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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 15:44:01 GMT -5
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slxpress likes this
Post by mervinswerved on Dec 6, 2023 15:44:01 GMT -5
BTW, as any good economist will explain, in a capitalist system it's impossible for the laborer to receive the whole loaf. All of us receive only some portion of the loaf, otherwise there's no profits, and the enterprise collapses. When I referenced a full loaf, I meant the players' fair share versus some smaller number the schools would be more comfortable parting with.
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 15:57:31 GMT -5
Post by slxpress on Dec 6, 2023 15:57:31 GMT -5
BTW, as any good economist will explain, in a capitalist system it's impossible for the laborer to receive the whole loaf. All of us receive only some portion of the loaf, otherwise there's no profits, and the enterprise collapses. When I referenced a full loaf, I meant the players' fair share versus some smaller number the schools would be more comfortable parting with. Fair share is a very subjective term. That's not to say you don't have a legitimate point of view, because you do, but throughout human existence fair share has meant a lot of different things to a lot of different people.
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 15:59:00 GMT -5
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Post by mervinswerved on Dec 6, 2023 15:59:00 GMT -5
When I referenced a full loaf, I meant the players' fair share versus some smaller number the schools would be more comfortable parting with. Fair share is a very subjective term. That's not to say you don't have a legitimate point of view, because you do, but throughout human existence fair share has meant a lot of different things to a lot of different people. As I said, that's what negotiating is for. In the NBA, the players get 50% of the revenue because that's what they've collectively bargained.
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 16:09:14 GMT -5
JT likes this
Post by mikegarrison on Dec 6, 2023 16:09:14 GMT -5
The next step is not that easy to discern, but it HAS to come from Congress on some level. Congress is struggling to keep the Federal Government running and can only just barely elect its own officers. What makes you think they can solve the NCAA's problems for them?
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 16:17:37 GMT -5
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Post by slxpress on Dec 6, 2023 16:17:37 GMT -5
The next step is not that easy to discern, but it HAS to come from Congress on some level. Congress is struggling to keep the Federal Government running and can only just barely elect its own officers. What makes you think they can solve the NCAA's problems for them? What in the world about my posts makes you think I believe Congress is going to step in any time soon? I've said over and over again they're not coming to the rescue any time soon. Which means it's all going to be a huge train wreck, whatever that looks like. In the meantime my school will keep collecting natties and competing at a high level in every sport we field. And the current environment with NIL and the transfer portal is helping immensely. I don't like any of it, but if it's going to be this way - and it is - then I'm glad we're in a position to take advantage of it. I look forward to some kind of sustainable model being put forward, because what we have now isn't it. But a sustainable model will require an act of Congress. That's my only point.
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bluepenquin
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 16:36:49 GMT -5
Post by bluepenquin on Dec 6, 2023 16:36:49 GMT -5
The next step is not that easy to discern, but it HAS to come from Congress on some level. Congress is struggling to keep the Federal Government running and can only just barely elect its own officers. What makes you think they can solve the NCAA's problems for them? The chances of congress passing some legislation on this is 100X more likely than actually coming together on something like a budget or 'solving' our economic fiscal policy. Now, 100X more likely than zero could still be zero. This isn't likely to have the same partisan problems like most things that cripple Washington. The key is going to be getting all the major stakeholders (Universities, NCAA, SA's - as much as you can get appropriate representation for them) to get together with a consensus plan for congress to act on.
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 16:50:00 GMT -5
Post by n00b on Dec 6, 2023 16:50:00 GMT -5
This isn't likely to have the same partisan problems like most things that cripple Washington. Maybe. But if this becomes Big Ten and SEC versus the rest of the country, you might see similar partisan splits.
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Post by mikegarrison on Dec 6, 2023 16:53:15 GMT -5
This isn't likely to have the same partisan problems like most things that cripple Washington. I think it would be an excellent resolution if D1 athletes became unionized employees who collectively bargain for their share of the profits being made by their athletic departments, but I bet that is not the resolution of the issue that bluepenquin supports.
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 16:56:19 GMT -5
Post by slxpress on Dec 6, 2023 16:56:19 GMT -5
Congress is struggling to keep the Federal Government running and can only just barely elect its own officers. What makes you think they can solve the NCAA's problems for them? The chances of congress passing some legislation on this is 100X more likely than actually coming together on something like a budget or 'solving' our economic fiscal policy. Now, 100X more likely than zero could still be zero. This isn't likely to have the same partisan problems like most things that cripple Washington. The key is going to be getting all the major stakeholders (Universities, NCAA, SA's - as much as you can get appropriate representation for them) to get together with a consensus plan for congress to act on. I like your hopeful attitude. My feeling is the current environment in this country is fully capable of making something completely partisan that you wouldn't think would be. If you look at Senator Booker's proposed legislation it is way more student athlete friendly than the proposed legislation Manchin and Tuberville were talking about. Of course, Manchin is retiring and Tuberville is using his political clout to make enemies all over the place, so it's tough to see anything coming from that front. Then you get to the House, and if there is a sliver of something to tear themselves apart over, they're going to find it. Especially among the Republicans, although it can get lobbed back and forth across the aisle just as easily. It's just tough to see them making it any kind of legislative priority until things get a lot worse than what they are now. I don't exactly know what I mean by that, other than it is going to get worse. It's like when I told people in the late 90s and early aughts that the current housing mortgage market wasn't sustainable because appraisers and lenders had been completely compromised from acting in an ethical manner across the entire industry. I didn't know what the end was going to look like, or when it was going to come, but I knew it was inevitable. That's how I feel right now about collegiate athletics.
