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Post by Word on May 12, 2022 15:44:31 GMT -5
Something else to consider... Russ could get away with things because he was Russ, with Russ's track record. Someone who has never won a thing, and without Russ's length of service, can not be that type of coach. Everyone knew Russ's style and wanted that...from Russ. Do those same players want anything close to Russ from someone without Russ's record? No I would disagree somewhat. I think it has more to do with trust, that the players know the messenger has their backs all the time. That is the key difference. Being Russ Rose doesn't hurt obviously, but I still think it is mostly to do with trust. I feel like we are all on the same page with Russ, just saying it slightly different!  |
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Post by mikegarrison on May 12, 2022 15:51:05 GMT -5
Something else to consider... Russ could get away with things because he was Russ, with Russ's track record. Someone who has never won a thing, and without Russ's length of service, can not be that type of coach. Everyone knew Russ's style and wanted that...from Russ. Do those same players want anything close to Russ from someone without Russ's record? No I would disagree somewhat. I think it has more to do with trust, that the players know the messenger has their backs all the time. That is the key difference. Being Russ Rose doesn't hurt obviously, but I still think it is mostly to do with trust. Yeah, it's a *lot* easier to accept criticism from a friend you trust is only trying to help you. Much harder from someone you suspect is only concerned with furthering their own interests. |
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Post by bbg95 on May 12, 2022 16:23:23 GMT -5
I would disagree somewhat. I think it has more to do with trust, that the players know the messenger has their backs all the time. That is the key difference. Being Russ Rose doesn't hurt obviously, but I still think it is mostly to do with trust. I do not disagree with that...but the trust that existed between Russ and his players is also something that goes with his record/experience, etc... I also remember watching a Tennessee WBB game when Pat Summit was coaching. At halftime, they were losing and the TV camera's went into the locker room and broadcast her halftime talk. She singled out one player has someone who was not playing well and needed to step up in the second half, or else...but was not that polite. Again, who she was, what she had accomplished, let her get away with that. Someone not on her level, or Russ's, gets run out of town. Correct. Trust is essential in every relationship, but a coach having championship credibility definitely helps to build trust with some players. Even at Indiana itself, I'd say the vast majority of Bobby Knight's players will defend him to this day. I don't see too many players defending Aird. |
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Post by rainbowbadger on May 12, 2022 16:24:03 GMT -5
.... I look at the Grambling case as an example of coaches and universities flipping the tools available on its head and try to regain their advantage. A note on Russ Rose, he has always struck me as being straight forward and no BS. He speaks the truth as he sees it, yet I have never heard any instances of him demeaning players in n public. He lays it out there in playing terms, but he never resorts to ad hominem attack. That is a major difference. Better yet, never heard of him demeaning players in private. From what I saw/read/understood: He was blunt but not mean; that also meant he was understood. His commentary was based on real data/metrics instead of a vague, undefined or extraneous standards. He gave constructive advice and not mean criticism. I remember during one timeout back in the 2010s, maybe, maybe a bit earlier, where the PSU block was getting hammered at the left pin. He looked at his famous notebook, looked at the OH and MB, told them what the stats said and calmly looked at them and said "You might want to work on that." Did not tell them someone on the bench was ready to take their place. That they could quit. That they shouldn't have eaten whatever. He knew they had the tools to clean it up. That simple "You might want to work on that" was all it took. I think this is important. Objective vs. subjective feedback. You always know where you stand. No mind games, no back-room discussions. The other thing is that in order for this kind of blunt criticism/commentary to be effective, the players have to 100% believe that the coach cares about them, respects them, and wants them to be the best they can be. That means that the coach's actions outside of those moments have to reflect a coach who loves & respects them and is working towards their best interests. You have to walk the walk all the time. If you don't have the foundational relationship and you try that stuff, you're toast. |
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Post by tomclen on May 12, 2022 16:31:09 GMT -5
You know there's a headline writer somewhere just waiting to use: "AIRD OUT"
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Post by justahick on May 12, 2022 16:55:41 GMT -5
Better yet, never heard of him demeaning players in private. From what I saw/read/understood: He was blunt but not mean; that also meant he was understood. His commentary was based on real data/metrics instead of a vague, undefined or extraneous standards. He gave constructive advice and not mean criticism. I remember during one timeout back in the 2010s, maybe, maybe a bit earlier, where the PSU block was getting hammered at the left pin. He looked at his famous notebook, looked at the OH and MB, told them what the stats said and calmly looked at them and said "You might want to work on that." Did not tell them someone on the bench was ready to take their place. That they could quit. That they shouldn't have eaten whatever. He knew they had the tools to clean it up. That simple "You might want to work on that" was all it took. I think this is important. Objective vs. subjective feedback. You always know where you stand. No mind games, no back-room discussions. The other thing is that in order for this kind of blunt criticism/commentary to be effective, the players have to 100% believe that the coach cares about them, respects them, and wants them to be the best they can be. That means that the coach's actions outside of those moments have to reflect a coach who loves & respects them and is working towards their best interests. You have to walk the walk all the time. If you don't have the foundational relationship and you try that stuff, you're toast. True, for example, you can't haze freshmen by making them bring you your newpaper everyday...oh nevermind. |
