St. Thomas (Minnesota) 2022 & 2023 Seasons

[ndodge]

Tied at 18's in set 2. Tommies seem to do well after timeouts, they just closed a 15-18 gap after one of them (and I think similarly in set 1).

[ndodge]

UST loses set 2, 20-25

[ndodge]

Ditto for set 3. CMU just more balanced.

[ndodge]

And UST falls apart in set 4, 10-25. Sets 2 and 3 were competitive, CMU just pulled away.

[kiyoat]

link

Match thread for USD @ UST

[ndodge]

The Tommies have won 13 sets this year 20 games in (if my quick scan/counting is correct). Last year at this point it was 9.

[kiyoat]

Hey Tommie fans:

The most recent episode of the 7th Rotation podcast "Now or Never" includes an interview with Coach Thanh Pham.

There are multiple podcast formats available, and the interview with Coach Pham is fifteen minutes from about 36:00 to 51:00

Some interesting bullet points (heavily paraphrased):

- St Thomas is in a transition in terms of the number of volleyball scholarships they can offer.  (I assume this is self-imposed for financial reasons) Right now they can only offer 4 scholarships, and that will be more in the future.  So they are playing the long game with regard to expectations of success.

- Although MSP is a recruiting hotbed for volleyball, there are still some challenges UST has in recruiting.  The school cannot compete for a Summit title for 5 years, for example.  Although the Gophers are looking at a different type of athlete than the Tommies, so the competition is lessened there, there is still a lot of competition from all of the great D-II programs in the state for Minnesota and regional girls.  Coach thinks that eventually his program will be more successful at 'closing the borders' to some degree.  The academic profile of the school helps somewhat.

- Coach played coy about if there were some plans for the basketball teams to move into a larger gym (I think it's pretty obvious that will happen sooner or later), but he did confirm that the current plans are for the VB team to stay in the current gym regardless.

[boxcariii]

Nov 3, 2022 11:41:21 GMT -5 kiyoat said:

Hey Tommie fans:

- St Thomas is in a transition in terms of the number of volleyball scholarships they can offer.  (I assume this is self-imposed for financial reasons) Right now they can only offer 4 scholarships, and that will be more in the future.  So they are playing the long game with regard to expectations of success.

I'm a bit surprised by the scholarship limitation. I believe the Tommies have one of the largest endowments in the Summit league (Denver's is higher at a quick glance). Major metropolitan/endowment is why a local Omaha talking head is convinced St. Thomas is destined for the Big East (in a decade or so). I've done 10 minutes of research a few different times (so like 45 minutes), and I think he's on to something. I hope volleyball is competitive at the D1 level by then. Not sure why he doesn't have the same feel for Denver, or maybe he does, and I just missed it. 

However, this does help me make sense of things, so it's good information. Thank you!

[AmeriCanVBfan]

Nov 3, 2022 11:41:21 GMT -5 kiyoat said:

Hey Tommie fans:

The most recent episode of the 7th Rotation podcast "Now or Never" includes an interview with Coach Thanh Pham.



There are multiple podcast formats available, and the interview with Coach Pham is fifteen minutes from about 36:00 to 51:00

Some interesting bullet points (heavily paraphrased):

- St Thomas is in a transition in terms of the number of volleyball scholarships they can offer.  (I assume this is self-imposed for financial reasons) Right now they can only offer 4 scholarships, and that will be more in the future.  So they are playing the long game with regard to expectations of success.

- Although MSP is a recruiting hotbed for volleyball, there are still some challenges UST has in recruiting.  The school cannot compete for a Summit title for 5 years, for example.  Although the Gophers are looking at a different type of athlete than the Tommies, so the competition is lessened there, there is still a lot of competition from all of the great D-II programs in the state for Minnesota and regional girls.  Coach thinks that eventually his program will be more successful at 'closing the borders' to some degree.  The academic profile of the school helps somewhat.

- Coach played coy about if there were some plans for the basketball teams to move into a larger gym (I think it's pretty obvious that will happen sooner or later), but he did confirm that the current plans are for the VB team to stay in the current gym regardless.

I didn't know they were only offering four scholarships! Talk about challenging.
I did know that they couldn't compete for a Summit title for five years. There should be three left after this year, I'm assuming.
Their current gym is the perfect size for where they are at right now. I don't know if moving to a bigger gym will be beneficial for them right now.

