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Post by Brutus Buckeye on Jun 20, 2023 19:57:21 GMT -5
SDSU shouldn't have THAT much trouble selling their product to the Pac 12 or Big 12. I mean, they always have the "you get a trip to San Diego every year" card in their back pocket.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2023 21:32:35 GMT -5
Anyone that thinks Notre Dame is the same basic market just because of location, doesn't understand Notre Dame fandom at all. And I know this is old, but couldn't let that go twice. Not even a Notre Dame fan and even I understand they aren't a just a geo-located market. Just wow at anyone thinking they are. you are totally missing the point. it wasn't about Notre Dame it's about teh fact existing Big 10 schools (like Purdue and INdiana) are really not that big of draws. not just Rutgers and Maryland as well. you could delete Purdue and Iowa from the B1G contract, and I would be the value of a TV deal would INCREASE for the remaining schools on a per school basis That isn't just what you said, but if you want to waffle fine. The BIG 10's value isn't based on just Purdue and Iowa. Is it not the largest viewership market by location, even before Cali schools move in. Big 10 and SEC TV deals will be the biggest in college sports period. ND be short 30-50 million short compared to the teams in those conferences continuing on its own. That isn't the end of ND with its draw and endowments, but it is a lot of money to leave behind.
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Jun 21, 2023 22:14:46 GMT -5
you are totally missing the point. it wasn't about Notre Dame it's about teh fact existing Big 10 schools (like Purdue and INdiana) are really not that big of draws. not just Rutgers and Maryland as well. you could delete Purdue and Iowa from the B1G contract, and I would be the value of a TV deal would INCREASE for the remaining schools on a per school basis That isn't just what you said, but if you want to waffle fine. The BIG 10's value isn't based on just Purdue and Iowa. Is it not the largest viewership market by location, even before Cali schools move in. Big 10 and SEC TV deals will be the biggest in college sports period. ND be short 30-50 million short compared to the teams in those conferences continuing on its own. That isn't the end of ND with its draw and endowments, but it is a lot of money to leave behind. I'm not waffling at all. You are missing my point, so I'm not communicating effectively in this case. No need to engage in put-downs. my point wasn't intended to be about Notre Dame. I"m also not saying the Big 10's value is just Purdue and Iowa. my point is Purdue & Iowa (& Maryland and Rutgers) are overvalued give the share they get. Kind of like Oregon State and Washington State in the Pac-12. it's a bit of 'luck of circumstanes that Oregon State, Wazzu, maybe Arizona, maybe Cal will get left behind when they actually have a base & market that might be as attractive as those schools, if valued on their own and not part of the Big-10. so if you don't get my point, no biggie, it's my fault for poor communication.
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Post by bbg95 on Jun 26, 2023 14:51:16 GMT -5
The letter that San Diego State sent to the 11 other Mountain West presidents and the commissioner is now public.
SDSU was even more obvious in its language than I thought. The Mountain West is 100% right to consider this a resignation letter.
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Jun 26, 2023 15:39:23 GMT -5
The letter that San Diego State sent to the 11 other Mountain West presidents and the commissioner is now public. SDSU was even more obvious in its language than I thought. The Mountain West is 100% right to consider this a resignation letter. Kind of sounds like SDSU was going to give notice by 6/30 if the conference wasn't going to grant an extension. This letter didn't help their bargaining position - but then I am not sure what they could have done to get an extension. Seems like SDSU is confident that they will get an invite to a P5 conference for the 2024-25 season. I guess if the PAC were to implode - they could take a financial hit compared to staying put, but they probably don't think that is likely. Curious - does SMU have similar issues and deadlines with the AAC - and has there been anything about them? I think SDSU's path to a P5 conference is much stronger than SMU.
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Post by brooselee on Jun 26, 2023 16:15:18 GMT -5
SDSU seems kind of overconfident considering none of the current PAC 12 school views them as an adequate replacement for USC and UCLA. The push for SDSU to join is mostly from the media and from the PAC12 high ups.
I doubt UO, UW, Utah, etc. are itching to bring SDSU in. As a football program, they couldn’t even sell out a 35,000 seat brand new stadium that was built before last season. What make SDSU so special?
I don’t even know how the contract supposed to work. The PAC 12 schools are currently trying to get a media deal WITHOUT SDSU. If the conference do come to some kind of agreement with the current 10 members and the Apple/ NBC Universal for media rights and then let SDSU in, then what? Will the PAC 12 then go back to the bargaining table and write up another contract…..this one WITH SDSU?
SDSU also have ZERO leverage to demand anything from the PAC12 because they are so desperate to get into the PAC 12. The current members could play hard ball with them and SDSU will get stuck with a horrible deal. Pay and exit fee from the MWC for 17 mil and get an offer from thr PAC 12 at 4 mil per year…take it or leave it. That not a good trade off IMHO.
