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Post by rainbowbadger on Jun 20, 2022 13:15:40 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. Granted we were helicopter bordering on lawnmower parents, but I wholeheartedly encourage parents to be involved as much as they want to be. Every call (if it was someone new) was on speaker phone. As she talked to the same coaches repeatedly we became less involved in those. We never spoke to the coaches but we did monitor what was being said. We also go our DD to write down the gist of what was said during the call just so that she could remember who said what about their program. We also helped her organize her schedule so that she knew when which calls were happening. She was not passive in this process, but neither were we. IDK what the rest of your parenting is like, but this doesn't seem helicopter-y or lawnmower-y to me. It sounds like you helped your daughter navigate what was probably the biggest & most impactful decision she'd ever made. You helped her learn how to manage a process like this, and that experience will serve her well in the future when it comes to grad school selection, job hunting, etc. It's like when the kid is learning to drive. You'd never just hand them the keys and turn 'em loose, at least not at the outset. There's a reason the driver's ed car has the emergency brake in the instructor's seat - so an adult with more life experience can step in and stop something disastrous from happening if need be. You listening in on calls helped you get a sense for the coaches and put you in a position where you could slam on the brakes if you identified red flags. From the sound of it, your daughter landed at a program she's happy with. I'd say you were the right amount of involved. |
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Jun 20, 2022 14:27:13 GMT -5
Granted we were helicopter bordering on lawnmower parents, but I wholeheartedly encourage parents to be involved as much as they want to be. Every call (if it was someone new) was on speaker phone. As she talked to the same coaches repeatedly we became less involved in those. We never spoke to the coaches but we did monitor what was being said. We also go our DD to write down the gist of what was said during the call just so that she could remember who said what about their program. We also helped her organize her schedule so that she knew when which calls were happening. She was not passive in this process, but neither were we. IDK what the rest of your parenting is like, but this doesn't seem helicopter-y or lawnmower-y to me. It sounds like you helped your daughter navigate what was probably the biggest & most impactful decision she'd ever made. You helped her learn how to manage a process like this, and that experience will serve her well in the future when it comes to grad school selection, job hunting, etc. It's like when the kid is learning to drive. You'd never just hand them the keys and turn 'em loose, at least not at the outset. There's a reason the driver's ed car has the emergency brake in the instructor's seat - so an adult with more life experience can step in and stop something disastrous from happening if need be. You listening in on calls helped you get a sense for the coaches and put you in a position where you could slam on the brakes if you identified red flags. From the sound of it, your daughter landed at a program she's happy with. I'd say you were the right amount of involved. Thanks, I lean towards the self-critical more so than thinking we nailed it as parents.  Hopefully we left her enough room to make her own mistakes and learn from them. I really do appreciate your comment! |
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Jun 20, 2022 15:12:26 GMT -5
I have never had to go through the process - so I am looking from the outside. My view is that expectations need to change with the new rules and there doesn't need to be the pressure of rushing to commitments placed on teams and players - that seems to be happening now. Our expectations are that PSA need perfect knowledge on 6/15 - because time is very short on making this crucial decision. I am suggesting time isn't short - the expectations are off - and this will change/improve over time as people get use to the new rules. Old system: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 14/15. Players take 1- 2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 16. Then lower tiers start falling into place by age 17. New System: Players and coaches start the recruiting process at age 16. Players take 1-2 years to make a decision and have things wrapped up by age 17/18. We get rid of all that work and pressure at early ages and now allow coaches and players to make more informed decisions. Players are older, more information about team needs, rapidly improved players aren't behind in the process - these things all increase the chances that both sides make the right decision. And since the process starts later - there isn't an increase in exhausting recruiting time by the PSA. I think your assessment is correct BP but one thing you didn't acknowledge; what happens to the "lower tier" PSA's if the "upper tier" isn't being figured out until they are 18? I still think that all we've done is delayed that work and pressure and now given PSA a shorter timeline to figure things out.
