|
Post by zero-rotation outside hitter on Sept 8, 2024 9:44:23 GMT -5
Your comment suggesting that assists are "meaningless" because doubles are no longer a thing (as long as they stay on your side) is a bridge way way too far. I remember Hugh McCutcheon making a good argument for taking away the double rule. It was something to the effect of "you're not usually bettering the ball when you double it, so it's not like teams are getting some kind of advantage if we let it slide." That's a rational point of view from where I stand. So, if someone "doubles" a ball (again remembering that it's somewhat subjective) and it still happens to be positioned in a spot that actually allows a hitter to get a kill off of it, then why would you be suggesting that a set like that should have no meaning statistically? Or that somehow the number of sets now under the new rule that result in kills are so often doubles that it makes assists a meaningless category. It is simply not the case. Again, your comment seemed, to me, an enormous leap in logic. To be clear, I love the new no doubles rule. It's correct. It's silly and takes away from the game (and in particular makes it less accessible to casual fans tuning in on TV, which is very important to continue attracting them) to call it. The thing we should all be able to agree on, and the logical basis of my thinking is: it's harder to hit a ball with the direction/control you desire if it's spinning, than if it's not spinning. Right? You should be able to accept that, it's correct. Just physics. So if a setter sends a spinning ball over to the hitter, they (the setter) are making it harder to get a kill than if the ball had no or minimal spin. At the end of the day: I don't get awarding a positive stat to the set just because the hitter was able to get a kill in spite of the set.
I could agree with everything you said here and still would never use the word "meaningless" to describe assists now as a statistic under the new double-contact rule.
|
|
|
Post by mplsgopher on Sept 8, 2024 9:46:23 GMT -5
To be clear, I love the new no doubles rule. It's correct. It's silly and takes away from the game (and in particular makes it less accessible to casual fans tuning in on TV, which is very important to continue attracting them) to call it. The thing we should all be able to agree on, and the logical basis of my thinking is: it's harder to hit a ball with the direction/control you desire if it's spinning, than if it's not spinning. Right? You should be able to accept that, it's correct. Just physics. So if a setter sends a spinning ball over to the hitter, they (the setter) are making it harder to get a kill than if the ball had no or minimal spin. At the end of the day: I don't get awarding a positive stat to the set just because the hitter was able to get a kill in spite of the set.
I could agree with everything you said here and still would never use the word "meaningless" to describe assists now as a statistic under the new double-contact rule. OK. Word choice issue only, then. Post updated
|
|
|
Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Sept 8, 2024 9:47:08 GMT -5
While I do understand your point, volleyball ain’t figure skating and points aren’t awarded for technical proficiency. A hitter can’t hit a ball that doesn’t get to them. If you get the ball to the hitter and they get a kill, you assisted in that. No matter how ugly it looks. While I do understand that point, then trying to parade around and celebrate a certain number of assists ... is bunk.
Similar scenario to celebrating number of passing yards thrown by a QB who only throws 5 yard routes and then the receivers do all the work, I suppose.
Solid analogy. As for the “parading around and celebrating”, did you watch the game? I ask this earnestly because I only saw parts and I’m not adept at discerning doubles that aren’t obvious. Did Shaff commit a bunch of “doubles” that disqualified the Gophers from claiming the Triple Double?
|
|
|
Post by mplsgopher on Sept 8, 2024 9:49:39 GMT -5
While I do understand that point, then trying to parade around and celebrate a certain number of assists ... is bunk.
Similar scenario to celebrating number of passing yards thrown by a QB who only throws 5 yard routes and then the receivers do all the work, I suppose.
Solid analogy. As for the “parading around and celebrating”, did you watch the game? I ask this earnestly because I only saw parts and I’m not adept at discerning doubles that aren’t obvious. Did Shaff commit a bunch of “doubles” that disqualified the Gophers from claiming the Triple Double? I wasn't trying to say anything like that, specifically.
There are plenty of other factors that go into the quality of a set that can make it harder to get a kill off it, right?
Trap sets Way off the net sets Inconsistent placement in general
Inconsistent tempo/height (causing hitter to either be slower, more cautious, or otherwise be out of place/timing) Spin
|
|
|
Post by mplsgopher on Sept 8, 2024 9:50:14 GMT -5
If sets were graded like passes are graded, that would be a great thing to see.
|
|
|
Post by craftylefty on Sept 8, 2024 11:32:49 GMT -5
Imho Chloe Ng should have entered the match after the Mel injury. Seems absolutely ridiculous not to try her.
(Yes, the whole “but she hasn’t played!” argument, but come on. We are not better with an injured player on the floor.)
Can Olivia Swenson pass??
|
|
|
Post by JT on Sept 8, 2024 11:40:17 GMT -5
Well, the Auburn match will be their third match in four days. Tues: Tommies
Thurs: LIU Fri: Auburn
Yes, but 1) they’ll be at home the rest of the preaseason and won’t have to factor in travel time to their schedules, and 2) St Thomas and LIU are nowhere near as menacing as Stanford/Texas/Baylor/TCU. After this week/weekend, we close out the pre-conference on the road at Green Bay. The competition level there should be minimal (Green Bay, N.Dakota, and Chicago State), but it’s still on the road, rather than at home.
|
|
|
Post by dodger on Sept 8, 2024 11:56:26 GMT -5
Solid analogy. As for the “parading around and celebrating”, did you watch the game? I ask this earnestly because I only saw parts and I’m not adept at discerning doubles that aren’t obvious. Did Shaff commit a bunch of “doubles” that disqualified the Gophers from claiming the Triple Double? I wasn't trying to say anything like that, specifically.
