|
Post by Wiz on Aug 27, 2024 0:17:31 GMT -5
I see nothing has changed on VT. The fans still going at each other. Been away for almost two years!
|
|
|
Post by hapaguy on Aug 27, 2024 0:23:33 GMT -5
You keep missing the point! The point that HawaiiMongoose and I are making is NOT comparing the two programs or two sports against each other. The point is comparing what the two coaches have done with their programs since they took it over: one coach (Beeman) has elevated her program and one coach (Robyn) hasn't. That's the point HawaiiMongoose made that I wholeheartedly agree with. And contrary to what koavball keeps saying IT'S A FACT. I never denied that Beeman elevated what she'd received. I simply don't give it much weight. As pointed out, she took an 'F' program to at best a 'C' program that is the second biggest money losing program in the whole department. If football were still in Aloha Stadium, she'd have the Biggest Money Losing Program in the whole department, with the least amount of NCAAT wins to show for it. Zero; Nada; None. So, I don't give Beeman much applause for losing money left and right and having so little to show for it. While Ah Mow has generated small profits most years, has reached the NCAAT every year, was competitive in the NCAAT most years, and compared favorably to Shoji in his last seven years. During Ah Mow's tenure her program has had to deal with a greatly changing competitive landscape, where P5/4 schools were becoming football and MBB media giants raking in billions to their conferences, with their athletic departments expanding into the $250+ million per year range in expenditures. More than 5x as large as Hawai'i, and the gap growing each year. Still, Ah Mow had a Sweet Sixteen appearance. And then covid hit, the BWC went limp-wristed and cancelled her next season, and because of covid cancellations she lost key player and coaching talent. And yes, WBB had to deal with covid as well. But the momentum lost as an upper tier-2 team in WVB is much harder to regain than that of Tier-4 WBB program that has no serious post-season expectations. I know you don't appreciate that fact, but I'm not attacking you for your opinion. You are permitted yours. I really don't understand your point regarding Women's Basketball as it's ALWAYS lost money even when they had their most successful coach Vince Goo. Do you only measure success by whether a program makes money or not? No WBB coach in Hawaii will ever make money so what's your point? Do you want the coach of the WBB team to lose also and not elevate the program? "I simply don't give it much weight." How can you NOT give credit where credit is due? Sounds like because it loses money you would want to just get rid of it altogether and Title IX be damned. Lots of great talent has come through that program and lots of local girls got to stay home and compete for the home team because of WBB. At least Beeman has elevated the program - you can't say the same for Robyn. The rest of your comment is just more excuses. You and the other defenders of the indefensible keep repeating the same thing as if other mid-major programs haven't had to deal with the same problems. IMHO our team should be the preeminent mid-major in women's volleyball yet we can't even do that. We have a lot going for us: we play in front of one of the best fan bases in the country, play in one of the finest facilities in the nation in the Stan Sheriff Center, AND we also have a history of success and of being ranked (used to anyway). The data points I mentioned point to a program in decline and people like you don't seem to care and just want to make excuses for the slow downfall of our program...
|
|
|
Post by hapaguy on Aug 27, 2024 0:30:56 GMT -5
LOL @ this idea that some of the Robyn defenders keep making that because "USC, ucla, etc are not what they used to be either.." then I guess it's ok for our team to do the same...complete defeatist attitude....We should ALL hold our program to a higher standard than that!
|
|
|
Post by Wiz on Aug 27, 2024 0:52:49 GMT -5
Gone are the good ol’ days of VT, where people can have different opinions and not be attacked for it.