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Dec 6, 2023 18:20:28 GMT -5
The chances of congress passing some legislation on this is 100X more likely than actually coming together on something like a budget or 'solving' our economic fiscal policy. Now, 100X more likely than zero could still be zero. This isn't likely to have the same partisan problems like most things that cripple Washington. The key is going to be getting all the major stakeholders (Universities, NCAA, SA's - as much as you can get appropriate representation for them) to get together with a consensus plan for congress to act on. I like your hopeful attitude. My feeling is the current environment in this country is fully capable of making something completely partisan that you wouldn't think would be. If you look at Senator Booker's proposed legislation it is way more student athlete friendly than the proposed legislation Manchin and Tuberville were talking about. Of course, Manchin is retiring and Tuberville is using his political clout to make enemies all over the place, so it's tough to see anything coming from that front. Then you get to the House, and if there is a sliver of something to tear themselves apart over, they're going to find it. Especially among the Republicans, although it can get lobbed back and forth across the aisle just as easily. It's just tough to see them making it any kind of legislative priority until things get a lot worse than what they are now. I don't exactly know what I mean by that, other than it is going to get worse. It's like when I told people in the late 90s and early aughts that the current housing mortgage market wasn't sustainable because appraisers and lenders had been completely compromised from acting in an ethical manner across the entire industry. I didn't know what the end was going to look like, or when it was going to come, but I knew it was inevitable. That's how I feel right now about collegiate athletics. It could get much worse before it get better anyway - this isn't going to be an easy fix in terms time. And it very may well be that congress will wait until things get much worse before the act. I just think if the NCAA, Universities and some kind of representation can get together ahead of this - that is the best avenue. And yes - getting the Universities to agree is going to be an issue.
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bluepenquin
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 18:21:38 GMT -5
Post by bluepenquin on Dec 6, 2023 18:21:38 GMT -5
This isn't likely to have the same partisan problems like most things that cripple Washington. Maybe. But if this becomes Big Ten and SEC versus the rest of the country, you might see similar partisan splits. The end result is the B1G and SEC take the ball and go there own way anyway. They have a lot of leverage here.
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Post by c4ndlelight on Dec 6, 2023 20:09:55 GMT -5
When I referenced a full loaf, I meant the players' fair share versus some smaller number the schools would be more comfortable parting with. Fair share is a very subjective term. That's not to say you don't have a legitimate point of view, because you do, but throughout human existence fair share has meant a lot of different things to a lot of different people. What the fair share means is also athlete v athlete. For decades, football and men's basketball have been subsidizing all of the other athletes, and when you look at the demographics of FB/MBB versus the Olympic and/or "country club" sports and athletes that are receiving huge windfalls, it raises questions.
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 20:25:14 GMT -5
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Post by toungeincheek on Dec 6, 2023 20:25:14 GMT -5
The next step is not that easy to discern, but it HAS to come from Congress on some level. Congress is struggling to keep the Federal Government running and can only just barely elect its own officers. What makes you think they can solve the NCAA's problems for them? We’re going to elect Bill Simmons as sports czar.
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Post by c4ndlelight on Dec 6, 2023 20:35:28 GMT -5
Fair share is a very subjective term. That's not to say you don't have a legitimate point of view, because you do, but throughout human existence fair share has meant a lot of different things to a lot of different people. What the fair share means is also athlete v athlete. For decades, football and men's basketball have been subsidizing all of the other athletes, and when you look at the demographics of FB/MBB versus the Olympic and/or "country club" sports and athletes that are receiving huge windfalls, it raises questions. In speaking of collective bargaining, do football players really have the same interests as swimmers? Should they be represented by the same union?
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NIL
Dec 6, 2023 20:55:14 GMT -5
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Post by mervinswerved on Dec 6, 2023 20:55:14 GMT -5
What the fair share means is also athlete v athlete. For decades, football and men's basketball have been subsidizing all of the other athletes, and when you look at the demographics of FB/MBB versus the Olympic and/or "country club" sports and athletes that are receiving huge windfalls, it raises questions. In speaking of collective bargaining, do football players really have the same interests as swimmers? Should they be represented by the same union? Don't know. That should be for the athletes to decide if they're allowed to organize.
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