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Post by guest2 on Jun 30, 2020 3:41:24 GMT -5
Andy Benesh vs Troy Field. Is Field still clearly above him? Benesh is younger, and may have a higher FIVB ceiling. Of course Field is clearly above him. He made multiple semis last year. It may be time to pull the brakes on the Benesh hype train a little. He had one excellent result - a 7th - but that obscured what was otherwise a dismal season. He lost in 6 of 7 qualifiers. To rephrase over 80% of times he was in the qualifier he failed to qualify. In two of those qualifiers he didnt win a match. In two more he lost to the first credible team he played. His record in qualifier matches was 8-6. In contrast his 2018 qualifier record was 10-2 and Stephen Roschitz was 8-3. Qualifiers are tough and super high pressure but before we annoint a guy I think its fair to ask him to win 75% of his Q matches and get in at least half the time
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jun 30, 2020 5:57:04 GMT -5
Andy Benesh vs Troy Field. Is Field still clearly above him? Benesh is younger, and may have a higher FIVB ceiling. Of course Field is clearly above him. He made multiple semis last year. It may be time to pull the brakes on the Benesh hype train a little. He had one excellent result - a 7th - but that obscured what was otherwise a dismal season. He lost in 6 of 7 qualifiers. To rephrase over 80% of times he was in the qualifier he failed to qualify. In two of those qualifiers he didnt win a match. In two more he lost to the first credible team he played. His record in qualifier matches was 8-6. In contrast his 2018 qualifier record was 10-2 and Stephen Roschitz was 8-3. Qualifiers are tough and super high pressure but before we annoint a guy I think its fair to ask him to win 75% of his Q matches and get in at least half the time Agreed. the only asterisk is Take Bombgren away from Field and then compare results. Troy's best is a 9th with Benesh-type partners. But ask me again in a Month.
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Post by guest2 on Jun 30, 2020 7:33:37 GMT -5
Of course Field is clearly above him. He made multiple semis last year. It may be time to pull the brakes on the Benesh hype train a little. He had one excellent result - a 7th - but that obscured what was otherwise a dismal season. He lost in 6 of 7 qualifiers. To rephrase over 80% of times he was in the qualifier he failed to qualify. In two of those qualifiers he didnt win a match. In two more he lost to the first credible team he played. His record in qualifier matches was 8-6. In contrast his 2018 qualifier record was 10-2 and Stephen Roschitz was 8-3. Qualifiers are tough and super high pressure but before we annoint a guy I think its fair to ask him to win 75% of his Q matches and get in at least half the time Agreed. the only asterisk is Take Bombgren away from Field and then compare results. Troy's best is a 9th with Benesh-type partners. But ask me again in a Month. Anyone have any idea how Kolinske/Partain happened? I would have thought with reshuffling if Billy's best option was Partain he would have just called Beranek, with whom he enjoyed some success. Realistically both of the young blockers got screwed this year. Field would have played some FIVB with an experienced partner and been in a good position to win an AVP. He still has a chance with Tim and Tim's usual drawbacks - lack of practice time etc - should be less influential this year due to everyone being in the same situation, but Casey offered a lot more for him. Benesh now has a fairly poor chance of making the MDs. Assuming your seeds are right they would play the McKs first, then Ryan/Ty, then Reid/Lee to get in. I wouldnt make them anything better than a slight favorite in any of those matches. They do manage to bypass the three strongest Q teams though so its not all bad. Benesh/Beranek in particular would have benefited from being able to play their way into the season, get a few FIVB teams gone events to build up points, etc. Now they would be extremely lucky to get into 2 MDs.
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Post by guest2 on Jun 30, 2020 7:35:57 GMT -5
Of course Field is clearly above him. He made multiple semis last year. It may be time to pull the brakes on the Benesh hype train a little. He had one excellent result - a 7th - but that obscured what was otherwise a dismal season. He lost in 6 of 7 qualifiers. To rephrase over 80% of times he was in the qualifier he failed to qualify. In two of those qualifiers he didnt win a match. In two more he lost to the first credible team he played. His record in qualifier matches was 8-6. In contrast his 2018 qualifier record was 10-2 and Stephen Roschitz was 8-3. Qualifiers are tough and super high pressure but before we annoint a guy I think its fair to ask him to win 75% of his Q matches and get in at least half the time Agreed. the only asterisk is Take Bombgren away from Field and then compare results. Troy's best is a 9th with Benesh-type partners. But ask me again in a Month. Also we have seeds, lets get some betting going!!!!