I see a lot of new people on here on the “attack mode”.
|
|
|
Post by eyelander on Aug 27, 2024 1:09:17 GMT -5
DAAAAMMMNNNN!!! The 1st match of season hasn’t even started yet and some of the people on here are already tearing each others’ heads off. 🤦🏻♂️
|
|
|
Post by noblesol on Aug 27, 2024 1:36:54 GMT -5
I never denied that Beeman elevated what she'd received. I simply don't give it much weight. As pointed out, she took an 'F' program to at best a 'C' program that is the second biggest money losing program in the whole department. If football were still in Aloha Stadium, she'd have the Biggest Money Losing Program in the whole department, with the least amount of NCAAT wins to show for it. Zero; Nada; None. So, I don't give Beeman much applause for losing money left and right and having so little to show for it. While Ah Mow has generated small profits most years, has reached the NCAAT every year, was competitive in the NCAAT most years, and compared favorably to Shoji in his last seven years. During Ah Mow's tenure her program has had to deal with a greatly changing competitive landscape, where P5/4 schools were becoming football and MBB media giants raking in billions to their conferences, with their athletic departments expanding into the $250+ million per year range in expenditures. More than 5x as large as Hawai'i, and the gap growing each year. Still, Ah Mow had a Sweet Sixteen appearance. And then covid hit, the BWC went limp-wristed and cancelled her next season, and because of covid cancellations she lost key player and coaching talent. And yes, WBB had to deal with covid as well. But the momentum lost as an upper tier-2 team in WVB is much harder to regain than that of Tier-4 WBB program that has no serious post-season expectations. I know you don't appreciate that fact, but I'm not attacking you for your opinion. You are permitted yours. I really don't understand your point regarding Women's Basketball as it's ALWAYS lost money even when they had their most successful coach Vince Goo. Do you only measure success by whether a program makes money or not? No WBB coach in Hawaii will ever make money so what's your point? Do you want the coach of the WBB team to lose also and not elevate the program? "I simply don't give it much weight." How can you NOT give credit where credit is due? Sounds like because it loses money you would want to just get rid of it altogether and Title IX be damned. Lots of great talent has come through that program and lots of local girls got to stay home and compete for the home team because of WBB. At least Beeman has elevated the program - you can't say the same for Robyn. The rest of your comment is just more excuses. You and the other defenders of the indefensible keep repeating the same thing as if other mid-major programs haven't had to deal with the same problems. IMHO our team should be the preeminent mid-major in women's volleyball yet we can't even do that. We have a lot going for us: we play in front of one of the best fan bases in the country, play in one of the finest facilities in the nation in the Stan Sheriff Center, AND we also have a history of success and of being ranked (used to anyway). The data points I mentioned point to a program in decline and people like you don't seem to care and just want to make excuses for the slow downfall of our program... Always losing money, means Manoa WBB is not a revenue sport. And never will be, I agree. Seems obvious. It's a Title IX charity case. But UH WVB is considered a revenue sport and has remained so under Ah Mow. I give her credit for that. In a post-House Settlement world, FBS Universities that aim to be or stay upper mid-tier to tier-1 in their revenue sports will 'choose/be required' to elect revenue sharing. Even a $250 million/year revenue athletic department like Ohio St. is currently considering 'tiering' down or completely cutting non-revenue sports to generate free cash flow to enable revenue sharing in their productive revenue sports. They likely wouldn't cut WBB but they could prune it back into a lower 'tier' with fewer assistants, smaller rosters, fewer scholarships, less marketing, not renewing expensive contracts, etc. So, Beeman gets no applause from me for elevating her team on the backs of the revenue programs in the athletic department, including Ah Mows. If any Manoa programs get 'tiered' in the future to support the post-House Settlement landscape, my vote would be to chop back WBB. Even their good teams have been a product hard to watch, with no realistic expectations in post-season. They can retire Beeman, hire a cheap young coach, cut an assistant and some scholarships, and aim each year to get into the Big West Tournament with no expectations for the NCAAT. About where Beeman has taken them and plateaued. The rest of my comments on the competitive landscape for WVB are just facts. As far as other mid-majors perhaps doing better than Hawai'i, the majority of those have been in stronger WVB conferences with regional and travel advantages, greatly helping their RPI. Which is what has mattered the past couple of decades. AVCA ranking being just a marketing tool subjectively done, to excite the casual fan. And most of the mid-majors that have exceled have had the benefit of more than adequate monetary resources with less travel expense than Hawai'i. The transformation of the competitive landscape was well underway before Shoji departed. You can howl against the moon, but the facts will remain facts.
|
|
|
Post by VT Karen on Aug 27, 2024 3:25:58 GMT -5
I'm so excited for Mili and the rest of the newcomers!
|
|
|
Post by bucky415 on Aug 27, 2024 4:39:04 GMT -5
The non conference home matches fall on my days off, so I will be able to watch them. I am sad the UCLA series is not continuing, though.
|
|
|
Post by babybacksets on Aug 27, 2024 12:00:38 GMT -5
Idk why I thought this was going to be new pages worth of updates and substantive discussions.
