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Post by bunnywailer on Jan 18, 2007 16:15:15 GMT -5
Also a myth. This excerpt is from the article I quote earlier in this thread: I don't think he was talking about total numbers, but of quality of student or athlete. Give me a 6'4" girl who's played the game for only two years but has "potential" and I'm sure there's a program willing to offer a full-ride scholarship. Find a slacker who just started to concentrate on education and see if a non need-based full scholarship materializes. I misunderstood what he was saying. In that sense, there is some truth - raw physical talent/potential can be a great equalizer in sports. |
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Post by chancelucky on Jan 18, 2007 16:30:22 GMT -5
Just to confirm, BC is right. I was simply saying you have to be a very very good student to get a full academic scholarship. You can be a surprisingly unskilled volleyball player ....
the number analysis is very tricky because realistically you have to be playing volleyball either at the high school or club level to be considered for a volleyball scholarship (not always the case). The odds are surprisingly good, if you have some level of physical ability and are willing to stick with club. If you're over 6' tall, it becomes really really easy. You almost have to actively be bad.
It's not quite as true as it was a few years ago, but if a young woman can jump and touch the rim, I can almost guarantee that someone would offer her a scholarship.
All of this feeds into the odd state of the game. Middle to upper income families are buying their children college opportunities or at least trying to. They can't do that in track say.
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Post by cyberVBmidwest on Jan 18, 2007 21:21:02 GMT -5
As a matter of fact, I will be coaching a USYVL team in the spring season in our town when that starts up again in about 2 months. Thanks for the reply. It is great that you have tried and plan on continuing to try. I find coaching youth volleyball is both rewarding and frustrating but gives you insight into what most youths (and most parents) expect from their participation. You include a great deal of passion in your replies so it is hard to determine where you are coming from. Many times your replies sound like someone who has been burned or burned out in your efforts with youth volleyball. I am glad to hear this is not the case. It must just be your personality that comes out in your writing. Keep up the good work in the youth area. Regarding diversity in volleyball. I am not a diversity expert but I do have lot of years of experience in observation of various trends. There are many things that impact what attracts youths of various racial backgrounds to various sports. Elite youth volleyball can be very expensive and that can be a barrier to low-income families. The club I work with also has a great variety of income and racial make-up. Those issues all melt away on the volleyball court. I do not think that MONEY is the main driver for the lack of diversity in volleyball and here is why. When I watch volleyball in the high schools, I see almost the same racial percentages that I see in club volleyball. It doesn't cost much if anything to play volleyball in high school. If cost isn't a barrier, then it would seem that there would be more diversity in these high school teams. One could argue that some "non-white" races cannot afford the club experience and therefore do not make the team because they do not have the same playing experience. If this were true, then "non-white" players would face the same challenge in other sports like football, basketball, etc... However, those sports seem to have a lot more diverse makeup. The club systems for football and basketball are also highly developed and expensive but the racial make-up of the high schools teams are less "white" than volleyball. I am sure there are several reasons for this but that isn't the point of this response. |
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Post by bunnywailer on Jan 18, 2007 21:33:29 GMT -5
I do not think that MONEY is the main driver for the lack of diversity in volleyball and here is why. When I watch volleyball in the high schools, I see almost the same racial percentages that I see in club volleyball. It doesn't cost much if anything to play volleyball in high school. If cost isn't a barrier, then it would seem that there would be more diversity in these high school teams. One could argue that some "non-white" races cannot afford the club experience and therefore do not make the team because they do not have the same playing experience. If this were true, then "non-white" players would face the same challenge in other sports like football, basketball, etc... However, those sports seem to have a lot more diverse makeup. The club systems for football and basketball are also highly developed and expensive but the racial make-up of the high schools teams are less "white" than volleyball. I am sure there are several reasons for this but that isn't the point of this response. I will have to disagree. Money is the major issue which prevents equal access and equal opportunities in volleyball for all athletes regardless of social, economic, or racial background. Volleyball does not have a pool of interest