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Post by baytree on Sept 27, 2021 15:42:49 GMT -5
I read the minor rationales for keeping Florida in. You want to? Fine it's your ballot. However, I don't see what WKU has done to drop completely out and Marquette still isn't in. Yet Florida still gets the love And I love Florida. But they are a mess and don't belong right now in the cool kids clubhouse I'm not voting for WKU bc they could have some good wins but choose not to schedule any tough teams in pre-conference. As noted in another thread, pretty much anyone would love to play WKU but they choose not to. Florida lost to most of the tough teams they scheduled but they beat MN and at least played Baylor x 2 and Stanford. They play enough good teams later on that we'll be able to see whether to drop them completely.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 27, 2021 15:43:54 GMT -5
Wait, you think volleytalk week to week rankings are helpful in recruiting? I do feel strongly the AVCA rankings are helpful, I’ve heard coaches say as much. But volleytalk? Just...no. There is probably some exceedingly small benefit to a school to be represented well in VolleyTalk's poll, but that comment of mine obviously refers to AVCA. The polls are similar in nature, and the activity of their voters is what draws my comparison. What happens in one also happens in the other. Birds of a feather.
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Post by eazy on Sept 27, 2021 15:53:11 GMT -5
Penn St. hopping above G Tech, with G Techs only loss to a team that beat a team Penn St. lost to. B1G perception bias will always do its thing. I think recency bias is more accurate here. Penn St lost to G Tech in their very first match of the year with 2 brand new 6 rotation outside hitters. People expected them to struggle and then start to figure it out. Since then, they have a big win over Ohio St, took Stanford to 5, but lost to Oregon. I have Stanford above Penn St, but G Tech and Oregon below. Oregon lost to Minny who I have pretty low for going 5 with Michigan and losing to Florida (who I've dropped completely). G Tech hasn't beaten anyone good since Penn St. Penn St looked better this weekend than Georgia Tech did, even though G Tech was better during week 1.
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Post by knapplc on Sept 27, 2021 15:53:21 GMT -5
There may be some of that but it can go the other way too. E.g., when WI lost Hart, I immediately wondered if they were still a T5 team. If Oglivie is out for a while, I'm dropping Stanford even if they start winning. IMO if you're just going by current results, you may as well use Pablo instead of having ppl vote. If they are stockpiling AAs then they should be able to bring in one when a player gets hurt. Again, look at Nebraska. Stivrins goes out, so play some of that army of frosh blue chips and give them experience that will help the team when tourney time rolls around. Can GT do that? Nope. They have to cull the international ranks just to get a starting lineup with some relevance. Someone said my using Nebraska was a terrible example. Perhaps it's not the best right now. I picked on them as a very delayed reaction to some Husker fan on here lamenting (apparently in seriousness) how he pitied Cook that he has this problem of trying to keep all of the women happy on shorter amounts of playing time. Yeah, that's a pity all right. But don't obsess over the specific school. I was referring to a generic type which fits numerous candidates. To argue a specific school distracts from my main point - which is the rich get richer and still manage to shed crocodile tears that it's all so hard for them, while their support group gives them even more of an edge each and every season. The only real reason there's been a change in the status quo in the last 15 years is the arrival of football money, which is tilting the playing field in a different direction. Get used to it.