It’s just whinefan and fupaguy squawking again
|
|
|
Post by wahinefan on Aug 27, 2024 14:48:26 GMT -5
Not to mention, more name calling by Baby.
|
|
|
Post by 808empath on Aug 27, 2024 15:07:30 GMT -5
Idk why I thought this was going to be new pages worth of updates and substantive discussions. It’s just whinefan and fupaguy squawking again 💯‼️
|
|
|
Post by molokaiboi on Aug 27, 2024 15:42:34 GMT -5
Friday is almost here! ❤️
|
|
|
Post by kekoagoldenbear on Aug 27, 2024 19:24:46 GMT -5
Going into the season I really have no expectations for this team, it will be a nice surprise if we are able to win the Big West. IMHO anything less than winning the Big West and advancing to the NCAA tournament would be a disappointment, in this season or any season. The Wahine are one of the most historically accomplished women's volleyball programs with one of the most passionate and supportive fan bases in all of Division 1. Expectations for both recruiting and on-court performance should be commensurately high. When players leave or graduate we should be able to reload, not just rebuild. If anyone associated with the program is content to back off from that standard of excellence then they're in the wrong job. It doesn't matter that UH isn't a power conference school. The Wahine have a level of visibility and popularity in the local community that rivals that of any women's volleyball program anywhere. With focused and competent leadership it should be possible to leverage that strong community support to generate the NIL funds and other resources necessary to remain at the top of the Big West. Laura Beeman is finding ways to do that for the UH women's basketball program and she doesn't have the benefit of 30 consecutive NCAA tournament bids or crowds of 6,000 plus in the SSC to impress potential new recruits. While Robyn has a very different style from Laura, so far she's figured out how to keep the NCAA tournament streak alive through the ups and downs of each year of her tenure, and I won't be content with one iota less from Robyn and her staff going forward. Your perspective adds a lot of value for discussion. The landscape of college sports has changed with the rise of NIL and the growing dominance of the P4 conferences. Mid-majors face challenges in competing, but a program like Wahine Volleyball has unique advantages, especially with its rich history and passionate fan base. While Robyn has maintained a certain level of performance, there’s definitely room for improvement in recruiting. I just don't think she has the personality for it. The program needs someone who can really sell the experience of playing in front of thousands of devoted fans and becoming a local celebrity. Leveraging that could help elevate the program back to where it belongs.
|
|
|
Post by ShaveDoji on Aug 27, 2024 19:28:09 GMT -5
hawaiiathletics.com/news/2024/8/27/womens-volleyball-faces-smu-san-diego-to-open-2024-season.aspxPreview of the Hawaiian Airlines Wahine Volleyball Classic this weekend. Will be a tough test right out of the gate for the Bows. SMU looks to be pretty experienced with impact transfers, Tabron and Okammor. Know San Diego had a down year last year, but I think Petrie is a good coach, and expect her team to be competitive as usual. Have been enjoying the yearly series between UH and USD.
|
|
|
Post by rainbowcard on Aug 27, 2024 19:45:50 GMT -5
hawaiiathletics.com/news/2024/8/27/womens-volleyball-faces-smu-san-diego-to-open-2024-season.aspxPreview of the Hawaiian Airlines Wahine Volleyball Classic this weekend. Will be a tough test right out of the gate for the Bows. SMU looks to be pretty experienced with impact transfers, Tabron and Okammor. Know San Diego had a down year last year, but I think Petrie is a good coach, and expect her team to be competitive as usual. Have been enjoying the yearly series between UH and USD. I didn't even realized Nnedi transfered to SMU, that will be a fun matchup and Kate playing against her old club teammate!
|
|