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Post by oldnewbie on Aug 17, 2020 21:43:13 GMT -5
We are in the middle of a pandemic in which the nation as a collective screwed up so badly it makes the idea of "American Exceptionalism" a punchline. The death toll keeps ticking up by 1,000 people a day. Why do people feel the B1G needed to explain why it was postponing? Do we need it written out in crayon? Considering collegiate displays of immaturity....Maybe this is what they could relate to!Another possible solution.
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Post by ironhammer on Aug 17, 2020 21:44:24 GMT -5
We are in the middle of a pandemic in which the nation as a collective screwed up so badly it makes the idea of "American Exceptionalism" a punchline. The death toll keeps ticking up by 1,000 people a day. Why do people feel the B1G needed to explain why it was postponing? Do we need it written out in crayon? Don't blame the B1G and the PAC12 for making an obvious decision that stemmed from the idiocy of people who couldn't be bothered when it actually mattered.Cancellations of season are a symptom, not a cause. Sometimes people can forget that and blame B1G or PAC12 or other conferences, but they are merely responding to the general situation in society.
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Post by oldnewbie on Aug 17, 2020 21:47:58 GMT -5
Don't blame the B1G and the PAC12 for making an obvious decision that stemmed from the idiocy of people who couldn't be bothered when it actually mattered. Cancellations of seasons are a symptom, not a cause. Sometimes people can forget that and blame B1G or PAC12 or other conferences, but they are merely responding to the general situation in society. You are right. The cause is shown on that graph the NCAA showed a week or two, of the project line of COVID-19 positive cases versus what actually happened.
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Post by badgerbreath on Aug 17, 2020 22:00:06 GMT -5
My point was that there is really no reason for any of the P5 to play volleyball in the Fall. I have yet to hear a good argument for fall relative to spring Vball - especially now the fall NC is out of the question. Football I can understand, Though I don’t think they will make it work, and the SEC could probably handle a Spring move. But why are the ACC, SEC and B12 going ahead with fall volleyball? Why wouldn’t Texas or Baylor prefer to play for a natty, or Florida? I don’t get why the two seasons are linked - other than a few institutions having problems with space. The FBS and NCAA are different things. The only argument that makes sense to me is the optics. They don’t want it to look like they made the decision for the wrong reasons so all the other fall sports have to go for the ride, even if it rules out a championship, or even a real season for them.. That doesn’t mean I know why they made the decision about football, other than it clearly indicates just how low on the totem pole the other sports are. Has the NCAA ruled that fall participants are excluded from a spring NC? I'm not sure why this matters. Who would think playing in both Fall and Spring, or playing in fall but participating in the NC in spring, would be a good or desirable thing? Why risk injury to key players, academic stress on student athletes, and possible NC disenfranchisement for some half assed season that might matter less than nothing? I don't get it - unless as an administrator you consider vball so unimportant you prefer it serve some other purpose.
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Post by badgerbreath on Aug 17, 2020 22:29:36 GMT -5
What is wrong with us. Talk about choking away a match. We had this thing on the run and we just flubbed it like a team with no chemistry, no cohesion. I'm trying to think of an analogous vball match, but I don't think there is one as sad. We just don't look out for each other anymore. We have no trust. We need to look at ourselves and figure this thing out, or we are done. There are even bigger monsters on the horizon than COVID. Several of them. Please, lets just try to figure out how to get these kids to play safely, so we can cheer them on and launch them on to greater things. Maybe we can work from there?
I don't know who am talking to. Lately I just look at the sky when I say things like this. Tonight the sky is full of thunder and lightning.
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Post by psuvbfan10 on Aug 17, 2020 22:53:11 GMT -5
Cancellations of seasons are a symptom, not a cause. Sometimes people can forget that and blame B1G or PAC12 or other conferences, but they are merely responding to the general situation in society. You are right. The cause is shown on that graph the NCAA showed a week or two, of the project line of COVID-19 positive cases versus what actually happened. Yep - cause the virus is not real. Just saying.