There are quite a few Minnesota girls who choose to compete in the Summit, hopefully the lure of being closer to home, will be an attraction UST can use.

[AmeriCanVBfan]

Nov 3, 2022 12:20:18 GMT -5 boxcariii said:

Nov 3, 2022 11:41:21 GMT -5 kiyoat said:

Hey Tommie fans:

- St Thomas is in a transition in terms of the number of volleyball scholarships they can offer.  (I assume this is self-imposed for financial reasons) Right now they can only offer 4 scholarships, and that will be more in the future.  So they are playing the long game with regard to expectations of success.

I'm a bit surprised by the scholarship limitation. I believe the Tommies have one of the largest endowments in the Summit league (Denver's is higher at a quick glance). Major metropolitan/endowment is why a local Omaha talking head is convinced St. Thomas is destined for the Big East (in a decade or so). I've done 10 minutes of research a few different times (so like 45 minutes), and I think he's on to something. I hope volleyball is competitive at the D1 level by then. Not sure why he doesn't have the same feel for Denver, or maybe he does, and I just missed it. 

However, this does help me make sense of things, so it's good information. Thank you!

I've only started following the Big East, but I wonder if that would be a fit.
No football for most of those schools (I think) and Basketball-wise they maybe at a higher level than UST.

Again, I didn't really research that so I could be wrong. 

[boxcariii]

Nov 3, 2022 12:23:42 GMT -5 AmeriCanVBfan said:

Nov 3, 2022 12:20:18 GMT -5 boxcariii said:

I'm a bit surprised by the scholarship limitation. I believe the Tommies have one of the largest endowments in the Summit league (Denver's is higher at a quick glance). Major metropolitan/endowment is why a local Omaha talking head is convinced St. Thomas is destined for the Big East (in a decade or so). I've done 10 minutes of research a few different times (so like 45 minutes), and I think he's on to something. I hope volleyball is competitive at the D1 level by then. Not sure why he doesn't have the same feel for Denver, or maybe he does, and I just missed it. 

However, this does help me make sense of things, so it's good information. Thank you!

I've only started following the Big East, but I wonder if that would be a fit.
No football for most of those schools (I think) and Basketball-wise they maybe at a higher level than UST.

Again, I didn't really research that so I could be wrong. 

That's why it's in a decade or so and not next year. Next year would be terrible for both sides. A decade+ of D1 competition may change that. Similar endowments, university types (Private/Christian with the exception of Butler which is Private, just not Christian and UConn, the only public institution), focus will be on basketball I believe. 

Outside of UConn, the schools that do have Football compete at the FCS level (Butler, Georgetown, and Villanova, maybe some other school(s)). St. Thomas football is in the Pioneer league, same as Butler, actually. So outside of an invitation to the Missouri Valley Football Conference (a very real possibility in my opinion because it's who you know), a move to the Big East makes sense at some point in the future. MVFC houses most of the Summit members' football teams and makes way more geographic sense. 

[kiyoat]

Nov 3, 2022 12:20:29 GMT -5 AmeriCanVBfan said:

Nov 3, 2022 11:41:21 GMT -5 kiyoat said:

Hey Tommie fans:

I didn't know they were only offering four scholarships! Talk about challenging.
I did know that they couldn't compete for a Summit title for five years. There should be three left after this year, I'm assuming.
Their current gym is the perfect size for where they are at right now. I don't know if moving to a bigger gym will be beneficial for them right now.

There are quite a few Minnesota girls who choose to compete in the Summit, hopefully the lure of being closer to home, will be an attraction UST can use.

on the five years thing, I'm pretty sure the normal time is four years, but since they made the unprecedented move from D-III to D-I the NCAA must have added one year it.  That would make sense, since the traditional model of going D-III to D-II, then to D-I would be something like a six-year transition or more.  They will probably need the time to build multiple new facilities anyway.  

[kiyoat]

Nov 3, 2022 12:20:18 GMT -5 boxcariii said:

Nov 3, 2022 11:41:21 GMT -5 kiyoat said:

Hey Tommie fans:

- St Thomas is in a transition in terms of the number of volleyball scholarships they can offer.  (I assume this is self-imposed for financial reasons) Right now they can only offer 4 scholarships, and that will be more in the future.  So they are playing the long game with regard to expectations of success.

