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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2019 12:25:20 GMT -5
2 years ago, when Kingdon made her debut in WGP (ex-VNL), she was stunning during the first few weeks. Then other teams figured out her and her efficiency dropped a lot. I'm happy with what I saw from Foecke/Rettke/Washington/Thompson, but better to wait a bit. Washington's front slide and Thompson's hitting angles are haven't been scouted before by Japan. Ps, Foecke should try tooling the block more. Her wrist-shots doesn't work at international level. And I think setting flows better with Poulter, even it's too early to judge setting. What Karch wants requires a lot of time to stabilize. (Hancock run this offence last year as well, and spend a lot of time with Drews/Wilhite/Kingdon, but not with others) I think what encouraged me most about Thompson in particular is that she performed well and showed a ton of promise against someone who isn't playing in the AAC. I don't know what level of competition she gets playing for Cincy, but I am guessing it isn't terribly onerous. I feel like I am still taking a pretty level-headed view of the youth movement for this phase of the VNL. I am not calling for any of these women, at this point, to make the Tokyo team. But, it is exciting to see some of them start to grow into a role that could lead to future spots on the A team. I think that the ones who have either just finished school (Foecke) or who are still in school (Rettke & Thompson) intrigue me most, due to their not having had any pro-level experience to develop their games. Rettke especially, as I don't think she's even been playing the sport that long, and is only a sophomore. The talent is there to see. Now, let's get them to reach it.
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Post by stanfordvb on May 23, 2019 21:20:45 GMT -5
I'm also interested in our libero situation. If KRob is moving back to OH, does this essentially mean Courtney is our starting Tokyo libero? And will KRob definitely come along, in case we need a libero/DS substitute? That's all fine and dandy, I just wonder what the rationale was behind essentially erasing an NT season of libero experience for KRob (which was a disservice to her if she's moving back to OH), and choosing Courtney instead, who will only have 2 tournaments of experience as our starting libero going into 2020. The only for sure locks for Tokyo are Foluke, Kim, and Larson. I also think Krob is 95% lock and at this point I would say Courtney has above a 75% chance to go as she's the only lib that we have doing the job (although we haven't seen lake) We saw a glimpse of lake today, I wouldn’t put her up there with Courtney, I think right now I would take Courtney as the starter and put KRob as on OH who will takeover libero if Courtney were to get injured. The benefit of Courtney is her reach, she doesn’t have to work as hard as lake does to get good contact on the ball. Lake is tiny!! It prevents her from making controlled digs on some of those balls hit outside her body, but we haven’t seen her in the jersey yet so I’m not saying it won’t happen.
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Post by vbsam16 on May 23, 2019 21:33:25 GMT -5
The only for sure locks for Tokyo are Foluke, Kim, and Larson. I also think Krob is 95% lock and at this point I would say Courtney has above a 75% chance to go as she's the only lib that we have doing the job (although we haven't seen lake) We saw a glimpse of lake today, I wouldn’t put her up there with Courtney, I think right now I would take Courtney as the starter and put KRob as on OH who will takeover libero if Courtney were to get injured. The benefit of Courtney is her reach, she doesn’t have to work as hard as lake does to get good contact on the ball. Lake is tiny!! It prevents her from making controlled digs on some of those balls hit outside her body, but we haven’t seen her in the jersey yet so I’m not saying it won’t happen. You’re definitely right about Lake’s reach not being as great as Courtney’s, but she makes up for that with instinct and reading the hitter. Since she has always been a libero, she has that ability to read the hitter and already be those few inches closer to where the ball is going to be. There are so many stellar liberos that are way better and shorter than Courtney.
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Post by stanfordvb on May 23, 2019 23:47:14 GMT -5
We saw a glimpse of lake today, I wouldn’t put her up there with Courtney, I think right now I would take Courtney as the starter and put KRob as on OH who will takeover libero if Courtney were to get injured. The benefit of Courtney is her reach, she doesn’t have to work as hard as lake does to get good contact on the ball. Lake is tiny!! It prevents her from making controlled digs on some of those balls hit outside her body, but we haven’t seen her in the jersey yet so I’m not saying it won’t happen. You’re definitely right about Lake’s reach not being as great as Courtney’s, but she makes up for that with instinct and reading the hitter. Since she has always been a libero, she has that ability to read the hitter and already be those few inches closer to where the ball is going to be. There are so many stellar liberos that are way better and shorter than Courtney. Your right there are, but just imo, I don’t think lake has the ability to be like those libs. Courtney has shown in these first three matches that she is one of the best in vnls if she keeps up this play. She is never tested in serve receive by the other teams, and when they do the pass is nailed. I think Courtney has made huge strides from the last time we saw her play lib. I think lake would make a more convincing case if she was clearly the best libero in the NCAA, but that is a very debatable statement, I just don’t see lake getting the starting spot over Courtney from what I’ve seen from both of them. If lake turns out to be better I’d love to be wrong and have the best possible libero we can !!
