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Post by n00b on May 19, 2022 8:37:56 GMT -5
Indiana is not a good job, even if it means doubling your salary. If the only argument you have is about money, I won't waste any more of time responding. Ever been to their new facility? If anyone thinks that IU could not be a way better job than Purdue (ever been to the %*$#hole they still play in, even with all of their success?) with the right Coach, you are absolutely wrong. They obviously thought that Aird could become the Dave Shondell of IU, but happened to get that dead wrong. IU could quickly become one of the better jobs in the Big 10 but for one little detail - finding the right Coach. Someone like a Kelli Miller, if she could be attracted to the job, could be (IMHO) that person, but we will never know until they dump Aird and go in a different direction. I’ll also add if you’re Miller, you have to strike while the iron is hot if you can. I think she’s very good (and way better than Aird), but this past season was still her first regular season MAC championship. And that was after missing the MAC tournament in the COVID spring. Just going out there and replicating their best season ever is much easier said than done. |
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Post by mervynpumpkinhead on May 19, 2022 8:47:55 GMT -5
Indiana is not a good job, even if it means doubling your salary. If the only argument you have is about money, I won't waste any more of time responding. Ever been to their new facility? If anyone thinks that IU could not be a way better job than Purdue (ever been to the %*$#hole they still play in, even with all of their success?) with the right Coach, you are absolutely wrong. They obviously thought that Aird could become the Dave Shondell of IU, but happened to get that dead wrong. IU could quickly become one of the better jobs in the Big 10 but for one little detail - finding the right Coach. Someone like a Kelli Miller, if she could be attracted to the job, could be (IMHO) that person, but we will never know until they dump Aird and go in a different direction. Purdue's gym is a "#$%^hole"? Wow. That's the nicest #$%^hole I've ever seen. |
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Post by karellen on May 19, 2022 8:55:14 GMT -5
Ever been to their new facility? If anyone thinks that IU could not be a way better job than Purdue (ever been to the %*$#hole they still play in, even with all of their success?) with the right Coach, you are absolutely wrong. They obviously thought that Aird could become the Dave Shondell of IU, but happened to get that dead wrong. IU could quickly become one of the better jobs in the Big 10 but for one little detail - finding the right Coach. Someone like a Kelli Miller, if she could be attracted to the job, could be (IMHO) that person, but we will never know until they dump Aird and go in a different direction. Purdue's gym is a "#$%^hole"? Wow. That's the nicest #$%^hole I've ever seen. Agreed...Purdue VB gym is great and it gets loud and rockin'...excellent facility and environment |
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Post by thevoiceofreason on May 19, 2022 9:59:40 GMT -5
Ever been to their new facility? If anyone thinks that IU could not be a way better job than Purdue (ever been to the %*$#hole they still play in, even with all of their success?) with the right Coach, you are absolutely wrong. They obviously thought that Aird could become the Dave Shondell of IU, but happened to get that dead wrong. IU could quickly become one of the better jobs in the Big 10 but for one little detail - finding the right Coach. Someone like a Kelli Miller, if she could be attracted to the job, could be (IMHO) that person, but we will never know until they dump Aird and go in a different direction. I’ll also add if you’re Miller, you have to strike while the iron is hot if you can. I think she’s very good (and way better than Aird), but this past season was still her first regular season MAC championship. And that was after missing the MAC tournament in the COVID spring. Just going out there and replicating their best season ever is much easier said than done. I've watched the MAC closely for years now. Ball State has been the upper echelon of the MAC West every year, but 2021 was the first Tournament Championship. They've won the MAC West 2017-19 and 2021. You are absolutely right that 2021 was the best season. BUT this is a program that has won 20+ games in three of the last four years. |
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Post by vbcoltrane on May 19, 2022 10:03:13 GMT -5
If Purdue is an elite program, there is absolutely nothing stopping Indiana from being just as good. Something must be. It's been too long.
People love to list bona fides - good school, pretty campus, good recruiting area - and surmise that it means schools could easily become a top program. A lot of schools meet those criteria, so I don't think it's that easy.
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Post by slxpress on May 19, 2022 10:31:26 GMT -5
If Purdue is an elite program, there is absolutely nothing stopping Indiana from being just as good. Something must be. It's been too long.
People love to list bona fides - good school, pretty campus, good recruiting area - and surmise that it means schools could easily become a top program. A lot of schools meet those criteria, so I don't think it's that easy.
