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Post by VT Karen on Dec 2, 2023 15:10:15 GMT -5
You can’t use context to completely negate the plain text of the verse. Pray in private. In your room behind a closed door. That’s what Jesus instructed. But noted, as always, Christian’s’ selectively being Bible literalists. Regardless, I don’t care what the Bible says. The Baylor prayer thing has no place in an NCAA game. No one has rebutted that, the only thing people have offered up is “it’s not that bad” in response to valid concerns about peer pressure and individual decision-making. You have to use context when you read into anything. If you don't care what the Bible says than don't use it to try to make your point. That is asinine. We live in a free country where freedom of speech and freedom of religion is upheld so I absolutely think prayer has a play in the NCAA game. If I'm a coach or official for a school/team that doesn't want to pray after a match, I'm letting Baylor know before we even watch the film to prepare for the match. |
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Post by donut on Dec 2, 2023 15:19:12 GMT -5
I’m more than happy to point out when Christians aren’t following their own rulebook, regardless of whether I believe in the rulebook, which is exactly what is happening here!
And lmao isn’t Baylor special — opposing coaches need to be the ones who know they pray (before watching game film apparently), and the burden is on opposing coaches to reach out to Baylor to opt out of an unnecessary and irrelevant religious exercise.
Personally, I hope a team starts going under the net to pressure the other team into a Wiccan ritual. Or maybe some Buddhist meditation. That’s all super appropriate for a volleyball game apparently!
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Post by maigrey on Dec 2, 2023 15:38:48 GMT -5
I just think it's inappropriate. If Kentucky players want to pray somewhere in their own capacity post-match, I'm sure they are capable of doing so. If Kentucky or any other program has a problem with it I'm sure they could politely decline before the final point is even scored. From my view, I think it's classy that the Bears invite their opponents to partake in prayer and give glory to the Almighty. My question would be: would we have the same reaction if it was any other religion praying other than Christianity. If it were Muslim, Jewish, Wiccan, whatever would you feel uncomfortable if that was what the other team was asking you to participate in? I can't think of any examples other than glaring stereotypes, and I think that would be taken facetiously, Maybe I'm jaded, but I don't think people would be as "okay" with this if it were any other faith practice taking place. |
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Post by maigrey on Dec 2, 2023 15:43:13 GMT -5
lmk when you educate yourself on Baylor’s anti-LGBT history. This is a very sad take, IMO. You do realize the Bible describes the act as sinful. So yes, it’s a stance by people who believe in the Bible. I've actually taken a 4-year course on the Bible, and the one thing that is true is that there are at least two versions of every single story. The gospel itself has four, right? It's fascinating from an academic perspective if you look at it. In the Jewish culture, they did not merge different views on stories into one cohesive whole, but instead just added them all together. If you research into it, there are two Genesis stories, to Noah's ark stories, etc. Basically, you can prove anything using the Bible, because it has multiple different opinions intentionally written into it. (That being said, I'm a lapsed Episcopalian, because I'm not into evangelizing, and we have booze with everything. Literally. No joke, they had to make a ruling that says, "Non-alcoholic beverages should be served with the same attractiveness and accessibility as those containing alcohol [...] ) |
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Post by VT Karen on Dec 2, 2023 15:49:34 GMT -5
I’m more than happy to point out when Christians aren’t following their own rulebook, regardless of whether I believe in the rulebook, which is exactly what is happening here! And lmao isn’t Baylor special — opposing coaches need to be the ones who know they pray (before watching game film apparently), and the burden is on opposing coaches to reach out to Baylor to opt out of an unnecessary and irrelevant religious exercise. Personally, I hope a team starts going under the net to pressure the other team into a Wiccan ritual. Or maybe some Buddhist meditation. That’s all super appropriate for a volleyball game apparently! The Bible isn't just a rulebook it's a love letter from God to His creation. When Jesus came and died on the cross for our sins, He tore the veil that separates us from the Father freeing us from the bondage of sin and legalism. Also, how can you, in good faith, point out when Christians aren't following the Bible when you don't believe in it? Of course it's on the opposing coaches and team to protect the interests of their team. If someone comes under the net and wants to perform a Wiccan ritual with Baylor, I would hope that Baylor officials would say no but I wouldn't be shook up if they said yes. If Kentucky said no yesterday, I wouldn't have been surprised and definitely wouldn't take to a volleyball board to point out that they declined to pray with Baylor. |
