|
|
Post by stevehorn on Jun 20, 2022 9:34:54 GMT -5
Has anyone heard of commits being offered a scholarship and then additional money on top of that? Was just told a girl that committed to a non-power 5 school was offered $30,000 on top of receiving a full scholarship. I don’t know how true this is, but I thought that was absurd. they could be talking about the NIL settlement as well. Schools are free to distribute it as they see fit. Some are tying it to GPA but I think it’s 6k a year. So 5 years of school would be about 30k? The approximate 6K a year is not a result of the NIL settlement. It was a different court case on NCAA restricting academic related aid. |
|
|
|
Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Jun 20, 2022 10:06:10 GMT -5
With the previous system, you kind of eased into it. You reach out to one coach and talk. Then a few days or even weeks later another. The great part is if you aren't ready to start conversations, you didn't have to because you were the one that had to make the initial contact. Current system, a gun goes off at midnight on June 15 and you start drinking from the fire hose. Call after call. They all start to sound alike. Also this goes for the coaches too. Then you have to figure out what camps and visits to go on. For alot of PSAs there isn't an open checkbook to pay for the travel and camps. And for alot it make sense to wait until June 15 to see what schools even are interested in you rather than to waste time at a school where you aren't high on their list. I'm not a fan of verbally committing at a young age, but I did prefer the old way of kind of easing into the process more. And really the number of girls committing in 8th grade or even freshman year was small. So in fact for the majority it probably did draw the process out longer in actuality. I have never had to go through the process - so I am looking from the outside. My view is that expectations need to change with the new rules and there doesn't need to be the pressure of rushing to commitments placed on teams and players - that seems to be happening now. Our expectations are that PSA need perfect knowledge on 6/15 - because time is very short on making this crucial decision. I am suggesting time isn't short - the expectations are off - and this will change/improve over time as people get use to the new rules. Old system: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 14/15. Players take 1- 2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 16. Then lower tiers start falling into place by age 17. New System: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 16. Players take 1-2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 17/18. We get rid of all that work and pressure at early ages and now allow coaches and players to make more informed decisions. Players are older, more information about team needs, rapidly improved players aren't behind in the process - these things all increase the chances that both sides make the right decision. And since the process starts later - there isn't an increase in exhausting recruiting time by the PSA. I think your assessment is correct BP but one thing you didn't acknowledge; what happens to the "lower tier" PSA's if the "upper tier" isn't being figured out until they are 18? I still think that all we've done is delayed that work and pressure and now given PSA a shorter timeline to figure things out. |
|
|
|
Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Jun 20, 2022 10:06:56 GMT -5
With the previous system, you kind of eased into it. You reach out to one coach and talk. Then a few days or even weeks later another. The great part is if you aren't ready to start conversations, you didn't have to because you were the one that had to make the initial contact. Current system, a gun goes off at midnight on June 15 and you start drinking from the fire hose. Call after call. They all start to sound alike. Also this goes for the coaches too. Then you have to figure out what camps and visits to go on. For alot of PSAs there isn't an open checkbook to pay for the travel and camps. And for alot it make sense to wait until June 15 to see what schools even are interested in you rather than to waste time at a school where you aren't high on their list. I'm not a fan of verbally committing at a young age, but I did prefer the old way of kind of easing into the process more. And really the number of girls committing in 8th grade or even freshman year was small. So in fact for the majority it probably did draw the process out longer in actuality. Yes, yes, yes. |
|
|
|
Post by volleyparent on Jun 20, 2022 10:38:21 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. I wholeheartedly agree. Something has to give... for us, my daughter isn't getting back to everyone right now. She is contacting who she wants to and will get back to them when she can. |
|
|
|
Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Jun 20, 2022 10:49:01 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. Granted we were helicopter bordering on lawnmower parents, but I wholeheartedly encourage parents to be involved as much as they want to be. Every call (if it was someone new) was on speaker phone. As she talked to the same coaches repeatedly we became less involved in those. We never spoke to the coaches but we did monitor what was being said. We also go our DD to write down the gist of what was said during the call just so that she could remember who said what about their program. We also helped her organize her schedule so that she knew when which calls were happening. She was not passive in this process, but neither were we. |
|
|
|
Post by vbnerd on Jun 20, 2022 10:57:46 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. Trying to manage high level volleyball with academics and maybe some sort of social life is no picnic either. Victoria Garrick played volleyball at USC Talking to athletes, this may be a bit dramatic, but it is not unique to volleyball or USC. |
|
|
|
Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Jun 20, 2022 11:03:13 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. Trying to manage high level volleyball with academics and maybe some sort of social life is no picnic either. Talking to athletes, this may be a bit dramatic, but it is not unique to volleyball or USC. That was a great video! I made my DD watch it and we talked about it afterwards. I wanted to emphasize that sometimes life sneaks up on you and you can be overwhelmed before you realize it. |
|
|
|
Post by cardinalvolleyball on Jun 20, 2022 11:29:24 GMT -5
