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Post by deohge on Feb 19, 2019 14:19:22 GMT -5
Hi dirtbag, who's in a pissing match now? Your own history is fogging your mind with delusional hopes. You have been reported: via TWO different means (One a Direct PM to moderator). 'Bye! Bye? Still here. Moving on, have a nice day.
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Post by bigfan on Feb 19, 2019 21:43:01 GMT -5
Do punishments actually even work? Like making kids do running exercises or stairs if they don't do their best, is that even effective? I would think that positively upbuilding teammates would be ideal. In my daughter's last year, 17's, of volleyball she ended up with what I will nicely describe as a petty person as a coach. This coach would undermine the girls, specific players, very frequently. NO ONE played their best all season. They all hated her and would unite on occasion as a team because they disliked her so much, but that mutual dislike of her was not enough to keep them strong. Coaches like that should not be allowed to coach, they undermine the entire point of being a team. I found it to be a completely ineffective way of keeping a team dynamic. It literally killed my kids love for the game. She (coach)was a fan of doling out punishments. I don't think it ever occurred to her to be pleasant, think of her team as the best and that they would try to rise to the occasion. A real shame. I hear ya. This is actually either (a) a very lazy coaching style or (b) a coach who doesn’t know what to do so ok y’all run. Smh. Should be someone’s assistant (maybe) to learn. We see this far too often in HS, Club and even at college level. I know of a specific DII here in SC. Very sad for the athletes who associate the sport they once loved, now with misery. Totally agree.
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Post by bigfan on Feb 19, 2019 21:46:29 GMT -5
You have been reported: via TWO different means (One a Direct PM to moderator). 'Bye! Bye? Still here. Moving on, have a nice day. Be strong in these trying times.
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Post by ironhammer on Feb 19, 2019 22:10:00 GMT -5
What is going on here? I feel like a parent at Chuck E Cheese where a turf war randomly erupts between two rival biker gangs. How did such an inoccuous topic turn so ugly so fast? It's VT, any topic can erupt when you least expected it.
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Post by coahc21 on Feb 20, 2019 10:44:24 GMT -5
My favorite is when coaching the kids where winning IS the reward, and losing is the punishment. Competitive kids > Pavlovian conditioning Depends on the both the age level and the gender in my experience.... Punishments teach kids how "not to lose" rather than to play to win. Especially in practice, you have to be able to encourage risk taking. i.e. on the service line - in practice you should want your athlete to push herself to take that next step in making her serve more aggressive....by placing a punishment for losing on her, she is going to serve "safer" to avoid the punishment...and now you've just wasted a valuable serving rep that did not allow your athlete to improve
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Post by boh on Feb 20, 2019 10:52:26 GMT -5
Depends on the both the age level and the gender in my experience.... Punishments teach kids how "not to lose" rather than to play to win. Especially in practice, you have to be able to encourage risk taking. i.e. on the service line - in practice you should want your athlete to push herself to take that next step in making her serve more aggressive....by placing a punishment for losing on her, she is going to serve "safer" to avoid the punishment...and now you've just wasted a valuable serving rep that did not allow your athlete to improve Agree completely with encouraging risk taking. I am big on that even in the older age groups. I do however think practicing "safe" also has its benefits. There are times and places to take risks and there are times and places to not take risks. Good players should know how and when to do both.
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Post by coahc21 on Feb 20, 2019 10:57:10 GMT -5
Punishments teach kids how "not to lose" rather than to play to win. Especially in practice, you have to be able to encourage risk taking. i.e. on the service line - in practice you should want your athlete to push herself to take that next step in making her serve more aggressive....by placing a punishment for losing on her, she is going to serve "safer" to avoid the punishment...and now you've just wasted a valuable serving rep that did not allow your athlete to improve Agree completely with encouraging risk taking. I am big on that even in the older age groups. I do however think practicing "safe" also has its benefits. There are times and places to take risks and there are times and places to not take risks. Good players should know how and when to do both. Good point...athletes need to know when to go all out and when to throttle back Depending on where you are along in the season has a lot to do with this...midway through a season I am going to assume that my team has a "safe serve" in their back pocket and it is my job to educate them on when to do it...hoping that by the midway point of the season, in practices we can take a risk here During preseason we will sometimes have practices of all "B" serves to help save shoulders
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Post by eazy on Feb 20, 2019 12:02:04 GMT -5
Agree completely with encouraging risk taking. I am big on that even in the older age groups. I do however think practicing "safe" also has its benefits. There are times and places to take risks and there are times and places to not take risks. Good players should know how and when to do both. Good point...athletes need to know when to go all out and when to throttle back Depending on where you are along in the season has a lot to do with this...midway through a season I am going to assume that my team has a "safe serve" in their back pocket and it is my job to educate them on when to do it...hoping that by the midway point of the season, in practices we can take a risk here During preseason we will sometimes have practices of all "B" serves to help save shoulders Very good points. We encourage safe serving when in drills that are designed to work on SR offense. So are there any real times that consequences or rewards are actually necessary? And I’m not talking about verbal reprimands or praise. Do kids need to “fear” a physical punishment, or can they simply fear disappointing their coach/teammates? Are punishments ONLY effective when kids don’t respect their coach?