It’s always about hiring the right coach and then being able to keep them. I don’t care how great a program’s potential is, if they can’t make the right hire, or they can’t keep the right hire once they find them, they’re not going to be able to do much. Conversely, a program with limitations, if the right person comes along in some cases can elevate them beyond that so they transform into a program with bonafides. But it starts with hiring the right coach. I think it’s safe to say Steve Aird ain’t it. |
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Post by bbg95 on May 19, 2022 10:39:38 GMT -5
Indiana is not a good job, even if it means doubling your salary. If the only argument you have is about money, I won't waste any more of time responding. Ever been to their new facility? If anyone thinks that IU could not be a way better job than Purdue (ever been to the %*$#hole they still play in, even with all of their success?) with the right Coach, you are absolutely wrong. They obviously thought that Aird could become the Dave Shondell of IU, but happened to get that dead wrong. IU could quickly become one of the better jobs in the Big 10 but for one little detail - finding the right Coach. Someone like a Kelli Miller, if she could be attracted to the job, could be (IMHO) that person, but we will never know until they dump Aird and go in a different direction. I'd advise Indiana to catch up to Ball State first before thinking about being a "way better" program than Purdue, lol. |
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Post by Phaedrus on May 19, 2022 10:49:14 GMT -5
Something must be. It's been too long. People love to list bona fides - good school, pretty campus, good recruiting area - and surmise that it means schools could easily become a top program. A lot of schools meet those criteria, so I don't think it's that easy.
It’s always about hiring the right coach and then being able to keep them. I don’t care how great a program’s potential is, if they can’t make the right hire, or they can’t keep the right hire once they find them, they’re not going to be able to do much. Conversely, a program with limitations, if the right person comes along in some cases can elevate them beyond that so they transform into a program with bonafides. But it starts with hiring the right coach. I think it’s safe to say Steve Aird ain’t it. Hiring the right coach and keeping that coach are the same argument. It is program support and commitment. You can't hire the right coach unless you have the right commitment, whether it is facilities, enough budget for extended support staff, or budget for all the benefits like travel perks etc. Even if you manage to hire that someone, you can't keep them unless you commit the university to improving the circumstances so that they willingly stay. Once they are on campus, they will get a pretty quick idea of how far they can push the envelope. If they are not happy with their lot, you won't be able to keep them. |
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Post by bbg95 on May 19, 2022 10:49:31 GMT -5
If Purdue is an elite program, there is absolutely nothing stopping Indiana from being just as good. Something must be. It's been too long.
People love to list bona fides - good school, pretty campus, good recruiting area - and surmise that it means schools could easily become a top program. A lot of schools meet those criteria, so I don't think it's that easy.
Yeah, and we're not talking about some blue blood that has fallen on hard times like USC football or, well, Indiana basketball. Indiana volleyball is a never was. |
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Post by slxpress on May 19, 2022 11:19:51 GMT -5
It’s always about hiring the right coach and then being able to keep them. I don’t care how great a program’s potential is, if they can’t make the right hire, or they can’t keep the right hire once they find them, they’re not going to be able to do much. Conversely, a program with limitations, if the right person comes along in some cases can elevate them beyond that so they transform into a program with bonafides. But it starts with hiring the right coach. I think it’s safe to say Steve Aird ain’t it. Hiring the right coach and keeping that coach are the same argument. It is program support and commitment. You can't hire the right coach unless you have the right commitment, whether it is facilities, enough budget for extended support staff, or budget for all the benefits like travel perks etc. Even if you manage to hire that someone, you can't keep them unless you commit the university to improving the circumstances so that they willingly stay. Once they are on campus, they will get a pretty quick idea of how far they can push the envelope. If they are not happy with their lot, you won't be able to keep them. I don’t agree. If USC could have figured out a way to keep Jerritt Elliott when he was the interim head coach rather than giving the job back to Mick Haley, they’d be in a much better place right now. If Wisconsin could have kept John Cook they wouldn’t have had the Pete Waite years. I don’t know how the Hambly/Tamas comparison works out in the long run, but I can say Illinois wasn’t able to keep Hambly. A successful program is always at their most vulnerable after a coaching change. Having a great head coach retire or move on is not a guarantee the next coach is going to win at an equivalent level. Unless you’re Ohio State football or KU basketball. I’d say being able to keep the coach is just as critical as finding them in the first place. Mark Few staying at Gonzaga. Dawn Staley at South Carolina. Dabo Swinney at Clemson. If you can’t keep the right coach after finding them, and it’s such a crap shoot in the first place, then you’re fated to keep undergoing the cycle until you miss. That’s really what separates the deep pocket programs from everyone else. Once they find the right person, they have the resources to make sure that person never leaves. But they’re still just as capable of making the wrong hire multiple times before they find the right person. |