that is big enough to provide qualified coaches to teach the sport in the youth/junior arena - volleyball coaching knowledge is less prevalent than basketball coaching knowledge or football coaching knowledge. As such, those who broker such knowledge are firmly rooted in the JO club ball system, even more so than in high school volleyball. So, given what I've said previous regarding the prohibitive costs of club volleyball and the extensive travel to major tournaments, and the fact that a majority of the knowledge pool resides in the JO clubs nationwide (with no other major outlet - high school volleyball coaching talent varies widely and is geographically and socio-economically stratified), this is where the lack of opportunity and the non-diversity in youth/junior volleyball comes from. Compounding the problem is the fact that the major JO tournaments are the primary methods that feed the recruiting pipeline of junior players to the next level (college). This phenomenon (using elite travel ball tournaments as the collection point for college coaches to scout) is much more prevalent in girls' sports such as volleyball and softball, than it is in boys' sports such as football or basketball. Other than the AAU organziation, boys' club basketball is limited to a very select few elite teams (think Lebron James when he played in AAU tourneys and went straight to the NBA out of high school) and invitational tournaments. There is no structure like the USAV JO program in these boys' sports. There is absolutely no travel club football, there is community-based football like Pop Warner, but these are for younger athletes (younger than high school age and usually with age/weight limits). Other than all-star games with neighboring communities, there is no travel football per se. |
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Post by cyberVBmidwest on Jan 18, 2007 23:20:37 GMT -5
I will have to disagree. Money is the major issue which prevents equal access and equal opportunities in volleyball for all athletes regardless of social, economic, or racial background. We can agree to disagree.  I still think environment and exposure play a bigger part than the money. AAU basketball is huge and diverse here in Chicago. The winning local little league football clubs compete for state and national championships (if they qualify) where I live. The same with soccer, baseball, softball, golf, etc... I'm done with this discussion. Good luck in your upcoming season. Catch you in a future debate.  |
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Post by bunnywailer on Jan 18, 2007 23:49:06 GMT -5
JO Club volleyball cannot be compared with Little League baseball, Pop Warner football, or AAU basketball. The structure and philosophy of these programs are different than what JO volleyball has evolved into. The USYVL is a closer match to these other sports than club volleyball is.
JO volleyball is focused on mandatory tournaments within an RVA (USAV Region) in which teams in each division are ranked by performance. Teams then qualify based on RVA standings to move on to Nationals. There are also speciality tournaments like the Volleyball Festival or the Las Vegas tournament here on the west coast. There are no provisions within the JO structure for local leagues or clubs/teams to be formed around local competition. Competition is structured around travelling to these mandatory tournaments. Also, although age divisions are provided all the way down to 12-under, the majority of the participation occurs in the age groups which parallel high school aged or teenage athletes.
All of the other sports are centered around forming local leagues in which teams are formed and compete against other teams within their own town or community. Only a small percentage of participating teams will move on to travelling ball, and then these are usually only comprised of all-stars, or the best athletes in the community's chapter or league. There are national championships in Pop Warner football and the Little League World Series, but the emphasis in these programs is at the local level. Also, with these programs, the emphasis is on the younger athletes (younger than high school age) and on athlete development.
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Post by Chance on Jan 19, 2007 2:04:44 GMT -5
One could argue that some "non-white" races cannot afford the club experience and therefore do not make the team because they do not have the same playing experience. If this were true, then "non-white" players would face the same challenge in other sports like football, basketball, etc... However, those sports seem to have a lot more diverse makeup. The club systems for football and basketball are also highly developed and expensive but the racial make-up of the high schools teams are less "white" than volleyball. I am sure there are several reasons for this but that isn't the point of this response. I disagree with this point. Basketball is a very accessible "pick up" sport, and you can easily get the neccessary skills to make a high school team just by buying a 15 dollar ball and then going to your local court. As for football, the vast majority of players i know have only ever played school ball. |
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I still think environment and exposure play a bigger part than the money.