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Steve Aird
May 12, 2022 17:11:14 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by vb on May 12, 2022 17:11:14 GMT -5
Wait a minute, you’re comparing Indiana University’s Steve Aird to Penn State University’s hall of fame Russ Rose. Excuse me but I’m gonna throw up now
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Post by ndodge on May 12, 2022 17:21:24 GMT -5
I do not disagree with that...but the trust that existed between Russ and his players is also something that goes with his record/experience, etc... I also remember watching a Tennessee WBB game when Pat Summit was coaching. At halftime, they were losing and the TV camera's went into the locker room and broadcast her halftime talk. She singled out one player has someone who was not playing well and needed to step up in the second half, or else...but was not that polite. Again, who she was, what she had accomplished, let her get away with that. Someone not on her level, or Russ's, gets run out of town. Correct. Trust is essential in every relationship, but a coach having championship credibility definitely helps to build trust with some players. Even at Indiana itself, I'd say the vast majority of Bobby Knight's players will defend him to this day. I don't see too many players defending Aird. Right, if this was bs just by disgruntled players you'd think there'd be big statements to the contrary, in his defense, by current and/or former players. Has there been anything like that ? |
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Post by mikegarrison on May 12, 2022 17:22:50 GMT -5
Wait a minute, you’re comparing Indiana University’s Steve Aird to Penn State University’s hall of fame Russ Rose. Excuse me but I’m gonna throw up now No, they are comparing ex- Penn State assistant coach Steve Aird to ex- Penn State head coach Russ Rose, which seems a pretty reasonable point of comparison. But feel free to throw up as you desire. |
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Post by d1athlete on May 12, 2022 18:47:26 GMT -5
They definitely need an outside firm to comb through the evidence they have. They need to look into the financials also. Players/recruits being paid. If Indiana has been paying players, they've been paying the wrong ones. They used a lawyer that is tied to the school and also the allegation that he is paying players or recruits is false and made up by someone |
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Post by d1athlete on May 12, 2022 18:58:56 GMT -5
Getting tired of hearing about these thin skinned, entitled, mommy’s girl …can’t take some serious coaching - to be the best player that they can be. This whole post is nothing more than trivial “piling-on “now. You wanna get serious? How about the dude in Chicago that runs that very successful volleyball club. You know the one, the one that cant keep his hands off of little girls. Sweet potato versus minors. Aird, is that you? Actually Aird has his little minions come on VT to defend him, maybe cause he doesn't have the balls to do it himself. |
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Post by VBCOACH on May 12, 2022 19:59:03 GMT -5
I once asked a lawyer what would happen if an adult male who supervised a lot of younger females and who had a lot of power over them was accused (with no evidence) by one of them with malice (physical, sexual, or mental) and taken to co0urt. He said the male would probably win, as it was her word against his. But if multiple girls accused him of the same thing, the girls would almost always win.
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Post by VBCOACH on May 12, 2022 20:25:19 GMT -5
I tell my girls that IF they generally eat right, it's OK to have a FEW slices of pizza, or a candy bar or an ice cream cone, even if I'm watching. They won't get fat or forget how to play volleyball. I'll burn it off you in practice or in games.
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Post by tomclen on May 12, 2022 20:35:25 GMT -5
Is it possible that all these complaints from former players aimed at Aird have actually saved his job for at least another season?
If the university fires him now, a good attorney could make the case that the school's own investigation could not determine an offense worthy of termination, and could then sue IU for damaging his reputation and career.
IU may be in the position of having to let him have another season or two to try to turn things around in the win column.
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Post by bbg95 on May 12, 2022 20:43:19 GMT -5
Is it possible that all these complaints from former players aimed at Aird have actually saved his job for at least another season? If the university fires him now, a good attorney could make the case that the school's own investigation could not determine an offense worthy of termination, and could then sue IU for damaging his reputation and career. IU may be in the position of having to let him have another season or two to try to turn things around in the win column. I don't think so. They could always just fire him because of his poor record and just pay the buyout. Which is what they should do. If he's still there in the fall, I think the reasons would be Indiana's unwillingness to pay the buyout and apathy toward the volleyball program on the part of the AD. |
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