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Post by sonofdogman on Aug 17, 2020 23:36:39 GMT -5
What is wrong with us. Talk about choking away a match. We had this thing on the run and we just flubbed it like a team with no chemistry, no cohesion. I'm trying to think of an analogous vball match, but I don't think there is one as sad. We just don't look out for each other anymore. We have no trust. We need to look at ourselves and figure this thing out, or we are done. There are even bigger monsters on the horizon than COVID. Several of them. Please, lets just try to figure out how to get these kids to play safely, so we can cheer them on and launch them on to greater things. Maybe we can work from there? I don't know who am talking to. Lately I just look at the sky when I say things like this. Tonight the sky is full of thunder and lightning. Bigger monsters? What Gojira is lurking in those dark skies? Perhaps the Earth will just swallow all of us and put us out of our misery. Except of course those who bought the halliburton survivaball years back....
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Post by ironhammer on Aug 17, 2020 23:36:54 GMT -5
What is wrong with us. Talk about choking away a match. We had this thing on the run and we just flubbed it like a team with no chemistry, no cohesion. I'm trying to think of an analogous vball match, but I don't think there is one as sad. We just don't look out for each other anymore. We have no trust. We need to look at ourselves and figure this thing out, or we are done. There are even bigger monsters on the horizon than COVID. Several of them. Please, lets just try to figure out how to get these kids to play safely, so we can cheer them on and launch them on to greater things. Maybe we can work from there? I don't know who am talking to. Lately I just look at the sky when I say things like this. Tonight the sky is full of thunder and lightning. Everyone only care about themselves. No empathy. No sense of belonging to a community. No sense of doing something for the greater good. I mean sure, there are quite a few Americans who are willing to sacrifice for health of the country. Problem is, there just isn't enough of them anymore. So the net result? Collectively we all suffer, like no fall season for volleyball.
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Aug 18, 2020 7:22:14 GMT -5
Or that VB is viable in the spring assuming facilities and money (which could end up being a problem for some schools). I don't think football is viable in the Spring physically. Plus a good chunk of the players will not play - particularly those that want to go to the NFL in 2021. A team like Wisconsin would probably much rather take a chance of spring VB with a NC that includes the PAC, then play in the fall with no chance of a NC (at least one that would include the PAC). In football - Ohio State could give a rip about the PAC, but missing out on a NC that includes the SEC/ACC would be a problem for them. In addition - if the SEC/ACC/Big 12 play this fall and the B1G cancels - this could have short/intermediate impacts on recruiting. Finally, I wouldn't discount the idea that these players have dedicated much of their lives to their sport and have worked very hard to get where they are. If they cannot play - then they cannot play, but every effort should be made to try and play. My point was that there is really no reason for any of the P5 to play volleyball in the Fall. I have yet to hear a good argument for fall relative to spring Vball - especially now the fall NC is out of the question. Football I can understand, Though I don’t think they will make it work, and the SEC could probably handle a Spring move. But why are the ACC, SEC and B12 going ahead with fall volleyball? Why wouldn’t Texas or Baylor prefer to play for a natty, or Florida? I don’t get why the two seasons are linked - other than a few institutions having problems with space. The FBS and NCAA are different things. The only argument that makes sense to me is the optics. They don’t want it to look like they made the decision for the wrong reasons so all the other fall sports have to go for the ride, even if it rules out a championship, or even a real season for them.. That doesn’t mean I know why they made the decision about football, other than it clearly indicates just how low on the totem pole the other sports are. Obviously we have wild differences of opinion on whether fall sports should happen from a risk/safety standpoint. Putting that aside for the moment. VB is continuing (for now) in the SEC/Big 12/ACC because of football. It is too hard to say that it is safe for football and not volleyball. At this point - volleyball's only chance of having a real season this year is in the spring. There is no way that the PAC is going to play this fall - and w/o the PAC, there really isn't a legit season. I still think VB in the spring would likely be a short season at best and it isn't clear that there would be an NCAA tournament or what that will look like. A couple other comments. Most college players aren't playing for a National Championship. Most aren't playing for the NCAA tournament. Playing in spring vs. fall impacts players differently. At this point - there is no reason for the SEC/Big 12/ACC to cancel VB in the fall. Once/if there is some resolution on spring volleyball and eligibility rules, those teams/conferences are going to move. But for now - playing in the fall doesn't impact anything - we still have a month to go before matches are scheduled. If there is the likelihood that spring VB will happen - particularly with an NCAA tournament - then I think those teams will stop the fall and play in the spring. Also eligibility rules will impact fall VB - players with schools will be doing some picking and choosing on redshirting. For example - I would expect a player like Pressley redshirting if she wanted to stick around for another year - rather 'waste' her last year of eligibility this fall. Finally - spring college football isn't an option. You cannot have a 12 game season in March/April and play a season the next fall (at least if one cares about player's health). In addition - the top players will not play. Wisconsin's top seniors in VB will probably play if there is spring VB. Probably none of them would play if this was football. Most of the top juniors and seniors in college football aren't playing in the spring.