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Post by Hawk Attack on May 23, 2019 23:53:03 GMT -5
I think lake would make a more convincing case if she was clearly the best libero in the NCAA Exactly, just like Megan Courtney was.
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Post by stanfordvb on May 24, 2019 0:11:56 GMT -5
I think lake would make a more convincing case if she was clearly the best libero in the NCAA Exactly, just like Megan Courtney was. Courtney has years of pro experience and would be the best ncaa libero if she were to be playing right now. I’m referring to right now the skill level not how good Courtney was in 3 years ago. What I’m saying that if lake isn’t predominantly considered the best ncaa libero, how could she be the best for usa. Nothing to do with Courtney’s past play because Courtney would be the best ncaa libero right now, you read my post as if I was saying if you weren’t the best in college than you’ll never start. Not what I said. If your are currently not the best in college at ur position, starting for the nt is very tough bet.
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Post by vbsam16 on May 24, 2019 0:46:25 GMT -5
You’re definitely right about Lake’s reach not being as great as Courtney’s, but she makes up for that with instinct and reading the hitter. Since she has always been a libero, she has that ability to read the hitter and already be those few inches closer to where the ball is going to be. There are so many stellar liberos that are way better and shorter than Courtney. Your right there are, but just imo, I don’t think lake has the ability to be like those libs. Courtney has shown in these first three matches that she is one of the best in vnls if she keeps up this play. She is never tested in serve receive by the other teams, and when they do the pass is nailed. I think Courtney has made huge strides from the last time we saw her play lib. I think lake would make a more convincing case if she was clearly the best libero in the NCAA, but that is a very debatable statement, I just don’t see lake getting the starting spot over Courtney from what I’ve seen from both of them. If lake turns out to be better I’d love to be wrong and have the best possible libero we can !! I definitely agree that Courtney is better than Lake. She’s been stellar. I wish Karch had played Lake as libero for a set today just to see how she does, but alas, I feel like her chances are gone. Maybe she’ll get a shot next week who knows.
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Post by donut on May 24, 2019 7:31:55 GMT -5
Exactly, just like Megan Courtney was. Courtney has years of pro experience and would be the best ncaa libero if she were to be playing right now. I’m referring to right now the skill level not how good Courtney was in 3 years ago. What I’m saying that if lake isn’t predominantly considered the best ncaa libero, how could she be the best for usa. Nothing to do with Courtney’s past play because Courtney would be the best ncaa libero right now, you read my post as if I was saying if you weren’t the best in college than you’ll never start. Not what I said. If your are currently not the best in college at ur position, starting for the nt is very tough bet. "Predominantly considered the best?" How do you measure who is "considered the best?" And your argument is instantly defeated when you look at the rest of the NT starters. Larson and Hill were not "predominantly considered the best" OHs in college. Adams, Dixon and Gibby were not "predominantly considered the best." Murphy and Drews definitely weren't. Hell, Banwarth, our last starting NT libero, wasn't even considered the best in college. You're minimizing the difference between the NCAA game and the international FIVB game, and how some players will excel at one and not the other.
