|
Post by ay2013 on May 8, 2024 17:03:56 GMT -5
I find a lot of these comments rather illuminating. Not to take away from the purpose of volleytalk, which is to foster discussion, but at the end of the day, none of the complaints about what Heather is doing with the setters, or who she favors and why, or thinking its a mistake for certain players playing certain positions, actually matters. Taking issue with a few less wins in any given season on pure speculation just isn't going to move the needle. She also gets a lot of USAV attention, so it's obvious that the larger coaching circles don't see her as some sort of loose cannon that can't be trusted with the coaching reigns.
If the Bowers want to continually pop out kids to feed to the BYU womens volleyball program, more power to them. If Heather wants to favor those players, more power to her. If you don't like it as a fan, then don't support BYU volleyball. I also find it a bit hard to feel sorry for the players that still decide to go to BYU volleyball, knowing all of this. If we here on volleytalk are talking about these things, you can bet it's not a secret on the ground and in the club circles, yet these players continually CHOOSE BYU volleyball. It's like we know John Cook is a douche bag who lies, but elite players line up at the door waiting for a Nebraska offer. If these players are unhappy, either don't sign with BYU in the first place, or transfer, seems pretty cut and dry to me.
|
|
vvv
Sophomore
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 118
|
Post by vvv on May 8, 2024 17:06:22 GMT -5
Okay.... The saga continues.... I am at practice and just found out that Damuni is planning to serve a mission. Apparently she wanted to leave before Fall so she doesn't burn another year of eligibility and has no desire to return to BYU after how Spring played out. She is in the portal to get her name and story out to other schools before she heads out on her mission. This tells me she either 1 wasn't promised a spot when she returns like most of the mission girls have to deal with or 2, she was just plain finished with not being able to use her talents here at BYU. The point about her being a DS is also interesting. She doesn't let anything fall. So, not even using her to help in the backrow is puzzling as well. I don't know her personally, but from those who do, she is somewhat of a gem to have on any team. Rachel Jepsen, from Club V and playing at Pitt will also be serving a mission in France. I gotta give it to these girls. This not the easiest route, but they must have enough "faith," and will let things fall into place??? Lee and Prior- totally agree- at least try them and see what difference it makes? I have a feeling Heather will have to do something different- Jonny, Livingston and Damuni all gone in a matter of months. Hoping Heather will use her expertise to make this work for the season.
|
|
vvv
Sophomore
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 118
|
Post by vvv on May 8, 2024 17:08:02 GMT -5
Husky does have a point here as well....
|
|
|
Post by pelagius on May 8, 2024 17:24:54 GMT -5
Personally, I still think Olmstead is a good coach. I also think W. Bower was a pretty good setter throughout her career (she never overcame some of her location issues and obviously was undersized but still pretty good). I think Alex Bower is quite talented.
I don't now anything about potential biases driving Olmstead's decisions making. Ten years in I think the weaknesses that have shown up for Olmstead as a coach are primarily the following:
1. Identifying and signing good passing littles. 2. Identifying pins that project to high level ball control outsides. Most have looked (at least to me) like three rotation bangers that they hoped they could develop into six rotation outsides. Or maybe just passing development of outsides is subpar. I do think this problem is likely solved in the next few years because of Little.
3. The right side has been a general weakness in the H. Olmstead era. One elite season from Koerber on the right, and one good season with Grimmer on the right. The 2018 teams weakness was the RS. BYU almost had a good season on the RS in 2017, but Taylen Ballard got injured. The RS has struggled in general. Given the hitting talent BYU can recruit, this strikes me as a pretty big failure during the Olmstead era.