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Post by gibbyb1 on Aug 18, 2020 7:30:04 GMT -5
My point was that there is really no reason for any of the P5 to play volleyball in the Fall. I have yet to hear a good argument for fall relative to spring Vball - especially now the fall NC is out of the question. Football I can understand, Though I don’t think they will make it work, and the SEC could probably handle a Spring move. But why are the ACC, SEC and B12 going ahead with fall volleyball? Why wouldn’t Texas or Baylor prefer to play for a natty, or Florida? I don’t get why the two seasons are linked - other than a few institutions having problems with space. The FBS and NCAA are different things. The only argument that makes sense to me is the optics. They don’t want it to look like they made the decision for the wrong reasons so all the other fall sports have to go for the ride, even if it rules out a championship, or even a real season for them.. That doesn’t mean I know why they made the decision about football, other than it clearly indicates just how low on the totem pole the other sports are. Obviously we have wild differences of opinion on whether fall sports should happen from a risk/safety standpoint. Putting that aside for the moment. VB is continuing (for now) in the SEC/Big 12/ACC because of football. It is too hard to say that it is safe for football and not volleyball. At this point - volleyball's only chance of having a real season this year is in the spring. There is no way that the PAC is going to play this fall - and w/o the PAC, there really isn't a legit season. I still think VB in the spring would likely be a short season at best and it isn't clear that there would be an NCAA tournament or what that will look like. A couple other comments. Most college players aren't playing for a National Championship. Most aren't playing for the NCAA tournament. Playing in spring vs. fall impacts players differently. At this point - there is no reason for the SEC/Big 12/ACC to cancel VB in the fall. Once/if there is some resolution on spring volleyball and eligibility rules, those teams/conferences are going to move. But for now - playing in the fall doesn't impact anything - we still have a month to go before matches are scheduled. If there is the likelihood that spring VB will happen - particularly with an NCAA tournament - then I think those teams will stop the fall and play in the spring. Also eligibility rules will impact fall VB - players with schools will be doing some picking and choosing on redshirting. For example - I would expect a player like Pressley redshirting if she wanted to stick around for another year - rather 'waste' her last year of eligibility this fall. Finally - spring college football isn't an option. You cannot have a 12 game season in March/April and play a season the next fall (at least if one cares about player's health). In addition - the top players will not play. Wisconsin's top seniors in VB will probably play if there is spring VB. Probably none of them would play if this was football. Most of the top juniors and seniors in college football aren't playing in the spring. Not having top players wouldn’t prevent sports from happening. Top players opt out of bowl games at a high rate and those games are still played. Wisconsin would field a very good team if their top player left early. I’m not saying the product would be quite as good, just that players opting out would t prevent sports from happening.