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Post by pittsburgh7717 on May 24, 2019 9:01:02 GMT -5
Courtney has years of pro experience and would be the best ncaa libero if she were to be playing right now. I’m referring to right now the skill level not how good Courtney was in 3 years ago. What I’m saying that if lake isn’t predominantly considered the best ncaa libero, how could she be the best for usa. Nothing to do with Courtney’s past play because Courtney would be the best ncaa libero right now, you read my post as if I was saying if you weren’t the best in college than you’ll never start. Not what I said. If your are currently not the best in college at ur position, starting for the nt is very tough bet. "Predominantly considered the best?" How do you measure who is "considered the best?" And your argument is instantly defeated when you look at the rest of the NT starters. Larson and Hill were not "predominantly considered the best" OHs in college. Adams, Dixon and Gibby were not "predominantly considered the best." Murphy and Drews definitely weren't. Hell, Banwarth, our last starting NT libero, wasn't even considered the best in college. You're minimizing the difference between the NCAA game and the international FIVB game, and how some players will excel at one and not the other. It was a ridiculous statement from the beginning. "Mary Lake can't be a stellar international libero who is shorter than Courtney because she's not considered the best NCAA libero". Like bruh, what??? Next to Morgan Hentz (who I assume wants to pursue other options) you have Lake & White who are essentially equal in my eyes. She will be fine if she follows along the path she is on.
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2019 8:03:30 GMT -5
Courtney has years of pro experience and would be the best ncaa libero if she were to be playing right now. I’m referring to right now the skill level not how good Courtney was in 3 years ago. What I’m saying that if lake isn’t predominantly considered the best ncaa libero, how could she be the best for usa. Nothing to do with Courtney’s past play because Courtney would be the best ncaa libero right now, you read my post as if I was saying if you weren’t the best in college than you’ll never start. Not what I said. If your are currently not the best in college at ur position, starting for the nt is very tough bet. "Predominantly considered the best?" How do you measure who is "considered the best?" And your argument is instantly defeated when you look at the rest of the NT starters. Larson and Hill were not "predominantly considered the best" OHs in college. Adams, Dixon and Gibby were not "predominantly considered the best." Murphy and Drews definitely weren't. Hell, Banwarth, our last starting NT libero, wasn't even considered the best in college. You're minimizing the difference between the NCAA game and the international FIVB game, and how some players will excel at one and not the other. ? Larson was a two-time First-Teamer and a national champion. Adams was a two-time First-Teamer, and played in three final fours and a national championship match (I think). Dixon and Gibbemeyer were also each First-Team All-Americans. Murphy was the NFOY and a four-time All-American. Drews was a Second-Team All-American. If they weren't considered the "best" at their positions in college, what is your definition of "best?"
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Post by fanbase on May 25, 2019 8:35:47 GMT -5
Does anyone think SSS has a shot at setting the national team? Wouldn’t she be the perfect fit if Karch is trying to run super fast offense? I know she’s not the most physical but she makes up for it with her location and speed.
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Post by donut on May 25, 2019 10:41:29 GMT -5
"Predominantly considered the best?" How do you measure who is "considered the best?" And your argument is instantly defeated when you look at the rest of the NT starters. Larson and Hill were not "predominantly considered the best" OHs in college. Adams, Dixon and Gibby were not "predominantly considered the best." Murphy and Drews definitely weren't. Hell, Banwarth, our last starting NT libero, wasn't even considered the best in college. You're minimizing the difference between the NCAA game and the international FIVB game, and how some players will excel at one and not the other. ? Larson was a two-time First-Teamer and a national champion. Adams was a two-time First-Teamer, and played in three final fours and a national championship match (I think). Dixon and Gibbemeyer were also each First-Team All-Americans. Murphy was the NFOY and a four-time All-American. Drews was a Second-Team All-American. If they weren't considered the "best" at their positions in college, what is your definition of "best?" Did you even read the OP before cherry-picking an argument with me? Gavin claimed that Lake would struggle on the NT because in college, she isn't currently "predominantly considered the best" ( the best implies singular, btw). I'm assuming he thinks Hentz is "predominantly considered the best" at her position. None of the current NT starters, IMO, were considered "predominantly the best" at their position during their NCAA days, except for Akinradewo. I never negated their talents or that they were great players, but in 2008, I don't think Larson was considered the best OH in the country (that was probably Hodge). In 2015 (Drews senior year), you had Aiyana Whitney, Nikki Taylor, Kelsie Payne, Kadie Rolfzen as "better" RS hitters. Do I need to go on? The fact that these players are starting defeats his argument. That was my point.