With the previous system, you kind of eased into it. You reach out to one coach and talk. Then a few days or even weeks later another. The great part is if you aren't ready to start conversations, you didn't have to because you were the one that had to make the initial contact. Current system, a gun goes off at midnight on June 15 and you start drinking from the fire hose. Call after call. They all start to sound alike. Also this goes for the coaches too. Then you have to figure out what camps and visits to go on. For alot of PSAs there isn't an open checkbook to pay for the travel and camps. And for alot it make sense to wait until June 15 to see what schools even are interested in you rather than to waste time at a school where you aren't high on their list. I'm not a fan of verbally committing at a young age, but I did prefer the old way of kind of easing into the process more. And really the number of girls committing in 8th grade or even freshman year was small. So in fact for the majority it probably did draw the process out longer in actuality. I have never had to go through the process - so I am looking from the outside. My view is that expectations need to change with the new rules and there doesn't need to be the pressure of rushing to commitments placed on teams and players - that seems to be happening now. Our expectations are that PSA need perfect knowledge on 6/15 - because time is very short on making this crucial decision. I am suggesting time isn't short - the expectations are off - and this will change/improve over time as people get use to the new rules. Old system: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 14/15. Players take 1- 2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 16. Then lower tiers start falling into place by age 17. New System: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 16. Players take 1-2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 17/18. We get rid of all that work and pressure at early ages and now allow coaches and players to make more informed decisions. Players are older, more information about team needs, rapidly improved players aren't behind in the process - these things all increase the chances that both sides make the right decision. And since the process starts later - there isn't an increase in exhausting recruiting time by the PSA. this is literally our current system as designed by the NCAA. |
|
|
|
Post by notvballdad on Jun 20, 2022 11:40:53 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. I feel like you live in my house. And in some parts of the country, there is one more factor going on too right now...And you have to find your club team for next year if you want to be on a top team for an elite club, while training for Nationals and fielding all the phone calls. It's nuts. |
|
|
|
Post by digs on Jun 20, 2022 11:54:48 GMT -5
I have never had to go through the process - so I am looking from the outside. My view is that expectations need to change with the new rules and there doesn't need to be the pressure of rushing to commitments placed on teams and players - that seems to be happening now. Our expectations are that PSA need perfect knowledge on 6/15 - because time is very short on making this crucial decision. I am suggesting time isn't short - the expectations are off - and this will change/improve over time as people get use to the new rules. Old system: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 14/15. Players take 1- 2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 16. Then lower tiers start falling into place by age 17. New System: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 16. Players take 1-2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 17/18. We get rid of all that work and pressure at early ages and now allow coaches and players to make more informed decisions. Players are older, more information about team needs, rapidly improved players aren't behind in the process - these things all increase the chances that both sides make the right decision. And since the process starts later - there isn't an increase in exhausting recruiting time by the PSA. this is literally our current system as designed by the NCAA. This is a great discussion and many valid points are being raised. But I think the biggest challenge may be the scarcity of available scholarships. That’s what creates the feeding frenzy on both sides. 12 total scholarships (in D1) divided by four years means an average of three available per recruiting year. Throw in a couple of transfers (and a little Covid) and it’s not surprising that both the recruits and coaches feel a massive sense of urgency to make decisions ASAP. I mean, no one’s holding a gun to a PSA’s head to commit quickly, but the reality of losing out on an available scholarship is a pretty good motivator. And from a coach’s standpoint, how long can you wait for a target recruit to make a decision before you risk losing not just them but your backup targets as well? The only solution I can think of is to create a period where communication and visits can occur but no offers are allowed until a specified future date. This would give PSA’s time develop a list of target schools and have enough context to know if there’s truly mutual interest and culture fit. Don’t get me wrong, all hell will still break loose on “offer day” but PSA’s would have a lot more info to make quick decisions. And the coaches could fairly expect quick answers so they could move quickly to their next target when the answer is no. Maybe I’m tripping, but this seems to make a lot more sense than sifting through offers (or lack thereof) from schools you’ve never visited or communicated with. |
|
|
|
Post by vollectator on Jun 20, 2022 12:03:31 GMT -5
i don't have a daughter in the game so the question may sound silly. if the verbals are not binding, what's the harm in allowing a 13-year-old to proclaim her fondness of a particular program? for some they get to focus on volleyball the next few years. others could changes their minds. if enough of them let the programs feel the non-binding nature of a commitment, the coaches may direct their limited resources away from 8th graders and more wisely to, say, juniors, which is where things are now.
|
|
|
|
Post by thebaytocsulb on Jun 20, 2022 12:05:37 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. Trying to manage high level volleyball with academics and maybe some sort of social life is no picnic either. Victoria Garrick played volleyball at USC Talking to athletes, this may be a bit dramatic, but it is not unique to volleyball or USC. This is really good. Thanks. |
|
|
|
Post by stevehorn on Jun 20, 2022 12:32:07 GMT -5
i don't have a daughter in the game so the question may sound silly. if the verbals are not binding, what's the harm in allowing a 13-year-old to proclaim her fondness of a particular program? for some they get to focus on volleyball the next few years. others could changes their minds. if enough of them let the programs feel the non-binding nature of a commitment, the coaches may direct their limited resources away from 8th graders and more wisely to, say, juniors, which is where things are now. This was the previous system. Very few recruits broke their commitment even though they were non-binding. |
|
|
|
Post by vollectator on Jun 20, 2022 12:50:04 GMT -5
i don't have a daughter in the game so the question may sound silly. if the verbals are not binding, what's the harm in allowing a 13-year-old to proclaim her fondness of a particular program? for some they get to focus on volleyball the next few years. others could changes their minds. if enough of them let the programs feel the non-binding nature of a commitment, the coaches may direct their limited resources away from 8th graders and more wisely to, say, juniors, which is where things are now. This was the previous system. Very few recruits broke their commitment even though they were non-binding. if very few recruits broke the commitments they made in 8th grade, would that go against the argument that 8th graders are too young to make commitments? maybe there are other reasons i'm not seeing. |
|
|
|
Post by stevehorn on Jun 20, 2022 13:06:48 GMT -5
This was the previous system. Very few recruits broke their commitment even though they were non-binding. if very few recruits broke the commitments they made in 8th grade, would that go against the argument that 8th graders are too young to make commitments? maybe there are other reasons i'm not seeing. Concerns I've read are that it led to a number of transfers where recruits were no longer thrilled with their selection. Also many coaches felt that they made too many recruiting mistakes with the very early commits. |
|