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Post by bbg95 on Jun 26, 2023 16:48:30 GMT -5
The letter that San Diego State sent to the 11 other Mountain West presidents and the commissioner is now public. SDSU was even more obvious in its language than I thought. The Mountain West is 100% right to consider this a resignation letter. Kind of sounds like SDSU was going to give notice by 6/30 if the conference wasn't going to grant an extension. This letter didn't help their bargaining position - but then I am not sure what they could have done to get an extension. Seems like SDSU is confident that they will get an invite to a P5 conference for the 2024-25 season. I guess if the PAC were to implode - they could take a financial hit compared to staying put, but they probably don't think that is likely. Curious - does SMU have similar issues and deadlines with the AAC - and has there been anything about them? I think SDSU's path to a P5 conference is much stronger than SMU. I'd have to look, but I believe it was reported that SMU has not given notice. The AAC exit fee is $10 million and requires 27 months notice. Cincinnati, UCF and Houston negotiated to get out a little earlier than that and ended up paying $18 million each.
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Post by bbg95 on Jun 26, 2023 16:55:28 GMT -5
SDSU seems kind of overconfident considering none of the current PAC 12 school views them as an adequate replacement for USC and UCLA. The push for SDSU to join is mostly from the media and from the PAC12 high ups. I doubt UO, UW, Utah, etc. are itching to bring SDSU in. As a football program, they couldn’t even sell out a 35,000 seat brand new stadium that was built before last season. What make SDSU so special? I don’t even know how the contract supposed to work. The PAC 12 schools are currently trying to get a media deal WITHOUT SDSU. If the conference do come to some kind of agreement with the current 10 members and the Apple/ NBC Universal for media rights and then let SDSU in, then what? Will the PAC 12 then go back to the bargaining table and write up another contract…..this one WITH SDSU? SDSU also have ZERO leverage to demand anything from the PAC12 because they are so desperate to get into the PAC 12. The current members could play hard ball with them and SDSU will get stuck with a horrible deal. Pay and exit fee from the MWC for 17 mil and get an offer from thr PAC 12 at 4 mil per year…take it or leave it. That not a good trade off IMHO. My guess is that if/when the Pac-12 gets a new TV deal, it would have some provision about adding San Diego State or anyone else and how much that would affect the bottom line. I agree that SDSU doesn't have a lot of leverage, and they probably destroyed most of what they had with this letter. If they had just kept their options open, they could at least have the Mountain West as a fallback if they never get a P5 invite. Worst case scenario, they might have to wait another year to join the Pac-12, and they may have been able to negotiate an early exit the way that other schools have.
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Post by staticb on Jun 26, 2023 17:26:27 GMT -5
Considering this is also the 2nd time that SDSU has tried to leave the conference--I can't see the MWC bending over backwards to help there. It's totally understandable that they would want to improve their lot in life, but it's also understandable the remaining conference members also want their $$$ of the pie. Throw out this March, and it's not like SDSU has been a big performer on the field.
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Post by brooselee on Jun 26, 2023 20:20:05 GMT -5
Considering this is also the 2nd time that SDSU has tried to leave the conference--I can't see the MWC bending over backwards to help there. It's totally understandable that they would want to improve their lot in life, but it's also understandable the remaining conference members also want their $$$ of the pie. Throw out this March, and it's not like SDSU has been a big performer on the field. It’s the famous line people like to use…..it’s strictly business. Yeah…no one can blame SDSU for wanting to improve their lot in life but the MWC also have to look out for their own members and the survival of their conference. Cannot make a deal and give an exiting team special treatment while putting current members in an unfavorable situation. No to negotiating the exit fee down. It’s 17 mil and that should be the final number.
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Post by vbnerd on Jun 26, 2023 22:38:16 GMT -5
I doubt UO, UW, Utah, etc. are itching to bring SDSU in. As a football program, they couldn’t even sell out a 35,000 seat brand new stadium that was built before last season. What make SDSU so special? Because UO, UW, Utah, etc cannot win football games on home grown talent alone, and Southern California is an incredibly fertile recruiting territory for football. And volleyball. And baseball/softball. And basketball. And Soccer. And Track. And Tennis. And for regular students who often don't need financial aid. Every college wants to be in the Southern California business, and at least for Football, SDSU is the only way to get there at the moment.