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jun 30, 2020 7:45:03 GMT -5
Agreed. the only asterisk is Take Bombgren away from Field and then compare results. Troy's best is a 9th with Benesh-type partners. But ask me again in a Month. Anyone have any idea how Kolinske/Partain happened? I would have thought with reshuffling if Billy's best option was Partain he would have just called Beranek, with whom he enjoyed some success. Realistically both of the young blockers got screwed this year. Field would have played some FIVB with an experienced partner and been in a good position to win an AVP. He still has a chance with Tim and Tim's usual drawbacks - lack of practice time etc - should be less influential this year due to everyone being in the same situation, but Casey offered a lot more for him. Benesh now has a fairly poor chance of making the MDs. Assuming your seeds are right they would play the McKs first, then Ryan/Ty, then Reid/Lee to get in. I wouldnt make them anything better than a slight favorite in any of those matches. They do manage to bypass the three strongest Q teams though so its not all bad. Benesh/Beranek in particular would have benefited from being able to play their way into the season, get a few FIVB teams gone events to build up points, etc. Now they would be extremely lucky to get into 2 MDs. Benesh/Beranek practice a lot with the McK's I believe, and they have been practicing. I saw last week, where Ryan did his 1st workout for months. I think they match up well with McKs and Reid/Lee. Even though Ryan may not be in shape, his block still has to affect Beranek. They have a fighting chance.
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Post by haze on Jun 30, 2020 8:28:55 GMT -5
I was thinking more in terms of how this season will play out. Benesh has his best partner yet, and Beranek has really come along. I also think Fields success gets overhyped because of Bomgren, who continues to get overlooked for his ability. Anyways, I was really looking forward to seeing them progress through the year, but they won't have any margin for error in these loaded fields.
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Post by antireebok on Jun 30, 2020 8:34:22 GMT -5
Is it possible these seedlings aren’t correct? Highly doubt they are dropping some of their finishes from just over a year ago since all of the early events were canceled.
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Post by haze on Jun 30, 2020 8:36:19 GMT -5
Is it possible these seedlings aren’t correct? Highly doubt they are dropping some of their finishes from just over a year ago since all of the early events were canceled. Considering the player movement we've seen matches up with these points, I'm thinking it is correct but we'll see.
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Post by tamz on Jun 30, 2020 8:38:17 GMT -5
Should be correct because that’s from the AVP America points page that’s linked from AVP.
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Post by guest2 on Jun 30, 2020 9:03:17 GMT -5
I was thinking more in terms of how this season will play out. Benesh has his best partner yet, and Beranek has really come along. I also think Fields success gets overhyped because of Bomgren, who continues to get overlooked for his ability. Anyways, I was really looking forward to seeing them progress through the year, but they won't have any margin for error in these loaded fields. Thats a fair point, Bomgren/Field aren't guaranteed to get in either and will have to go through both Slick/Allen and probably Ricardo/Miles. That bracket is much, much tougher than the other half. I would expect them to get in 1 of 3 in that scenario depending on Ricardo's conditioning but an 0-fer is a real possibility.
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Post by ebes1099 on Jun 30, 2020 9:06:02 GMT -5
Ok, this is what I'm seeing now: Team PLYR 1 PLYR 2 Team Pts 1 Nick Lucena /Phil Dalhausser 2438 \ 2438 \ 4876 2 Taylor Crabb /Jake Gibb 2319 \ 2319 \ 4638 3 Chase Budinger /Chaim Schalk 2201 \ 1842 \ 4043 4 Casey Patterson /Theo Brunner 2201 \ 1394 \ 3595 5 Jeremy Casebeer / John Hyden 1842 \ 1323 \ 2982 6 Trevor Crabb /Tri Bourne 2017 \ 1044 \ 3061 1 Ricardo Santos /Miles Evans 1464 \ 1395 \ 2859 2 Reid Priddy /David Lee 1787 \ 872 \ 2659 3 Ryan Doherty /Ty Loomis 1515 \ 1134 \ 2649 4 Billy Allen /Stafford Slick 1322 \ 1322 \ 2644 5 Troy Field /Tim Bomgren 1294 \ 1294 \ 2588 6 Maddison McKibbin /Riley McKibbin 1203 \ 1203 \ 2406 7 Roberto Rodriguez /Piotr Marciniak 1231 \ 1038 \ 2269 8 Ed Ratledge /Skylar Delsol 1302 \ 944 \ 2246 9 Avery Drost /Chase Frishman 1091 \ 1091 \ 2182 10 Miles Partain /Bill Kolinske 914 \ 1223 \ 2137 11 Eric Beranek /Andy Benesh 1238 \ 788 \ 2026 12 Sean Rosenthal /Paul Lotman 1140 \ 866 \ 2006 Lots of counterintuitive seeding here. This should really cause AVP to rethink how they award points. Jake/Taylor won 4 events and made 5 finals in 6 events - also had 1 3rd. Phil/Nick won 1, made 2 finals, and finished third or lower 4 times, with 2 5ths. No good system seeds Nick/Phil 1st on those result. Also Tim/Troy were in the semis regularly, Hyden made it once, yet Hyden has more points. Kolinske has almost the same points as Tim/Troy but played 3 events and went uno-dos in one. These inaccurate seeds are a much bigger problem than usual because that qualifier is absolutely deadly. Equivalent to an AVP thats held the same week as an FIVB. I count 7 recent AVP winners in the Q I was thinking the same thing, just from memory on the last year of tournaments you would think Jake/Taylor would definitely be the 1 seed. Troy and Tim have less points than a number of players that you would think they should be ahead of just thinking back on results. Even guys like Beranek, Kolinske, McKibbins are right there with Tim and Troy and I don't recall those guys winning too many MD matches last year.
