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Post by crawdaddy on Jul 20, 2016 17:37:30 GMT -5
I can't blame Kerri for skipping Manhattan. Everything she's been doing the last several years, all of the surgeries and rehab, playing with one arm, etc. have been about having one more run at Rio, and no doubt capitalizing on the publicity (and $$$) coming her way. She needs her shoulder to hold up for one more tournament and then she can ride off into the sunset. Why take a chance it doesn't? Yes, it's not that many matches, but you still have to play all out and I doubt Kerri takes many full swings, if any, in practice right now. This is a fair point and in retrospect Kerri missing is reasonable - I still think she should have shown up and at least done an appearance. April should have played though Finally, since we were critical on this board about the early Sun-run AVP, we should give props when it's due. I think he's done a terrific job with the tour this year - some great venues, good presentation on NBC, and a generally higher level of excitement. I dont think Sun has done great this year, no new tournaments is an issue, but definitely much better than last. A lot of improvements I wonder if they tried to get Kerri to show up for the Todd retirement ceremony. That would of been nice. And/or they could have had her in the booth for a short interview during the NBC broadcast. Seems like that would have been in everyone's interest.
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Post by chicory on Jul 20, 2016 21:20:43 GMT -5
Claes/Hughes can't even keep the AVP money why is that even being mentioned.
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Post by c4ndlelight on Jul 20, 2016 22:10:45 GMT -5
I don't get comparing AVP versus FIVB salaries. Maybe you can gross more from the AVP, but that's probably also why it went bankrupt the first time (and isn't making money this time).
Seems like the lower FIVB winnings are perhaps a bit more sustainable, and probably will help them towards Olympic gold (which, let's be honest, is where the real money will be).
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Post by guest2 on Jul 21, 2016 1:16:23 GMT -5
I don't get comparing AVP versus FIVB salaries. Maybe you can gross more from the AVP, but that's probably also why it went bankrupt the first time (and isn't making money this time). Seems like the lower FIVB winnings are perhaps a bit more sustainable, and probably will help them towards Olympic gold (which, let's be honest, is where the real money will be). The point isnt necessarily to compare them its to show how much the US players need the AVP.
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jul 21, 2016 8:46:09 GMT -5
I don't get comparing AVP versus FIVB salaries. Maybe you can gross more from the AVP, but that's probably also why it went bankrupt the first time (and isn't making money this time). Seems like the lower FIVB winnings are perhaps a bit more sustainable, and probably will help them towards Olympic gold (which, let's be honest, is where the real money will be). The point isnt necessarily to compare them its to show how much the US players need the AVP. I don't think the top 4 teams NEED the AVP. They could survive playing FIVB only. Also, here is the FIVB's stance toward same weekend tournaments: – National Tour In case of a clash with an FIVB World Tour event /FIVB Senior World Championships, top 64 ranked athletes in the individual FIVB Entry Ranking of each gender (upon Tentative NF Entry List), except the hosting country teams, cannot take part in such a National Tour leg unless authorized by the FIVB through a dedicated form. For further regulations, please see the link: www.fivb.org/EN/BeachVolleyball/NationalTour.asp.
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Post by crawdaddy on Jul 21, 2016 9:23:07 GMT -5
The point isnt necessarily to compare them its to show how much the US players need the AVP. I don't think the top 4 teams NEED the AVP. They could survive playing FIVB only. quote] The AVP is pretty important part of the equation. Casey Patterson has made 62K in 11 FIVB events and 33K in 5 AVP events. Summer Ross has made 15K in 11 FIVBs and 27K in 5 AVPs. Huge drop in salary if those AVPs go away. Plus, as mentioned before, AVP offers exposure to the U.S. market that just doesn't exist via FIVB events and that exposure is key for sponsorships.
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Post by downtheline on Jul 21, 2016 9:34:03 GMT -5
This has to be one of the worst paying professional sport in the world...
Top video game players are making more money to just appear at events.
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jul 21, 2016 9:46:49 GMT -5
The AVP is pretty important part of the equation. Casey Patterson has made 62K in 11 FIVB events and 33K in 5 AVP events. Summer Ross has made 15K in 11 FIVBs and 27K in 5 AVPs. Huge drop in salary if those AVPs go away. Plus, as mentioned before, AVP offers exposure to the U.S. market that just doesn't exist via FIVB events and that exposure is key for sponsorships. Well, last year Casey made $93K on the FIVB in 10 events. They haven't earn more because they don't have any podium finishes. Phil's played in 10 FIVBs and made 90k. And their international sponsorship are probably bigger than any sole US sponsor. Red Bull, Smart Car, Oakley, Under Armor, sponsors like those aren't pay quality $$ for 7 US events.[/quote]
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Post by guest2 on Jul 21, 2016 9:51:11 GMT -5
The point isnt necessarily to compare them its to show how much the US players need the AVP. I don't think the top 4 teams NEED the AVP. They could survive playing FIVB only. Also, here is the FIVB's stance toward same weekend tournaments: – National Tour In case of a clash with an FIVB World Tour event /FIVB Senior World Championships, top 64 ranked athletes in the individual FIVB Entry Ranking of each gender (upon Tentative NF Entry List), except the hosting country teams, cannot take part in such a National Tour leg unless authorized by the FIVB through a dedicated form. For further regulations, please see the link: www.fivb.org/EN/BeachVolleyball/NationalTour.asp. Has that been enforced against players? Didnt the Brazilians miss a bunch earlier this year to play domestically?