There are plenty of other factors that go into the quality of a set that can make it harder to get a kill off it, right?
Trap sets Way off the net sets Inconsistent placement in general
Inconsistent tempo/height (causing hitter to either be slower, more cautious, or otherwise be out of place/timing) Spin
Of course the assist stat is not a great stat for evaluating setters: but not calling doubles does not make it less so: when a quarter backs arm hets hit and the ball goes all wonky but the receiver still catches its a completion: a point gaurd who throws a crappy pass at the bigs ankles who flibs the catch and throws up a crazy shot and it goes in the point gaurd still hets assist: when a golden state warrior throws a ball out to Steph at the logo and he strokes it it os an assist. But the grading of each and the circumstances are evaluated by the staff but the press need a tangible way to promote a player and a team: just like digs is a stat but not graded for the public: a ‘bro with 48 digs on a team hitting .088 : the bro can still be honored in the press. I might have one of toughest serves on team but not the most aces. Lets just not get crazy about saying because we allow doubles its now not viable: it never really was for evaluating a great setter. And ps spin has no effect on ability to attack ball for kill.
|
|
|
Post by mop on Sept 8, 2024 11:59:15 GMT -5
We’re that close with good teams this early in the season. TCU should be ranked, and they probably will be tomorrow. Thankful to have a few lighter opponents before conference, and not as doubtful about opening with Wisconsin now.
|
|
|
Post by jimboslice on Sept 8, 2024 12:18:34 GMT -5
The Mel conversation is exhausting yall! Let’s not be all doom and gloom! She is obviously not the best pure setter in the nation nobody is gonna argue that. But she is very capable and does so much for this team. Triple doubles are not easy to come by!! This team has a lot of potential and watching them play so far has been frustrating at times but also really fun and exciting! We’ve had a lot of misfortunes the past few seasons so I’m just happy to see a competitive team that seems to be improving and will hopefully continue to improve!
|
|
|
Post by thanksmrsh on Sept 8, 2024 13:10:44 GMT -5
The Mel conversation is exhausting yall! Let’s not be all doom and gloom! She is obviously not the best pure setter in the nation nobody is gonna argue that. But she is very capable and does so much for this team. Triple doubles are not easy to come by!! This team has a lot of potential and watching them play so far has been frustrating at times but also really fun and exciting! We’ve had a lot of misfortunes the past few seasons so I’m just happy to see a competitive team that seems to be improving and will hopefully continue to improve! Not only is it exhausting, it’s ridiculous. It attacks her skill, athleticism, effort, work she puts into this team. How many fifth years have stayed loyal to their schools in the past years since Covid allowed for that year? Mpls-whatever your name is, have you played volleyball before? You make a lot of direct statements like you know the game then you question things I’d assume you’d know. For example, the setters job is to provide a good set of course but in the event they do not it is also just as much the hitters job to better the set as it is the setters to better the pass. It’s a chain of events to make a successful play and each part of that chain relies on the link that comes before it. How would you criticize if she was setting perfect balls and never getting a dig, ace, block….How bout you ease up dude and get a hobby.
|
|
|
Post by gopherhim on Sept 8, 2024 13:36:47 GMT -5
Auburn is up 2-1 against #15 Florida state. All 4 of their pins hitting .200ish right now. Always nice to have all pins clicking if you run a pin-heavy offense. (One or two of ours always seem to be off 🙁)
They lost talent and have three freshmen starting. One of the setters in a 6-2, an OH, and a middle. They also have a new transfer from Baylor at libero if you remember their DS Alexis Dacosta from last year. She’s good.
|
|
|
Post by gopherhim on Sept 8, 2024 13:42:33 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by skolgophers on Sept 8, 2024 13:42:50 GMT -5
Auburn is up 2-1 against #15 Florida state. All 4 of their pins hitting .200ish right now. Always nice to have all pins clicking if you run a pin-heavy offense. (One or two of ours always seem to be off 🙁) They lost talent and have three freshmen starting. One of the setters in a 6-2, an OH, and a middle. They also have a new transfer from Baylor at libero if you remember their DS Alexis Dacosta from last year. She’s good. No match is a “gimme” with this team until they can figure out how to stay consistent for 3 sets
|
|
|
Post by gopherhim on Sept 8, 2024 14:25:11 GMT -5
Auburn won 3-1. 16 blocks in 4 sets. Helps having a non-setter blocking opponent’s OHs at all times. Thanks for being tall and good at blocking Mel!
I was impressed by their freshmen. A setter with a good serve, a steady OH who digs a lot of balls, and a middle that was 4-0-6 with 8 blocks (I’m sure they wish MN native Kemp stayed, but they look like they’ll be ok to me).
Not to turn this into an Auburn thread. Just be mentally prepared for Auburn to put up a fight. It would be nice if Gophers steamrolled though! Just don’t hurt Kate’s sister!
Hope everyone’s blood pressure has leveled out. I’ve been on uncle duty for two nieces under 4 so I still feel crazy🤪
|
|