If BYU ends up with decent passing, I think they'll be quite good this year.
|
|
|
Post by bbg95 on May 8, 2024 17:27:12 GMT -5
The point about her being a DS is also interesting. She doesn't let anything fall. So, not even using her to help in the backrow is puzzling as well. I think most setters want to, you know, set. It's like asking a quarterback to move to wide receiver or something. Some do, but others transfer.
|
|
vvv
Sophomore
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 118
|
Post by vvv on May 8, 2024 17:38:42 GMT -5
I do think although these points are valid, that in cases like meyer and damuni, both are bottomline better than the setters already there. So, since I don't know anything heather tells them, I believe that they come in thinking they want to win a National Championship, not just have a "pretty talented," setter on the court. The absolute best should be there. Just like the quarterback situation.... the best needs to be there, not the one that could possibly be favored even though they may be pretty good. Had meyer been our setter the last 3 years... we would have been in the sweet 16 or higher- no doubt. Not that I have watched her play in person, but any you tube or film I have seen far surpasses what W bower could do, as talented as she is. As far as A bower and her talent... she is very talented... but when girls commit to high level collegiate schools, I want to think that even though they hear "favortism," yadayadayada..... they feel they can come in and beat it out. But, at least in these 2 cases, that wasn't true.
|
|
|
Post by pelagius on May 8, 2024 18:04:00 GMT -5
I do think although these points are valid, that in cases like meyer and damuni, both are bottomline better than the setters already there. So, since I don't know anything heather tells them, I believe that they come in thinking they want to win a National Championship, not just have a "pretty talented," setter on the court. The absolute best should be there. Just like the quarterback situation.... the best needs to be there, not the one that could possibly be favored even though they may be pretty good. Had meyer been our setter the last 3 years... we would have been in the sweet 16 or higher- no doubt. Not that I have watched her play in person, but any you tube or film I have seen far surpasses what W bower could do, as talented as she is. As far as A bower and her talent... she is very talented... but when girls commit to high level collegiate schools, I want to think that even though they hear "favortism," yadayadayada..... they feel they can come in and beat it out. But, at least in these 2 cases, that wasn't true.
I saw Meyer in the Fall 2021 scrimmage and she certainly wasn't ahead of W. Bower at that point. Now maybe that was Olmstead's fault; maybe she didn't give Meyer enough time in Fall camp. Or maybe Meyer just had a bad outing in the scrimmage.
In general, I would probably frame what happened with W. Bower from 2019-2023 as the following: Olmstead gambled that she could create an elite team with an undersized but insanely athletic setter. It didn't quite happen. I think mostly because of issues related to passing, but I also don't think W. Bower quite developed into the setter BYU needed to be elite. The mistake may have been that the staff was overconfident about the likelihood that W. Bower could develop elite location and touch. It's not obvious to me the staff should have given up on the gamble in the Fall of 2021. W Bower had shown pretty good development up to that point (I think injuries hurt her development after 2021 a lot). So even if Meyer's ceiling was higher, I get why they would have been reluctant (although I definitely think it's possible that the staff didn't give Meyer enough opportunities ... particularly as it relates to her chances to take over the starting job in the future).
I don't understand what Olmstead saw in Alex Bower that led to her picking Alex Bower so quickly over Damuni. But the Whitney Bower versus Meyer stuff is much more understandable to me.
|
|
vvv
Sophomore
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 118
|
Post by vvv on May 8, 2024 20:24:24 GMT -5
Okay... yes, I did not see Meyer play back then. I have looked at some of her Long Beach matches and she is amazing. So, yes, maybe she was just not given the chance to develop here. If it is anything like the Damuni/Bower situation... that could very well be the case. I guess it is what it is.. Both seem like they know what they want and will go after it in their own way. I have definitely heard that some players just decide that the positives of BYU are stronger than their desire to start and they are happy just staying put rather than transferring. Meyer, Damuni and I also forgot about Decker, all decided that wasn't for them.
