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Post by Phaedrus on May 18, 2018 15:17:29 GMT -5
www.brainpickings.org/2016/10/06/bertrand-russell-oswald-mosley/From Bertrand Russell, reminds me of some of the contentious arguments that have occurred regarding RB. ________________________________________________________________________________________________________ It is always difficult to decide on how to respond to people whose ethos is so alien and, in fact, repellent to one’s own. It is not that I take exception to the general points made by you but that every ounce of my energy has been devoted to an active opposition to cruel bigotry, compulsive violence, and the sadistic persecution which has characterised the philosophy and practice of fascism. I feel obliged to say that the emotional universes we inhabit are so distinct, and in deepest ways opposed, that nothing fruitful or sincere could ever emerge from association between us. I should like you to understand the intensity of this conviction on my part. It is not out of any attempt to be rude that I say this but because of all that I value in human experience and human achievement.
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Post by cabinfever on May 18, 2018 16:44:52 GMT -5
Just what we needed, another Butler thread. This one will also get locked. I CALLED IT For starters, this. I’d say this is someone who wants the thread locked. You have a hair trigger response to anything posted, always contrary to folks supporting RB’s victims. So let’s get back to the real issue here: how to remove a known sexual predator from our sport? Your turn to answer my original question; however, I really don’t expect a response from you, now or ever, since that is your MO. Again, I hope you are onboard with supporting RB’s victims and getting him removed. Peace, Village.
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Post by Sorry Ass Sal on May 18, 2018 17:03:51 GMT -5
Just what we needed, another Butler thread. This one will also get locked. I CALLED IT For starters, this. I’d say this is someone who wants the thread locked. You have a hair trigger response to anything posted, always contrary to folks supporting RB’s victims. So let’s get back to the real issue here: how to remove a known sexual predator from our sport? Your turn to answer my original question; however, I really don’t expect a response from you, now or ever, since that is your MO. Again, I hope you are onboard with supporting RB’s victims and getting him removed. Peace, Village. I have no interest in whether this thread gets locked or not. I don't care. I made that original statement because all of them in recent memory have. Please see past (locked) RB threads regarding my comments on the subject at hand.
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Post by bigfan on May 18, 2018 18:20:47 GMT -5
So let’s get back to the real issue here: how to remove a known sexual predator from our sport?
I thought it would be a simple black and white situation. I am wrong.
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Post by stevehorn on May 18, 2018 19:05:28 GMT -5
So let’s get back to the real issue here: how to remove a known sexual predator from our sport?
I thought it would be a simple black and white situation. I am wrong. Not trying to be argumentative, but why did you think it would be simple? Also what did you expect to happen by now?
IMO the difficulty factor is that RB is not just a coach, but also the owner (?) of the club where he coached. Also making it difficult IMO is that there is not a criminal charge, much less a conviction, nor until recently has their been a civil case file according to what I've read. It may actually prove to be relatively simple, but not necessarily quick. I think quick is what you probably wanted the most. The factors I listed are likely the ones that may keep it from being quick and/or simple.
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Post by bigfan on May 19, 2018 11:33:27 GMT -5
Also what did you expect to happen by now? Rick Butler in jail
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Post by Sorry Ass Sal on May 19, 2018 13:24:15 GMT -5
Also what did you expect to happen by now? Rick Butler in jail That's hard to do without any criminal charge. Which is why he will most likely avoid it.
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Post by stevehorn on May 19, 2018 16:55:57 GMT -5
Also what did you expect to happen by now? Rick Butler in jail I'm assuming this is sarcasm. I would think you have followed this enough to know that the statute of limitations have long passed.
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Post by vbfanantic on May 19, 2018 17:38:10 GMT -5
www.brainpickings.org/2016/10/06/bertrand-russell-oswald-mosley/From Bertrand Russell, reminds me of some of the contentious arguments that have occurred regarding RB. ________________________________________________________________________________________________________ It is always difficult to decide on how to respond to people whose ethos is so alien and, in fact, repellent to one’s own. It is not that I take exception to the general points made by you but that every ounce of my energy has been devoted to an active opposition to cruel bigotry, compulsive violence, and the sadistic persecution which has characterised the philosophy and practice of fascism. I feel obliged to say that the emotional universes we inhabit are so distinct, and in deepest ways opposed, that nothing fruitful or sincere could ever emerge from association between us. I should like you to understand the intensity of this conviction on my part. It is not out of any attempt to be rude that I say this but because of all that I value in human experience and human achievement. Phaedrus - I am with you.
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Post by why on May 20, 2018 20:10:41 GMT -5
Brutal........they actually said under oath that he RAPED THEM. SAD SAD SAD Under oath one of the girls also said he said he told her he has a gun and knows how to use it. What kind of coach would every threaten one of their former players by telling them they have a GUN? Beyond Sad!
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2018 0:26:44 GMT -5
Thank you for your courage in posting the continuing coverage of, plus outrage at, the ongoing Butler-related news, 'why'. Keeping us abreast of the many recent developments is appreciated!
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Post by why on May 23, 2018 15:05:14 GMT -5
Thank you for your courage in posting the continuing coverage of, plus outrage at, the ongoing Butler-related news, 'why'. Keeping us abreast of the many recent developments is appreciated! Here is more information from NPR about the hearing that took place last week. I think it has some additional valuable information for those who would like to find out the truth. Illinois Senate Tackles Sexual Assault In Youth Sports nprillinois.org/post/illinois-senate-tackles-sexual-assault-youth-sports#stream/0In terms of reporting all kinds of abuse, it cannot be stated enough parents or players should report directly to CPS or Local Law Enforcement. Reporting to another coach, Club Director, Athletic Director, or NGB is not enough. They are not trained to investigate these types of cases. One other benefit is false allegations are reduced when reported to Law Enforcement vs the other parties.
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Post by stevehorn on May 23, 2018 17:42:07 GMT -5
Thank you for your courage in posting the continuing coverage of, plus outrage at, the ongoing Butler-related news, 'why'. Keeping us abreast of the many recent developments is appreciated! Here is more information from NPR about the hearing that took place last week. I think it has some additional valuable information for those who would like to find out the truth. Illinois Senate Tackles Sexual Assault In Youth Sports nprillinois.org/post/illinois-senate-tackles-sexual-assault-youth-sports#stream/0In terms of reporting all kinds of abuse, it cannot be stated enough parents or players should report directly to CPS or Local Law Enforcement. Reporting to another coach, Club Director, Athletic Director, or NGB is not enough. They are not trained to investigate these types of cases. One other benefit is false allegations are reduced when reported to Law Enforcement vs the other parties.
IMO your last paragraph is very important. In retrospect, situations such as Butler, Nasser, or Sandusky (and many less publicized) may never have become a hot topic in current times had just one person called law enforcement. Also not only are the people in the positions you mentioned not trained investigators, they usually have a vested interest in the outcome.
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Post by reader on May 23, 2018 22:10:33 GMT -5
It's better for the organization too. The focus stays on the offender and the temptation to protect the org is more easily redirected to protecting the victims. There are lots of groups that wish more calls had gone that direction over the past hundred years.
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2018 0:44:12 GMT -5
Whenever there are cultures of greed, egoism, cover-ups, complicity, plus 'ends justifying means', institutions tend to deflect, dismiss, evade and just-plain-enable wrongdoing. MSU, PSU & SPVB are "shining" examples of this (not to mention USOC, AAU, USAV, NCAA, et al). The Main Thing now is to support the numerous(!) victims/ families; & to jointly say, loudly + clearly: ENOUGH! This entails aiming said message to: corporate sponsors; club organizations; national orgs, etc. Hurt their bottom line.
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