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Post by robtearle on May 19, 2022 11:33:29 GMT -5
Hiring the right coach and keeping that coach are the same argument. It is program support and commitment. You can't hire the right coach unless you have the right commitment, whether it is facilities, enough budget for extended support staff, or budget for all the benefits like travel perks etc. Even if you manage to hire that someone, you can't keep them unless you commit the university to improving the circumstances so that they willingly stay. Once they are on campus, they will get a pretty quick idea of how far they can push the envelope. If they are not happy with their lot, you won't be able to keep them. If Wisconsin could have kept John Cook they wouldn’t have had the Pete Waite years. While Pete Waite's years at Wisconsin didn't end well, it isn't like he was some sort of disaster. Under Waite, they made the NCAA tournament nine years in a row, won two Big Ten championships, and made an NCAA final. |
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Post by slxpress on May 19, 2022 11:37:19 GMT -5
If Wisconsin could have kept John Cook they wouldn’t have had the Pete Waite years. While Pete Waite's years at Wisconsin didn't end well, it isn't like he was some sort of disaster. Under Waite, they made the NCAA tournament nine years in a row, won two Big Ten championships, and made an NCAA final. Is that a disagreement? You feel like Wisconsin was better off having John Cook hired away? |
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Post by robtearle on May 19, 2022 11:40:42 GMT -5
While Pete Waite's years at Wisconsin didn't end well, it isn't like he was some sort of disaster. Under Waite, they made the NCAA tournament nine years in a row, won two Big Ten championships, and made an NCAA final. Is that a disagreement? You feel like Wisconsin was better off having John Cook hired away? The point is that "the Pete Waite years" at Wisconsin were not a single entity, and in this context don't really apply in any 'useful' way to Indiana and Steve Aird. Pete Waite did a pretty darn good job for a good number of years. |
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Post by eazy on May 19, 2022 11:41:35 GMT -5
Hiring the right coach and keeping that coach are the same argument. It is program support and commitment. You can't hire the right coach unless you have the right commitment, whether it is facilities, enough budget for extended support staff, or budget for all the benefits like travel perks etc. Even if you manage to hire that someone, you can't keep them unless you commit the university to improving the circumstances so that they willingly stay. Once they are on campus, they will get a pretty quick idea of how far they can push the envelope. If they are not happy with their lot, you won't be able to keep them. I don’t agree. If USC could have figured out a way to keep Jerritt Elliott when he was the interim head coach rather than giving the job back to Mick Haley, they’d be in a much better place right now. If Wisconsin could have kept John Cook they wouldn’t have had the Pete Waite years. I don’t know how the Hambly/Tamas comparison works out in the long run, but I can say Illinois wasn’t able to keep Hambly. A successful program is always at their most vulnerable after a coaching change. Having a great head coach retire or move on is not a guarantee the next coach is going to win at an equivalent level. Unless you’re Ohio State football or KU basketball. I’d say being able to keep the coach is just as critical as finding them in the first place. Mark Few staying at Gonzaga. Dawn Staley at South Carolina. Dabo Swinney at Clemson. If you can’t keep the right coach after finding them, and it’s such a crap shoot in the first place, then you’re fated to keep undergoing the cycle until you miss. That’s really what separates the deep pocket programs from everyone else. Once they find the right person, they have the resources to make sure that person never leaves. But they’re still just as capable of making the wrong hire multiple times before they find the right person. What exactly don't you agree with? It sounds like you're saying the same thing: Finding and keeping a head coach are both done the same way and are both important. |
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trojansc
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Post by trojansc on May 19, 2022 11:45:56 GMT -5
If USC could have figured out a way to keep Jerritt Elliott when he was the interim head coach rather than giving the job back to Mick Haley, they’d be in a much better place right now. Wait, what? USC’s current state of affairs is on Donna Heinel’s back and a corrupt USC athletic dept and administration. So much could have happened since 2002, who’s to say Jerritt would have gotten along with that b*tch? . And USC was good enough to have made Final Four’s and at least the Regional Final is over half of those years. Mick was by no means without flaws, but he kept USC competitive and could rebound quickly from less than standard years, which still weren’t even missing the tournament. |
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