|
|
vvv
Sophomore
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 118
|
Post by vvv on May 8, 2024 21:04:23 GMT -5
I also think that as great as a collegiate and national coach Olmstead may be.... These above example show that maybe she doesn't communicate what she has in store adequately. For example, maybe if Meyer, Damuni, Decker all knew that she was set on her Bower thread, they may have decided to go elsewhere from the start. I don't think athletes of their caliber go in thinking they will be back ups unless they are told that from the start- transferring is not the easiest route to take.
|
|
vvv
Sophomore
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 118
|
Post by vvv on May 8, 2024 21:04:53 GMT -5
Do we see any transfers coming our way?
|
|
|
Post by azvb on May 8, 2024 23:24:38 GMT -5
So I did this earlier for just Alex Bower and Damuni, but I am adding in the setting breakdown for Thunstrom as well for the two scrimmages I saw (first Utah match and the UVU match): A. Bower: 5-1 three sets, 6-2 two sets, 5-2 one set. Damuni: 5-1 one set, 6-2 one set, 5-2 one set Thunstrom: 6-2 three sets (two with Bower and one with Damuni) Thunstrom played a bit less than Damuni. They both played three sets in those two scrimmages, but Damuni got the one 5-1 set. So that's more rotations. If you count 5-1 sets as one set in terms of rotations and a 6-2 or 5-2 as 0.5 of set as rotations then in terms of time played: Alex Bower: 4 Damuni: 2
Thunstrom: 1.5 I admit, math was never my forte. But here’s how I count this: Bower: six sets Damuni: 3 sets Thunstrom: 3 sets. I guess you’re giving weight to playing a 5-1? Two questions: *What is a 5-2? *Why doesn’t BYU have 3 assistant coaches?
|
|
|
Post by azvb on May 8, 2024 23:30:11 GMT -5
I have tremendous respect for anyone who goes on a mission. Missions are HARD. Not that I have personal experience-my faith isn’t as strong as these 19-20 year old girls-but my two sons served and all my nephews. The stories they tell…….
My oldest son served in Russia. We were going to go to Russia at the end of his mission to do a bit of sight seeing, fly home with him. My son told my husband, “Please don’t come. I don’t want mom to see how I’ve been treated the past two years by the Russian people.” 😢😢😢😢 Found out much later he was beaten up a few times, arrested a few times, spit on, etc.
|
|
|
Post by pelagius on May 8, 2024 23:44:21 GMT -5
I admit, math was never my forte. But here’s how I count this: Bower: six sets Damuni: 3 sets Thunstrom: 3 sets. I guess you’re giving weight to playing a 5-1? Yeah, that's all I was trying to do. Alex Bower set the front row rotations and then when the setter position moved to the backrow, Damuni subbed in and set the backrow. So five hitters and two setters: 5-2.
|
|
|
Post by volleyguy on May 9, 2024 0:57:10 GMT -5
I admit, math was never my forte. But here’s how I count this: Bower: six sets Damuni: 3 sets Thunstrom: 3 sets. I guess you’re giving weight to playing a 5-1? Yeah, that's all I was trying to do. Alex Bower set the front row rotations and then when the setter position moved to the backrow, Damuni subbed in and set the backrow. So five hitters and two setters: 5-2. Unless you also have a libero, in which case it’s probably should be called a 4-2
|
|
|
Post by marnvbc2 on May 10, 2024 13:14:10 GMT -5
I admit, math was never my forte. But here’s how I count this: Bower: six sets Damuni: 3 sets Thunstrom: 3 sets. I guess you’re giving weight to playing a 5-1? Yeah, that's all I was trying to do. Alex Bower set the front row rotations and then when the setter position moved to the backrow, Damuni subbed in and set the backrow. So five hitters and two setters: 5-2. This whole 5-2 issue also bothered me. Damuni can jump higher than Bower and actually played RT side at nationals open division when she wasn't setting. I am not saying that was a smart coaching move but Damuni is a better blocker than A Bower .... not close and so putting Bower in the front row and keeping Damuni in the back row was very telling and it was probably the point that I gave up on impartiality with Olmstead.
|
|