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Post by brooselee on Jun 27, 2023 1:26:10 GMT -5
I doubt UO, UW, Utah, etc. are itching to bring SDSU in. As a football program, they couldn’t even sell out a 35,000 seat brand new stadium that was built before last season. What make SDSU so special? Because UO, UW, Utah, etc cannot win football games on home grown talent alone, and Southern California is an incredibly fertile recruiting territory for football. And volleyball. And baseball/softball. And basketball. And Soccer. And Track. And Tennis. And for regular students who often don't need financial aid. Every college wants to be in the Southern California business, and at least for Football, SDSU is the only way to get there at the moment. Many colleges are able to recruit SoCal talent without having a SoCal team in their league. The top QBs in SoCal the past few years have gone to Alabama(Bryce Young) and Clemso(DJ Uiagalelei), Nico Iamaleava(Tennessee). Many of SoCal kids have gone to SEc, Big 12, ACC and BIG 10 schools despite no Cali presence in their leagues. To say one needs to have a SoCal school in their league to access their talent is just not correct. It has been proven time and time again. I bet you UW, Utah and UO will continue to land big time SoCal talent despite not having USC and UCLA in the PAC 12. National Champ Texas have only one volleyball player from California and runner up Louisville have none. The volleyball talent has spread out nation wide so some schools are finding talent else and don’t have to go all the way to California to find talent.
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Post by bigjohn043 on Jun 27, 2023 8:33:16 GMT -5
Because UO, UW, Utah, etc cannot win football games on home grown talent alone, and Southern California is an incredibly fertile recruiting territory for football. And volleyball. And baseball/softball. And basketball. And Soccer. And Track. And Tennis. And for regular students who often don't need financial aid. Every college wants to be in the Southern California business, and at least for Football, SDSU is the only way to get there at the moment. Many colleges are able to recruit SoCal talent without having a SoCal team in their league. The top QBs in SoCal the past few years have gone to Alabama(Bryce Young) and Clemso(DJ Uiagalelei), Nico Iamaleava(Tennessee). Many of SoCal kids have gone to SEc, Big 12, ACC and BIG 10 schools despite no Cali presence in their leagues. To say one needs to have a SoCal school in their league to access their talent is just not correct. It has been proven time and time again. I bet you UW, Utah and UO will continue to land big time SoCal talent despite not having USC and UCLA in the PAC 12. National Champ Texas have only one volleyball player from California and runner up Louisville have none. The volleyball talent has spread out nation wide so some schools are finding talent else and don’t have to go all the way to California to find talent. SoCal is the biggest market in the west coach and one of the biggest in the country. It has talent, it has viewers and frankly it has a ton of students it sends to college every year. You don't need a team in SoCal to access any of those things but it certainly helps. The issue is the P-12 needs to get bigger. There is still a chance they lose a school or two and getting bigger is their best defense against that.
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Post by vbnerd on Jun 27, 2023 9:57:16 GMT -5
Because UO, UW, Utah, etc cannot win football games on home grown talent alone, and Southern California is an incredibly fertile recruiting territory for football. And volleyball. And baseball/softball. And basketball. And Soccer. And Track. And Tennis. And for regular students who often don't need financial aid. Every college wants to be in the Southern California business, and at least for Football, SDSU is the only way to get there at the moment. Many colleges are able to recruit SoCal talent without having a SoCal team in their league. The top QBs in SoCal the past few years have gone to Alabama(Bryce Young) and Clemso(DJ Uiagalelei), Nico Iamaleava(Tennessee). Many of SoCal kids have gone to SEc, Big 12, ACC and BIG 10 schools despite no Cali presence in their leagues. To say one needs to have a SoCal school in their league to access their talent is just not correct. It has been proven time and time again. I bet you UW, Utah and UO will continue to land big time SoCal talent despite not having USC and UCLA in the PAC 12. National Champ Texas have only one volleyball player from California and runner up Louisville have none. The volleyball talent has spread out nation wide so some schools are finding talent else and don’t have to go all the way to California to find talent. I was writing a reply in my head and then I saw you liked your own post and now I don't want to go down this road with you.
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Post by slxpress on Jun 27, 2023 11:51:06 GMT -5
Many colleges are able to recruit SoCal talent without having a SoCal team in their league. The top QBs in SoCal the past few years have gone to Alabama(Bryce Young) and Clemso(DJ Uiagalelei), Nico Iamaleava(Tennessee). Many of SoCal kids have gone to SEc, Big 12, ACC and BIG 10 schools despite no Cali presence in their leagues. To say one needs to have a SoCal school in their league to access their talent is just not correct. It has been proven time and time again. I bet you UW, Utah and UO will continue to land big time SoCal talent despite not having USC and UCLA in the PAC 12. National Champ Texas have only one volleyball player from California and runner up Louisville have none. The volleyball talent has spread out nation wide so some schools are finding talent else and don’t have to go all the way to California to find talent. I was writing a reply in my head and then I saw you liked your own post and now I don't want to go down this road with you. I like all of my own posts so I can build up my internet points faster.
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