I'm a bit surprised by the scholarship limitation. I believe the Tommies have one of the largest endowments in the Summit league (Denver's is higher at a quick glance). Major metropolitan/endowment is why a local Omaha talking head is convinced St. Thomas is destined for the Big East (in a decade or so). I've done 10 minutes of research a few different times (so like 45 minutes), and I think he's on to something. I hope volleyball is competitive at the D1 level by then. Not sure why he doesn't have the same feel for Denver, or maybe he does, and I just missed it. 

However, this does help me make sense of things, so it's good information. Thank you!

I'd say that yes, UST has a huge endowment, comparable to Denver's.  However, that money only shows the "potential" in the alumni base for athletic money.  I'll assume that the vast majority of the endowment is for academic programs, and cannot be "liquidated" for athletic facilities, as an example.  That being said, their future SHOULD be very bright, from a financial and athletic standpoint.

The trick is just that a transition of this magnitude takes a lot of time and money, especially with regard to building D-1 quality facilities.  That nice-sized Volleyball gym is also a very tiny basketball gym.  And I think basketball probably should be targeted as the program to focus on in order to quickly grow their brand in the Cities.  I would be surprised if the same scholarship limitations the VB program is being subjected to applied to men's basketball.  And that's just one sport of many to upgrade.  The Big East or the MVC will want candidate programs to have a healthy athletic profile, one would think.  Not just basketball.

This is all just speculation on my part.  So take it for what it's worth, which is $0.02

[boxcariii]

Nov 3, 2022 12:54:56 GMT -5 kiyoat said:

Nov 3, 2022 12:20:18 GMT -5 boxcariii said:

I'm a bit surprised by the scholarship limitation. I believe the Tommies have one of the largest endowments in the Summit league (Denver's is higher at a quick glance). Major metropolitan/endowment is why a local Omaha talking head is convinced St. Thomas is destined for the Big East (in a decade or so). I've done 10 minutes of research a few different times (so like 45 minutes), and I think he's on to something. I hope volleyball is competitive at the D1 level by then. Not sure why he doesn't have the same feel for Denver, or maybe he does, and I just missed it. 

However, this does help me make sense of things, so it's good information. Thank you!

I'd say that yes, UST has a huge endowment, comparable to Denver's.  However, that money only shows the "potential" in the alumni base for athletic money.  I'll assume that the vast majority of the endowment is for academic programs, and cannot be "liquidated" for athletic facilities, as an example.  That being said, their future SHOULD be very bright, from a financial and athletic standpoint.

The trick is just that a transition of this magnitude takes a lot of time and money, especially with regard to building D-1 quality facilities.  That nice-sized Volleyball gym is also a very tiny basketball gym.  And I think basketball probably should be targeted as the program to focus on in order to quickly grow their brand in the Cities.  I would be surprised if the same scholarship limitations the VB program is being subjected to applied to men's basketball.  And that's just one sport of many to upgrade.  The Big East or the MVC will want candidate programs to have a healthy athletic profile, one would think.  Not just basketball.

This is all just speculation on my part.  So take it for what it's worth, which is $0.02

Oh I agree, it's all speculation. And, yes, only time will tell how the transition plays out and how the transition plays out will be a determining factor as well. Clarification, an invite to the MVFC is not the same as an invite to the MVC. (sorry, I love/am fascinated with conference realignment). 

The point with the football (and football only) side of the Missouri Valley Football Conference is that a lot of Summit members already reside their football programs there too. It's one of (if not) the strongest FCS conference I believe (but I don't really follow foobow that close any more), so I get why St. Thomas wasn't initially invited. That being said, they know most of the the MVFC members through their Summit membership, and if in 8-15 years, St. Thomas is pursuing other options in non-foobow sports, an invite to the MVFC would strengthen their bond to the Summit league schools (assuming there's no carnage before then, which, no one can be sure of). NDSU has been a rumored target of the Big 12/MWC after all.

[kiyoat]

Nov 3, 2022 13:17:33 GMT -5 boxcariii said:

... (assuming there's no carnage before then, which, no one can be sure of)....

I don't want to go too far down this rabbit-hole of basketball/ football/ conference re-alignment on a Volleyball fan board, but I would say that re-alignment carnage is probably the one thing we CAN be sure of.

Anyway, I think that the Summit will ultimately benefit from having the Tommies as members, even if it is only for a decade or so.  The potential UST has for growth in all sports is real, and it gets the conference into the MSP metro market.  That's valuable even with the added competition.  As the Tommies's profile expands, so does the conference's.  It just won't happen overnight.