1) I don't think it is a shorter timeline - certainly not for the top players. It is just a timeline that starts later. Maybe 'we' will get out of the habit of creating recruiting tapes and other pressurized things when the kids are so young and also start that process later. 2) Next tier - yes, I did think about this. I see where this has a cascade impact down the line. First - almost all of the upper tier is going to 'figure it out' and make a verbal within 6 months (my guess) and unlikely to extend out until they are 18. But even if they do - maybe as a sport we need to stop treating colleges like tiers. I don't think it is healthy for the sport if Nebraska is going to get the top 2 recruits every year - then 2 or 3 more from the top 10. Great players are going to many colleges in basketball. Great players are only going to about 3-4 colleges in volleyball. This is what may be creating this future bottleneck. Overall - I am suggesting we change our expectations - and I think that will happen. Right now, it appears that the expectations are 'get my girl committed before it is too late' - and in the process is having to take in an insane amount of information in such a short period of time. I am suggesting that there is time to properly evaluate the best choice - as long as one is willing to wait as long as just 1 year. Also - coaches are learning from this process just as the PSA and parents are. It may take a couple years before everyone figures out how it will work. Right now - the expectations are off. |
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Post by Friday on Jun 20, 2022 15:54:30 GMT -5
this is literally our current system as designed by the NCAA. This is a great discussion and many valid points are being raised. But I think the biggest challenge may be the scarcity of available scholarships. That’s what creates the feeding frenzy on both sides. 12 total scholarships (in D1) divided by four years means an average of three available per recruiting year. Throw in a couple of transfers (and a little Covid) and it’s not surprising that both the recruits and coaches feel a massive sense of urgency to make decisions ASAP. I mean, no one’s holding a gun to a PSA’s head to commit quickly, but the reality of losing out on an available scholarship is a pretty good motivator. And from a coach’s standpoint, how long can you wait for a target recruit to make a decision before you risk losing not just them but your backup targets as well? The only solution I can think of is to create a period where communication and visits can occur but no offers are allowed until a specified future date. This would give PSA’s time develop a list of target schools and have enough context to know if there’s truly mutual interest and culture fit. Don’t get me wrong, all hell will still break loose on “offer day” but PSA’s would have a lot more info to make quick decisions. And the coaches could fairly expect quick answers so they could move quickly to their next target when the answer is no. Maybe I’m tripping, but this seems to make a lot more sense than sifting through offers (or lack thereof) from schools you’ve never visited or communicated with. The scarcity of scholarships is very real. Especially with the introduction of the portal. Now you are competing not only with your peers but also with potential transfers. And most volleyball players are not getting 4 years. That is a big misconception. I used to assume that most players - outside of DSs - were 4 year. And now it is increasingly not the case. Alot of 2 and 3 years out there. |
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Post by oldnewbie on Jun 20, 2022 16:11:05 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. ... Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. I dont disagree there is a lot of pressure and it is far from perfect, but consider that all those same coaches that are misleading your 15-16 year old were pressuring and misleading my 13-14 year old. It was not better before. |
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Post by c4ndlelight on Jun 20, 2022 17:32:05 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. ... Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. I dont disagree there is a lot of pressure and it is far from perfect, but consider that all those same coaches that are misleading your 15-16 year old were pressuring and misleading my 13-14 year old. It was not better before. This is entirely on the coaches. They could just STOP, but they do not. |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Jun 20, 2022 17:42:00 GMT -5
This is a great discussion and many valid points are being raised. But I think the biggest challenge may be the scarcity of available scholarships. That’s what creates the feeding frenzy on both sides. 12 total scholarships (in D1) divided by four years means an average of three available per recruiting year. Throw in a couple of transfers (and a little Covid) and it’s not surprising that both the recruits and coaches feel a massive sense of urgency to make decisions ASAP. I mean, no one’s holding a gun to a PSA’s head to commit quickly, but the reality of losing out on an available scholarship is a pretty good motivator. And from a coach’s standpoint, how long can you wait for a target recruit to make a decision before you risk losing not just them but your backup targets as well? The only solution I can think of is to create a period where communication and visits can occur but no offers are allowed until a specified future date. This would give PSA’s time develop a list of target schools and have enough context to know if there’s truly mutual