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Post by dman on Aug 18, 2020 7:31:37 GMT -5
My point was that there is really no reason for any of the P5 to play volleyball in the Fall. I have yet to hear a good argument for fall relative to spring Vball - especially now the fall NC is out of the question. Football I can understand, Though I don’t think they will make it work, and the SEC could probably handle a Spring move. But why are the ACC, SEC and B12 going ahead with fall volleyball? Why wouldn’t Texas or Baylor prefer to play for a natty, or Florida? I don’t get why the two seasons are linked - other than a few institutions having problems with space. The FBS and NCAA are different things. The only argument that makes sense to me is the optics. They don’t want it to look like they made the decision for the wrong reasons so all the other fall sports have to go for the ride, even if it rules out a championship, or even a real season for them.. That doesn’t mean I know why they made the decision about football, other than it clearly indicates just how low on the totem pole the other sports are. Obviously we have wild differences of opinion on whether fall sports should happen from a risk/safety standpoint. Putting that aside for the moment. VB is continuing (for now) in the SEC/Big 12/ACC because of football. It is too hard to say that it is safe for football and not volleyball. At this point - volleyball's only chance of having a real season this year is in the spring. There is no way that the PAC is going to play this fall - and w/o the PAC, there really isn't a legit season. I still think VB in the spring would likely be a short season at best and it isn't clear that there would be an NCAA tournament or what that will look like. A couple other comments. Most college players aren't playing for a National Championship. Most aren't playing for the NCAA tournament. Playing in spring vs. fall impacts players differently. At this point - there is no reason for the SEC/Big 12/ACC to cancel VB in the fall. Once/if there is some resolution on spring volleyball and eligibility rules, those teams/conferences are going to move. But for now - playing in the fall doesn't impact anything - we still have a month to go before matches are scheduled. If there is the likelihood that spring VB will happen - particularly with an NCAA tournament - then I think those teams will stop the fall and play in the spring. Also eligibility rules will impact fall VB - players with schools will be doing some picking and choosing on redshirting. For example - I would expect a player like Pressley redshirting if she wanted to stick around for another year - rather 'waste' her last year of eligibility this fall. Finally - spring college football isn't an option. You cannot have a 12 game season in March/April and play a season the next fall (at least if one cares about player's health). In addition - the top players will not play. Wisconsin's top seniors in VB will probably play if there is spring VB. Probably none of them would play if this was football. Most of the top juniors and seniors in college football aren't playing in the spring. I agree with you on college football. It's just too physically demanding to play in spring and then turn around and go into a fall season. These athletes bodies need recovery time. As far a fall volleyball, it will be an interesting decision. If I was a Florida/Kentucky who has a legit chance to make a tournament run, would I want to give that opportunity up by playing in the fall if there is a championship in the spring???
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Aug 18, 2020 7:36:40 GMT -5
What is wrong with us. Talk about choking away a match. We had this thing on the run and we just flubbed it like a team with no chemistry, no cohesion. I'm trying to think of an analogous vball match, but I don't think there is one as sad. We just don't look out for each other anymore. We have no trust. We need to look at ourselves and figure this thing out, or we are done. There are even bigger monsters on the horizon than COVID. Several of them. Please, lets just try to figure out how to get these kids to play safely, so we can cheer them on and launch them on to greater things. Maybe we can work from there? I don't know who am talking to. Lately I just look at the sky when I say things like this. Tonight the sky is full of thunder and lightning. Everyone only care about themselves. No empathy. No sense of belonging to a community. No sense of doing something for the greater good. I mean sure, there are quite a few Americans who are willing to sacrifice for health of the country. Problem is, there just isn't enough of them anymore. So the net result? Collectively we all suffer, like no fall season for volleyball. This is a total crock. Are you talking about the people that spend their Saturday's working at the community food bank. The people that travel across the country after natural disasters helping people who have lost almost everything. The people that volunteer their time coaching and mentoring youth. The people that volunteer their time at an assisted living facility. The people in a community that supports a local family that is going through a severe medical problem and is facing financial disaster. The people take in foster children or volunteer as a child's court appointed advocate. The doctors that take a two week vacation in a 3rd world country providing much needed medical services - not money, but their time and talents. The people that provide shelter for abused women. Just curious if those are some of the people you are talking about when you say 'everyone only care about themselves. no empathy'. Because I bet most of those people that your blame with COVID are the same people doing many of the things above.