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Post by joetrinsey on Feb 20, 2019 12:47:23 GMT -5
I don't know if I've ever seen a high level coach who DIDN'T use punishments (or consequences, or whatever you want to call them) occasionally. I'd say it's less common for winning and losing a drill and more common to correct behavior.
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Post by coahc21 on Feb 25, 2019 11:46:04 GMT -5
Good point...athletes need to know when to go all out and when to throttle back Depending on where you are along in the season has a lot to do with this...midway through a season I am going to assume that my team has a "safe serve" in their back pocket and it is my job to educate them on when to do it...hoping that by the midway point of the season, in practices we can take a risk here During preseason we will sometimes have practices of all "B" serves to help save shoulders Very good points. We encourage safe serving when in drills that are designed to work on SR offense. So are there any real times that consequences or rewards are actually necessary? And I’m not talking about verbal reprimands or praise. Do kids need to “fear” a physical punishment, or can they simply fear disappointing their coach/teammates? Are punishments ONLY effective when kids don’t respect their coach? Punishments have their place....I like to place punishment for lack of focus, poor technique, laziness, etc... but not for winning or losing a drill
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Post by coahc21 on Feb 26, 2019 10:45:01 GMT -5
Punishments have their place....I like to place punishment for lack of focus, poor technique, laziness, etc... but not for winning or losing a drill I believe in the Wooden school of coaching where physical punishments really don't have a place, and punishments of any kind are rare. A coach is a teacher, and in other subjects you don't have physical punishments for poor technique and lack of focus. It isn't very effective short or long term. A team with a culture of competitiveness and hard work has no need for it. The reward is winning drills and playing in matches. A group of researchers charted about 30 hours of Wooden practices. Here were the results: 50% of coaching was instruction, teaching about the skills of basketball . If you add in the time he spent demonstrating or modeling it was 75% of his coaching. He seldom used praise (<7%) He didn’t throw it around all the time, it had to be well deserved and the athletes knew how he felt through other actions No punishment (NONE!) Practice always ended with affection His teams were disciplined, skilled and extremely competitive. Good points
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yfa
Junior High
Posts: 3
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Post by yfa on Feb 26, 2019 17:11:48 GMT -5
I personally like accountability type punishments. If something is completely within a team’s/player’s control and it’s executed poorly I like to stat it, point it out after a drill ends, and have a consequence for “it” being done poorly. Usually this is process based rather than results driven. I like that players have complete control over the amount they run without that amount ever being ridiculous or demeaning to their efforts. Running a few touches to recall a play or two they could have improved upon hasn’t seemed to be a bad deal.
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Post by v0lleym0m on Feb 25, 2020 22:13:23 GMT -5
Bumping this as volleykid came home volleyupset. This weekend girls played terrible on one of the days. Several girls went off to party and came to tournament hungover, nauseated, sick. All considerably underage. Coach said they all should do conditioning and devoted practice to what is equated with punishment. I don't disagree with that because I know coaching was so upset with team, rightfully so. No one ratted the kids out despite everyone knowing what's up.
Is this the way it should be dealt with or should the girls in question spoken up? All of which are starters.
I guess coach doesn't know what was up with the kids or this was an attempt to get them to fess up. Which they obviously failed.
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Post by boh on Feb 26, 2020 11:13:41 GMT -5
Bumping this as volleykid came home volleyupset. This weekend girls played terrible on one of the days. Several girls went off to party and came to tournament hungover, nauseated, sick. All considerably underage. Coach said they all should do conditioning and devoted practice to what is equated with punishment. I don't disagree with that because I know coaching was so upset with team, rightfully so. No one ratted the kids out despite everyone knowing what's up. Is this the way it should be dealt with or should the girls in question spoken up? All of which are starters. I guess coach doesn't know what was up with the kids or this was an attempt to get them to fess up. Which they obviously failed. As a coach I would like to know. Some coaches would handle the information poorly I suppose, but assuming the coach knows how to properly handle information that could get a player alienated for speaking up I would say players should talk to the coach. There is also a decent chance the coach knows whats going on, but isn't going to broadcast it to the entire team/parents. Maybe he/she has had private conversations with those kids already? That is what I would do anyway.
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Post by pepperbrooks on Feb 26, 2020 11:23:16 GMT -5
I like "punishments" that are annoying more than taxing, like ONE push-up for a mistake. It's not hard, but it's annoying enough to stick in their head and concentrate to avoid it.
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