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Post by holidayhusker on May 25, 2019 10:47:43 GMT -5
? Larson was a two-time First-Teamer and a national champion. Adams was a two-time First-Teamer, and played in three final fours and a national championship match (I think). Dixon and Gibbemeyer were also each First-Team All-Americans. Murphy was the NFOY and a four-time All-American. Drews was a Second-Team All-American. If they weren't considered the "best" at their positions in college, what is your definition of "best?" Did you even read the OP before cherry-picking an argument with me? Gavin claimed that Lake would struggle on the NT because in college, she isn't currently "predominantly considered the best" ( the best implies singular, btw). I'm assuming he thinks Hentz is "predominantly considered the best" at her position. None of the current NT starters, IMO, were considered "predominantly the best" at their position during their NCAA days, except for Akinradewo. I never negated their talents or that they were great players, but in 2008, I don't think Larson was considered the best OH in the country (that was probably Hodge). In 2015 (Drews senior year), you had Aiyana Whitney, Nikki Taylor, Kelsie Payne, Kadie Rolfzen as "better" RS hitters. Do I need to go on? The fact that these players are starting defeats his argument. That was my point. Larson was by far the most complete player of her class. If you are simply basing this on who can terminate then? Larson made as many points on her serve and pass as she did hitting.
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Post by ironhammer on May 25, 2019 10:47:50 GMT -5
? Larson was a two-time First-Teamer and a national champion. Adams was a two-time First-Teamer, and played in three final fours and a national championship match (I think). Dixon and Gibbemeyer were also each First-Team All-Americans. Murphy was the NFOY and a four-time All-American. Drews was a Second-Team All-American. If they weren't considered the "best" at their positions in college, what is your definition of "best?" Did you even read the OP before cherry-picking an argument with me? Gavin claimed that Lake would struggle on the NT because in college, she isn't currently "predominantly considered the best" ( the best implies singular, btw). I'm assuming he thinks Hentz is "predominantly considered the best" at her position. None of the current NT starters, IMO, were considered "predominantly the best" at their position during their NCAA days, except for Akinradewo. I never negated their talents or that they were great players, but in 2008, I don't think Larson was considered the best OH in the country (that was probably Hodge). In 2015 (Drews senior year), you had Aiyana Whitney, Nikki Taylor, Kelsie Payne, Kadie Rolfzen as "better" RS hitters. Do I need to go on? The fact that these players are starting defeats his argument. That was my point. Well, what's this? The junior disagreeing with his senior? Stop the presses.
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Post by eazy on May 25, 2019 10:57:53 GMT -5
? Larson was a two-time First-Teamer and a national champion. Adams was a two-time First-Teamer, and played in three final fours and a national championship match (I think). Dixon and Gibbemeyer were also each First-Team All-Americans. Murphy was the NFOY and a four-time All-American. Drews was a Second-Team All-American. If they weren't considered the "best" at their positions in college, what is your definition of "best?" Did you even read the OP before cherry-picking an argument with me? Gavin claimed that Lake would struggle on the NT because in college, she isn't currently "predominantly considered the best" ( the best implies singular, btw). I'm assuming he thinks Hentz is "predominantly considered the best" at her position. None of the current NT starters, IMO, were considered "predominantly the best" at their position during their NCAA days, except for Akinradewo. I never negated their talents or that they were great players, but in 2008, I don't think Larson was considered the best OH in the country (that was probably Hodge). In 2015 (Drews senior year), you had Aiyana Whitney, Nikki Taylor, Kelsie Payne, Kadie Rolfzen as "better" RS hitters. Do I need to go on? The fact that these players are starting defeats his argument. That was my point. Did you not read the post that you quoted two posts ago? He never said that they had to be the best in college to end up on the NT. He did say that is would be hard to make the NT when you are CURRENTLY in college and not the best in college. Your whole "the best" argument is also apples to oranges when talking about liberos vs pin hitters. A roster needs 3-5 solid pin hitters. A roster needs 1 libero, and either a back-up or a pin that can fill in as a back up. Looking at who will play for the actual NT you have KRob who can play libero if you don't have anyone better, or who can be your backup. So you're looking for 1 libero to fill that spot. If you are going with experience and current ability, you take Courtney (as you yourself predicted in a post). He is saying that IF you decide to value youth and future potential, you would need someone that is far above and beyond everyone else in those categories and yet Hentz is considered better by a large number of people. FWIW, Hentz and White were both 1st team AA last year and Lake was 2nd team. Why go with the 3rd best collegiate libero for the one NT spot?
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