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Post by ironhammer on Aug 18, 2020 7:43:57 GMT -5
Everyone only care about themselves. No empathy. No sense of belonging to a community. No sense of doing something for the greater good. I mean sure, there are quite a few Americans who are willing to sacrifice for health of the country. Problem is, there just isn't enough of them anymore. So the net result? Collectively we all suffer, like no fall season for volleyball. This is a total crock. Are you talking about the people that spend their Saturday's working at the community food bank. The people that travel across the country after natural disasters helping people who have lost almost everything. The people that volunteer their time coaching and mentoring youth. The people that volunteer their time at an assisted living facility. The people in a community that supports a local family that is going through a severe medical problem and is facing financial disaster. The people take in foster children or volunteer as a child's court appointed advocate. The doctors that take a two week vacation in a 3rd world country providing much needed medical services - not money, but their time and talents. The people that provide shelter for abused women. Just curious if those are some of the people you are talking about when you say 'everyone only care about themselves. no empathy'. Because I bet most of those people that your blame with COVID are the same people doing many of the things above. Nope, you just are intentionally misinterpreting my post or maybe can't handle the truth. Where did I say there were no Americans with a conscience? I said there were quite a few, but there are NOT ENOUGH of them. Hello, look at all those people who refuse to wear a face mask. Come on, these people, I'm sorry to break it to you, but there are lots of a-holes in this country. Instead of hurling insults at me or my posts, how about go out in the real world and see what people are doing, eh?
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Aug 18, 2020 7:50:52 GMT -5
This is a total crock. Are you talking about the people that spend their Saturday's working at the community food bank. The people that travel across the country after natural disasters helping people who have lost almost everything. The people that volunteer their time coaching and mentoring youth. The people that volunteer their time at an assisted living facility. The people in a community that supports a local family that is going through a severe medical problem and is facing financial disaster. The people take in foster children or volunteer as a child's court appointed advocate. The doctors that take a two week vacation in a 3rd world country providing much needed medical services - not money, but their time and talents. The people that provide shelter for abused women. Just curious if those are some of the people you are talking about when you say 'everyone only care about themselves. no empathy'. Because I bet most of those people that your blame with COVID are the same people doing many of the things above. Nope, you just are intentionally misinterpreting my post or maybe can't handle the truth. Where did I say there were no Americans with a conscience? I said there were quite a few, but there are NOT ENOUGH of them. Hello, look at all those people who refuse to wear a face mask because they see it as "infringement of their constitutioal rights"? Come on, these people, I'm sorry to break it to you, but there are lots of a-holes in this country. Instead hurling insults at me or my posts, how about go out in the real world and see what people are doing, eh? I have a grandchild that has a severe peanut allergy. Contact with just a little bit of a peanut and w/o the EpiPen means death. She is not alone (it is pretty terrible). Is it irresponsible for people to eat peanuts, grow peanuts, process peanuts in our food? Is the person eating a bag of peanuts at a baseball game (back when we could attend baseball games) next to my granddaughter an A-hole?
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Post by ironhammer on Aug 18, 2020 7:58:40 GMT -5
Nope, you just are intentionally misinterpreting my post or maybe can't handle the truth. Where did I say there were no Americans with a conscience? I said there were quite a few, but there are NOT ENOUGH of them. Hello, look at all those people who refuse to wear a face mask because they see it as "infringement of their constitutioal rights"? Come on, these people, I'm sorry to break it to you, but there are lots of a-holes in this country. Instead hurling insults at me or my posts, how about go out in the real world and see what people are doing, eh? I have a grandchild that has a severe peanut allergy. Contact with just a little bit of a peanut and w/o the EpiPen means death. She is not alone (it is pretty terrible). Is it irresponsible for people to eat peanuts, grow peanuts, process peanuts in our food? Is the person eating a bag of peanuts at a baseball game (back when we could attend baseball games) next to my granddaughter an A-hole? Absurd and incorrect analogy. Peanuts does not "infect" others. Peanut allergy is not contagious. Covid IS contagious.
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