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Post by slxpress on Sept 27, 2021 16:05:18 GMT -5
Wait, you think volleytalk week to week rankings are helpful in recruiting? I do feel strongly the AVCA rankings are helpful, I’ve heard coaches say as much. But volleytalk? Just...no. There is probably some exceedingly small benefit to a school to be represented well in VolleyTalk's poll, but that comment of mine obviously refers to AVCA. The polls are similar in nature, and the activity of their voters is what draws my comparison. What happens in one also happens in the other. Birds of a feather. By exceedingly small, you mean zero. There is zero benefit to a school being represented well in volleytalk's poll. That's the number you're looking for. I don't agree that there's a whole lot of behavior in the AVCA poll to help another coach's recruiting efforts. There's a lack of time allocation sometimes in terms of filling out the ballot, as we can see through the analysis of the poll. But I don't think recruiting is at the top of mind at all. I also don't believe you or anyone else's comments on volleytalk is going to have much impact one way or another on how coaches vote in the AVCA poll. There's a keyboard warrior mentality here that is severely misplaced.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 27, 2021 16:28:06 GMT -5
There is probably some exceedingly small benefit to a school to be represented well in VolleyTalk's poll, but that comment of mine obviously refers to AVCA. The polls are similar in nature, and the activity of their voters is what draws my comparison. What happens in one also happens in the other. Birds of a feather. By exceedingly small, you mean zero. There is zero benefit to a school being represented well in volleytalk's poll. That's the number you're looking for. I don't agree that there's a whole lot of behavior in the AVCA poll to help another coach's recruiting efforts. There's a lack of time allocation sometimes in terms of filling out the ballot, as we can see through the analysis of the poll. But I don't think recruiting is at the top of mind at all. I also don't believe you or anyone else's comments on volleytalk is going to have much impact one way or another on how coaches vote in the AVCA poll. There's a keyboard warrior mentality here that is severely misplaced. I would have said zero if I meant that. I said exceedingly small to cover high school potential recruits and their parents reading this board. Yes it does happen. Yes it does matter. Both are impressionable groups. I think some AVCA voters have demonstrable bias, whether it be for/against a particular school, conference, or region. That bias affects poll ranking. Poll ranking affects recruiting. It's a chain. Get it? I never said recruiting was at the top of their minds. You said that. I never said any comments on VT impacted AVCA voting. You said that. What is severely misplaced is your interpretation of my comments. I find it lacking. Please do better. Instead of presuming, ask for clarification.
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Post by slxpress on Sept 27, 2021 16:42:33 GMT -5
By exceedingly small, you mean zero. There is zero benefit to a school being represented well in volleytalk's poll. That's the number you're looking for. I don't agree that there's a whole lot of behavior in the AVCA poll to help another coach's recruiting efforts. There's a lack of time allocation sometimes in terms of filling out the ballot, as we can see through the analysis of the poll. But I don't think recruiting is at the top of mind at all. I also don't believe you or anyone else's comments on volleytalk is going to have much impact one way or another on how coaches vote in the AVCA poll. There's a keyboard warrior mentality here that is severely misplaced. I would have said zero if I meant that. I said exceedingly small to cover high school potential recruits and their parents reading this board. Yes it does happen. Yes it does matter. Both are impressionable groups. I think some AVCA voters have demonstrable bias, whether it be for/against a particular school, conference, or region. That bias affects poll ranking. Poll ranking affects recruiting. It's a chain. Get it? I never said recruiting was at the top of their minds. You said that. I never said any comments on VT impacted AVCA voting. You said that. What is severely misplaced is your interpretation of my comments. I find it lacking. Please do better. Instead of presuming, ask for clarification. Or communicate better. I don't think it's me misinterpreting your comments as much as it is you being sort of ridiculous and extreme in your positions, and going out of your way to work yourself into a lather about them.
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Post by jwvolley on Sept 27, 2021 17:21:19 GMT -5
I'm one of the 12 that kept Florida in the Poll. Not because of there performance, but because they just have too much talent and they will get it figured out. If they split with Ole Miss this week they will be gone from my ballot next week though... Like most voters have stated I struggled with ranking PAC teams and placed them where I think they are right now, but it could be totally different in 3 weeks! It doesn't really mad how bad Florida's season is at this point, now that a seed looks unlikely. They're going to end up with a first-round match against UCF, and will play at Miami or Florida St. in the second round. They've just got to peak their season to those two pretty winnable matches, and then at that point they're a Sweet 16 team and Mary can pretend nothing was wrong. Regionalization has really got to go. *Chloe Mann(13) and Alex Holston(16) letting out a collective sigh*
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Post by c4ndlelight on Sept 27, 2021 17:35:32 GMT -5
It doesn't really mad how bad Florida's season is at this point, now that a seed looks unlikely. They're going to end up with a first-round match against UCF, and will play at Miami or Florida St. in the second round. They've just got to peak their season to those two pretty winnable matches, and then at that point they're a Sweet 16 team and Mary can pretend nothing was wrong. Regionalization has really got to go. *Chloe Mann(13) and Alex Holston(16) letting out a collective sigh* They might win, they might lose. The issue is that the rest of Florida's season basically makes no difference in their tournament bracket. Whether they're #17 or the last team in, it's basically the same. The only outcome that would change anything would be if Miami overperforms and gets a seed alongside FSU - which has absolutely no relation to anything on Florida's resume.
