 90% of those lists are regurgitated garbage. High School lists are absolutely the worst. I was talking about club and she was one of the stars on a Top 5 Open team. My point was that if you watched or coached in the age groups open division for 6 years you knew Payton Caffrey was a no brainer impact player at the next level. It certainly worked against her, as noted by others, that she was one year ahead of her club class in high school. She may not of had a lot of offers because of this and because many top programs just recruit technicals like height, reach & ups. They don’t recruit intangibles, like heart, focus, coachability, hard work, competiveness, etc. I get the reason why. They don’t have time and NCAA restricts ability to evaluate intangibles and 6’5” athletic without intangibles is still pretty good. Failure rate is much less. But that’s the point! I’m not working off lazy recruiting or some regurgitated HS AA list. I watched this age group for 6 years and anyone that did is not surprised at all that Payton knocked it out of the park at WVA. The surprise for those of us that watched her development in club was that WVA was her best offer to start with. That is my point. It’s only a surprise to the recruiters that never watched her because she didn’t check enough technical boxes but they look in their own gym and the 6’3” lengthy OH is sitting at the end of the bench using a schollie. Some of these Payton examples and the 6’3” examples you can see from a million miles away if you know the kids, their intangibles and have actually seen them play and develop! Unfortunately the system doesn’t allow coaches to evaluate that. Chris Poole is getting another swing at it. Good for him and Payton. As someone who watched this age group in club for a lot of years, I agree with this entirely. |
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Post by Heisenberg on Jan 5, 2018 10:19:05 GMT -5
she was like a high school all American...3rd team. Not exactly obvious. Just stop. HS AA list? 90% of those lists are regurgitated garbage. High School lists are absolutely the worst. I was talking about club and she was one of the stars on a Top 5 Open team. My point was that if you watched or coached in the age groups open division for 6 years you knew Payton Caffrey was a no brainer impact player at the next level. It certainly worked against her, as noted by others, that she was one year ahead of her club class in high school. She may not of had a lot of offers because of this and because many top programs just recruit technicals like height, reach & ups. They don’t recruit intangibles, like heart, focus, coachability, hard work, competiveness, etc. I get the reason why. They don’t have time and NCAA restricts ability to evaluate intangibles and 6’5” athletic without intangibles is still pretty good. Failure rate is much less. But that’s the point! I’m not working off lazy recruiting or some regurgitated HS AA list. I watched this age group for 6 years and anyone that did is not surprised at all that Payton knocked it out of the park at WVA. The surprise for those of us that watched her development in club was that WVA was her best offer to start with. That is my point. It’s only a surprise to the recruiters that never watched her because she didn’t check enough technical boxes but they look in their own gym and the 6’3” lengthy OH is sitting at the end of the bench using a schollie. Some of these Payton examples and the 6’3” examples you can see from a million miles away if you know the kids, their intangibles and have actually seen them play and develop! Unfortunately the system doesn’t allow coaches to evaluate that. Chris Poole is getting another swing at it. Good for him and Payton. No idea how to embed a picture, but I couldn’t resist 😂 s2.quickmeme.com/img/22/227eb7d2f82838715d9091ec784e949709fdb7c6d2fd44f09541d29234603e8a.jpg |
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Post by meredith11321 on Jan 5, 2018 14:42:23 GMT -5
According to Twitter Gina Cortesi is going to UC San Diego
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Post by bayarea on Jan 5, 2018 19:18:52 GMT -5
According to Twitter Gina Cortesi is going to UC San Diego What happened at Louisiana Tech, with three transfers out listed already? |
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Post by montechello on Jan 5, 2018 23:17:33 GMT -5
According to Twitter Gina Cortesi is going to UC San Diego What happened at Louisiana Tech, with three transfers out listed already? I don't know what's happening in Ruston now ... but Bonnie and Clyde were killed about 25 miles from there.  |
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