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Post by jwvolley on Dec 2, 2023 15:56:09 GMT -5
I’m more than happy to point out when Christians aren’t following their own rulebook, regardless of whether I believe in the rulebook, which is exactly what is happening here! And lmao isn’t Baylor special — opposing coaches need to be the ones who know they pray (before watching game film apparently), and the burden is on opposing coaches to reach out to Baylor to opt out of an unnecessary and irrelevant religious exercise. Personally, I hope a team starts going under the net to pressure the other team into a Wiccan ritual. Or maybe some Buddhist meditation. That’s all super appropriate for a volleyball game apparently! Also, how can you, in good faith, point out when Christians aren't following the Bible when you don't believe in it? This doesn't make sense. What does one have to do with the other? |
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Post by VT Karen on Dec 2, 2023 16:04:04 GMT -5
Also, how can you, in good faith, point out when Christians aren't following the Bible when you don't believe in it? This doesn't make sense. What does one have to do with the other? It will always be a "gotcha" moment when non-believers point out that Christians don't follow the Bible because they don't believe what the Bible says in it's entirety. If you don't believe the Bible you can't believe that "all have fallen short of the glory of God" and that "our righteousness is like filthy rags." Christians know that we will never 100% be able to follow the Bible and that we live in a fallen world and are desperately in need of Jesus and His Grace. |
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Post by VT Karen on Dec 2, 2023 16:07:04 GMT -5
If Kentucky or any other program has a problem with it I'm sure they could politely decline before the final point is even scored. From my view, I think it's classy that the Bears invite their opponents to partake in prayer and give glory to the Almighty. My question would be: would we have the same reaction if it was any other religion praying other than Christianity. If it were Muslim, Jewish, Wiccan, whatever would you feel uncomfortable if that was what the other team was asking you to participate in? I can't think of any examples other than glaring stereotypes, and I think that would be taken facetiously, Maybe I'm jaded, but I don't think people would be as "okay" with this if it were any other faith practice taking place. Personally, I wouldn't want to see a Wiccan Seance after Baylor vs. Kentucky but again we live in a free country that constitutionally protects speech and religious rights. I personally wouldn't come to VT to point out how horrible the Wiccan Wildcats are if that were the case. |
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Post by gohuskervolleyball on Dec 2, 2023 16:26:53 GMT -5
I had no idea this conversation was going on. I have to catch up. Girl it ain’t even worth it tbh. |
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Post by gohuskervolleyball on Dec 2, 2023 16:30:20 GMT -5
Anyways, me sitting over here sipping my tea as a gay Christian 🫢
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Post by slxpress on Dec 2, 2023 17:02:22 GMT -5
Anyways, me sitting over here sipping my tea as a gay Christian 🫢 But a United Methodist. Not a Global Conference Methodist. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 17:30:53 GMT -5
Anyways, me sitting over here sipping my tea as a gay Christian 🫢 samesies |
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Post by houstonbear15 on Dec 2, 2023 17:55:19 GMT -5
What you’re describing is a problem in society/culture that is independent of Baylor volleyball. Exactly. Hence why Baylor should this whole show off the volleyball court. It has nothing to do with NCAA volleyball. Would encouraging that type of censorship open up things like Pride Night to the same scrutiny? Because that argument would certainly be made by some. |
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Post by donut on Dec 2, 2023 19:11:53 GMT -5
Well, that would be a bad argument!
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Post by donut on Dec 2, 2023 19:25:07 GMT -5
In case this got lost: if Baylor wants to pray on the court together after their matches, go for it. I still think it’s virtue signaling (and still not in line with scripture, which I guess is an opinion I’m not allowed to have), but the major issue is the pressuring of the other team to do so with them. And the subsequent media coverage of it.
It has nothing to do with being gay. Baylor’s anti-LGBT history and policies, and other bad things Baylor did or does, make the preachiness sting a little extra hard.
And that’s the last I’ll say (until next year likely when this same convo happens again lol). Go Cats, I thought Baylor fought pretty well and they should be much better next year. I do hope they help keep the Big 12 as a top conference.
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