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Post by jwvolley on Sept 27, 2021 17:43:30 GMT -5
*Chloe Mann(13) and Alex Holston(16) letting out a collective sigh* They might win, they might lose. The issue is that the rest of Florida's season basically makes no difference in their tournament bracket. Whether they're #17 or the last team in, it's basically the same. The only outcome that would change anything would be if Miami overperforms and gets a seed alongside FSU - which has absolutely no relation to anything on Florida's resume. Oh I don't disagree with your point at all haha. Just a shoutout to two senior year victims of the Seminoles in the 2nd round. Plus, nobody ever talks about Mann. I think her career HP across three years playing at Florida was close to .500
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Post by bbg95 on Sept 27, 2021 17:53:02 GMT -5
I agree with this. But I suspect many voters using this justification are fans of that group of schools which stockpile AAs and traditionally win NCAA titles. Artificially elevating such schools when they struggle (see Nebraska this year as an example) allows them to keep a high poll spot, which helps them recruit and keep the dynasty going even when they hit a rough patch or two. There is no margin of error for the schools/conferences of lesser pedigree. So gripe about it if you want, but don't expect them to change. Wait, you think volleytalk week to week rankings are helpful in recruiting? I do feel strongly the AVCA rankings are helpful, I’ve heard coaches say as much. But volleytalk? Just...no. Yeah, I've long thought that the only people who care about the VT poll are people on VT. As for the AVCA poll, I do agree that they can be helpful in recruiting. It's nice to tell recruits that you're a consistent top 25 program or that you were ranked in the top 10 or were even No. 1 recently for certain schools.
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Post by volleyfan24 on Sept 28, 2021 2:06:48 GMT -5
Still not sure how one would justify ranking Louisville higher than Pitt considering Pitts schedule thus far but I know this will all sort itself out during ACC conference play but I digress.
Truthfully very exciting for the ACC and the coaches of these respective programs. During the broadcast of Louisville vs. FSU Sunday they stated that an ACC school has only made the Final Four once and that team was FSU and coached by Poole some years back so kudos to these coaches for bringing their schools back to national prominence. I believe one of them should be there come December and who knows maybe even both.
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trojansc
Legend
All-VolleyTalk 1st Team (2022, 2021, 2020, 2019, 2018, 2017), All-VolleyTalk 2nd Team (2016), 2021, 2019 Fantasy League Champion, 2020 Fantasy League Runner Up, 2022 2nd Runner Up
Posts: 28,114
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Post by trojansc on Sept 28, 2021 5:06:07 GMT -5
Still not sure how one would justify ranking Louisville higher than Pitt considering Pitts schedule thus far but I know this will all sort itself out during ACC conference play but I digress. Pitt's selection of wins are completely superior at this point. They're also superior to Texas. I think they might slip up soon though (just a hunch and not really related to the point). I'm not sure what's going on with Kayla Lund though. Yes Pitt has other weapons - so her offensive attempts/kills are going to go down. But her % is not impressive, particularly this last weekend at the NC schools. Losing 25-9 in a set was a real beatdown, but they recovered, so, I'll let that slide too.
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trojansc
Legend
All-VolleyTalk 1st Team (2022, 2021, 2020, 2019, 2018, 2017), All-VolleyTalk 2nd Team (2016), 2021, 2019 Fantasy League Champion, 2020 Fantasy League Runner Up, 2022 2nd Runner Up
Posts: 28,114
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Post by trojansc on Sept 28, 2021 5:14:33 GMT -5
The only outcome that would change anything would be if Miami overperforms and gets a seed alongside FSU - which has absolutely no relation to anything on Florida's resume. UCF has a H2H advantage over those teams though and could have 2 T25 non-conf wins if Miami-FL and Florida State remain there along with 2 T50 non-conf wins (FGCU and St. John's, if the Johnnies somehow hang in there, which I'm doubtful of). Right now 18-2 in the AAC has them hanging in the Top 16. I could easily see UCF being the 'other' Florida host and one of Miami-FL/FSU sent to them. A fun fact: Since Melville came to UCF, they are 47-2 in AAC matches. Those only 2 losses coming to Jordan Thompson-squads.
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Post by mcmike on Sept 28, 2021 12:36:09 GMT -5
Actually mcmike [who doesn't know how to create a post from a quote] says: eazy said: Minny who I have pretty low for going 5 with Michigan
If you had actually watched the play of Jones, Mruzik, and Pertofsky in sets 3, 4, & 5 vs Minnesota you would not make such a facile comment Does OSU getting swept at PSU mean you drop OSU? not...if you saw how close the sets were Trying to rank the top 25 when you can't view all of the matches is no eazy task I'm sure, but really... using the match set score with no understanding?
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