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Post by JB Southpaw on Jun 30, 2020 9:24:10 GMT -5
Lots of counterintuitive seeding here. This should really cause AVP to rethink how they award points. Jake/Taylor won 4 events and made 5 finals in 6 events - also had 1 3rd. Phil/Nick won 1, made 2 finals, and finished third or lower 4 times, with 2 5ths. No good system seeds Nick/Phil 1st on those result. Also Tim/Troy were in the semis regularly, Hyden made it once, yet Hyden has more points. Kolinske has almost the same points as Tim/Troy but played 3 events and went uno-dos in one. These inaccurate seeds are a much bigger problem than usual because that qualifier is absolutely deadly. Equivalent to an AVP thats held the same week as an FIVB. I count 7 recent AVP winners in the Q I was thinking the same thing, just from memory on the last year of tournaments you would think Jake/Taylor would definitely be the 1 seed. Troy and Tim have less points than a number of players that you would think they should be ahead of just thinking back on results. Even guys like Beranek, Kolinske, McKibbins are right there with Tim and Troy and I don't recall those guys winning too many MD matches last year. Phil and Nick play less of the smaller AVPs. So they can go back further for their 4 out of 5. Jake and Taylor played both Austin and Seattle. Phil/Nick take a 5th in Hawaii (315), which was almost as much points each as Jake/Taylor's 2nd in Seattle (325), and 1st in Austin(375).
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Post by KAP on Jun 30, 2020 9:27:37 GMT -5
Results from the "little birdie" at Ground ZERO: Partain/Kolinksi, Patters/Theo, Troy/Tim, Hyden/Casebeer, Sean/Lotman . . . I like the Sean/Lotman, but I'm a "wannabe Rosie R."...LOL Ok, this is what I'm seeing now: Team PLYR 1 PLYR 2 Team Pts 1 Nick Lucena /Phil Dalhausser 2438 \ 2438 \ 4876 2 Taylor Crabb /Jake Gibb 2319 \ 2319 \ 4638 3 Chase Budinger /Chaim Schalk 2201 \ 1842 \ 4043 4 Casey Patterson /Theo Brunner 2201 \ 1394 \ 3595 5 Jeremy Casebeer / John Hyden 1842 \ 1323 \ 2982 6 Trevor Crabb /Tri Bourne 2017 \ 1044 \ 3061 1 Ricardo Santos /Miles Evans 1464 \ 1395 \ 2859 2 Reid Priddy /David Lee 1787 \ 872 \ 2659 3 Ryan Doherty /Ty Loomis 1515 \ 1134 \ 2649 4 Billy Allen /Stafford Slick 1322 \ 1322 \ 2644 5 Troy Field /Tim Bomgren 1294 \ 1294 \ 2588 6 Maddison McKibbin /Riley McKibbin 1203 \ 1203 \ 2406 7 Roberto Rodriguez /Piotr Marciniak 1231 \ 1038 \ 2269 8 Ed Ratledge /Skylar Delsol 1302 \ 944 \ 2246 9 Avery Drost /Chase Frishman 1091 \ 1091 \ 2182 10 Miles Partain /Bill Kolinske 914 \ 1223 \ 2137 11 Eric Beranek /Andy Benesh 1238 \ 788 \ 2026 12 Sean Rosenthal /Paul Lotman 1140 \ 866 \ 2006 Ed/Skylar should be ahead of Rafu/Piotr. I have Rafu's points at 1197.
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Post by moderndaycoach on Jun 30, 2020 10:56:19 GMT -5
Team TNT back at it per Troy Fields IG story. Called C.Pat breaking up with him a "blessing in disguise". Was there bad blood, or is this simply Casey trying to make as much money as he can in this short period? www.instagram.com/troyfield_beach/?hl=en
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Post by haze on Jun 30, 2020 10:56:54 GMT -5
I don't understand Troy/Tim's points either. They had a brutal finish in the Chicago Gold series, but basically finished no worse than 5th with the exception of Hawaii, which wasn't even a Gold series.
With the exception of Chicago, they never finished worse than Slick/Allen and Slick/Allen have more point? Slick/Allen also didn't play MBO and Troy/Tim finished 5th. Something cannot be right there there has to be an error somewhere.
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