interest and culture fit. Don’t get me wrong, all hell will still break loose on “offer day” but PSA’s would have a lot more info to make quick decisions. And the coaches could fairly expect quick answers so they could move quickly to their next target when the answer is no. Maybe I’m tripping, but this seems to make a lot more sense than sifting through offers (or lack thereof) from schools you’ve never visited or communicated with. The scarcity of scholarships is very real. Especially with the introduction of the portal. Now you are competing not only with your peers but also with potential transfers. And most volleyball players are not getting 4 years. That is a big misconception. I used to assume that most players - outside of DSs - were 4 year. And now it is increasingly not the case. Alot of 2 and 3 years out there. well, college athlete's pushed for more money (stipends), pushed for free agency so if the result is less schollies and having players compete for those schollies..... welcome to what college athletes were clamoring for only 2 years on schollie?, well, that's pay for play |
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Post by rrvbfan on Jun 20, 2022 17:50:42 GMT -5
they could be talking about the NIL settlement as well. Schools are free to distribute it as they see fit. Some are tying it to GPA but I think it’s 6k a year. So 5 years of school would be about 30k? The approximate 6K a year is not a result of the NIL settlement. It was a different court case on NCAA restricting academic related aid. if we are referring to the same thing, it stems from ncaa v Alston and it is about an athlete being paid for being used by the ncaa in advertising. I just referred to it as nil as it is easier. If there is something restricting grant aid, I’m not familiar with it. www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/33684066/only-21-130-ncaa-fbs-level-schools-say-plans-provide-allowed-academic-bonus-payments-athletes-yearEdit to add: they came up with that amount as it is same amount as available aid. If I’m understanding it correctly. |
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Post by veebznerd on Jun 20, 2022 18:02:44 GMT -5
Has anyone heard of commits being offered a scholarship and then additional money on top of that? Was just told a girl that committed to a non-power 5 school was offered $30,000 on top of receiving a full scholarship. I don’t know how true this is, but I thought that was absurd. Yep. I know someone offer full ride plus $50k |
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Post by veebznerd on Jun 20, 2022 18:08:29 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. I don’t have all the answers. But to be inundated with 100 texts/calls within a 12 hour period and then to be told to respond to absolutely everyone so they don’t think you’re ungrateful and then pick 10-15 to talk to but do it NOW…FAST…HURRY. Now pick 5 immediately to go to camp. Hope you picked the right ones. Now answer all the other texts from random schools that continue to pour in while also building a relationship with 10-15 schools by texting multiple coaches from said schools. Daily. Oh and go practice, train and get ready for nationals. Now. Quickly. Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. But don’t involve parents right away. Because these coaches want to see how independent your kid is. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. I wholeheartedly agree. Something has to give... for us, my daughter isn't getting back to everyone right now. She is contacting who she wants to and will get back to them when she can. YOU ARE 100% !! |
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Post by vergyltantor on Jun 20, 2022 18:15:02 GMT -5
According to the Nebraska website rrvbfan is correct. The possibility of the $5980 payment was a result of the NCAA vs Alston case. IIRC the $5980 amount is based off the maximum amount a player can receive from an award, POY etc. It is given as an award for academic acheivement.
Case summery
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Post by justahick on Jun 20, 2022 18:33:54 GMT -5
For those of us in the middle of it right now, everyone I know agrees that this isn’t working. ... Oh and odds are at least most of these adult coaches that you are speaking with are misleading you in some way but you at age 15-16 aren’t sophisticated enough to know it. That’s what children are facing. Daily. The pressure is ungodly. I dont disagree there is a lot of pressure and it is far from perfect, but consider that all those same coaches that are misleading your 15-16 year old were pressuring and misleading my 13-14 year old. It was not better before. Disagree. I went throught it as a parent under the old system. There was pressure, but nothing like there is now. There was a nice extended time frame where you could talk to coaches, try out camps before conversations got serious, make unofficial visis early. Now, extext for the top tier - who can wait since they will always find a pretty good spot, there is an incredible time crunch. Either they narrow down to the right 3 or 4 schools now, or they are stuck waiting until after presidents day to get seen again...by then many schools will be out of money. |
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Post by outlaw on Jun 20, 2022 18:41:45 GMT -5
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Post by n00b on Jun 20, 2022 18:43:35 GMT -5
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Post by SayonaraTachikara on Jun 20, 2022 18:47:24 GMT -5
That is a great get for the Illini. |
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