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jul 21, 2016 9:52:25 GMT -5
I don't think the top 4 teams NEED the AVP. They could survive playing FIVB only. Also, here is the FIVB's stance toward same weekend tournaments: – National Tour In case of a clash with an FIVB World Tour event /FIVB Senior World Championships, top 64 ranked athletes in the individual FIVB Entry Ranking of each gender (upon Tentative NF Entry List), except the hosting country teams, cannot take part in such a National Tour leg unless authorized by the FIVB through a dedicated form. For further regulations, please see the link: www.fivb.org/EN/BeachVolleyball/NationalTour.asp. Has that been enforced against players? Didnt the Brazilians miss a bunch earlier this year to play domestically? Good question.
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Post by guest2 on Jul 21, 2016 9:54:50 GMT -5
The AVP is pretty important part of the equation. Casey Patterson has made 62K in 11 FIVB events and 33K in 5 AVP events. Summer Ross has made 15K in 11 FIVBs and 27K in 5 AVPs. Huge drop in salary if those AVPs go away. Plus, as mentioned before, AVP offers exposure to the U.S. market that just doesn't exist via FIVB events and that exposure is key for sponsorships. Well, last year Casey made $93K on the FIVB in 10 events. They haven't earn more because they don't have any podium finishes. Phil's played in 10 FIVBs and made 90k. And their international sponsorship are probably bigger than any sole US sponsor. Red Bull, Smart Car, Oakley, Under Armor, sponsors like those aren't pay quality $$ for 7 US events. [/quote] Jake Gibb has been one of the top players in the world for ten years. He made more than 100k one time, and he was ranked first in the world that year. He has made over 70k twice.
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Post by guest2 on Jul 21, 2016 10:01:11 GMT -5
One thing I find very interesting is if you take what Jake/Casey will make on the AVP this year, and add in what the top ranked team on the NVL made last year (which I adjusted slightly because Raquel didnt play every event) its just about equal to what Jake has made in most of his FIVB years.
There is literally a quality, lucrative, domestic tour sitting there, it just needs a merger, and some work from all parties (meaning tours and players)
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jul 21, 2016 10:07:00 GMT -5
Well, last year Casey made $93K on the FIVB in 10 events. They haven't earn more because they don't have any podium finishes. Phil's played in 10 FIVBs and made 90k. And their international sponsorship are probably bigger than any sole US sponsor. Red Bull, Smart Car, Oakley, Under Armor, sponsors like those aren't pay quality $$ for 7 US events. Jake Gibb has been one of the top players in the world for ten years. He made more than 100k one time, and he was ranked first in the world that year. He has made over 70k twice.[/quote] *68,62,67, plus where ever they end up this year (should break $70k) They haven't earned less than $60k on FIVB since 2011. Also, because they play FIVBs, their training, travel, expenses are picked up by USAV, exposed to sponsors, getting on network TV, all because they qualified for Olympics through the FIVB. If they are only doing AVP, that ain't happening.
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Post by guest2 on Jul 21, 2016 10:10:54 GMT -5
Jake Gibb has been one of the top players in the world for ten years. He made more than 100k one time, and he was ranked first in the world that year. He has made over 70k twice. *68,62,67, plus where ever they end up this year (should break $70k) They haven't earned less than $60k on FIVB since 2011. Also, because they play FIVBs, their training, travel, expenses are picked up by USAV, exposed to sponsors, getting on network TV, all because they qualified for Olympics through the FIVB. If they are only doing AVP, that ain't happening.[/quote] __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Quote function not working so I drew a line where my reply started I agree they need both for now, and sponsorship money may drive decisions. There is never going to be a scenario where top teams dont skip a few domestic to play FIVB, but if its financially feasible, they will play domestically much more often. As history bears out. I wonder though whether sponsors pay more for a team like Jake Casey to play on the AVP, where they are always in the semis, could do clinics, appearances etc. or the FIVB, where they are in the semis 20-30% of the time (maybe a little more) and that other stuff is probably not as available/ This would be great to hear from someone who knows more about sponsors and what they pay
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Post by love2vball on Jul 21, 2016 11:34:03 GMT -5
"There is never going to be a scenario where top teams dont skip a few domestic to play FIVB, but if its financially feasible, they will play domestically much more often. As history bears out."
I certainly dont claim to be an aficionado on the format or qualifying system of the FIVB, but I seem to remember that it doesnt begin in earnest until the last two years prior to the next olympics. If that is at all correct, would next year not appear optimum for Donald Sun and the AVP to give it their best shot? If the Rio games go well for the USA, they can possibly capitalize on the aftermath of the excitment if they promote it right. And they have the time to watch, see and adjust their battle plan in the case it doesnt. Kerri, Phil, Jake, Hyden and others may not have another Olympic run in them, but more than likely would still play stateside especially if the money, by way of more tournaments, was there for them. I would think that if ever there was a time to consider an increase in the amount of tournaments, that 2017 would be the year to invest in it. Curious as to the comments....
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