I understand shading excessive stress on team comradery (i.e., kumbaya) when the team is losing, but I feel like team USA has been in a really good place the last year, even with all the new faces, so the criticism doesn't have the same effect these days.
If anything, I'd be shading Italy's lack of comradery sometimes, which costs them matches.
No one shades the Italian men's lack of comradery. Girls need to get along, men can argue and it's all okay. Not sure why Karch is reinforcing that outdated stereotype.
There are double standards when it comes to men and women about comradery but yeah there's tons of discussion about the men and chemistry. IMO US men didn't have great chemistry in Tokyo. Poland's men with their super stars maybe not the best chemistry at times.
No, I have not watched the Italian men since the Olympics, but this was a commentary on the double standard between what we expect of men and women on the court and off. Zaytsev was not hugging his teammates when they made an error. People generally expect and forgive competitiveness that borders on self-centeredness in men, not women. Karch takes it to another level.
except thats not even what "kumbaya" is.
omg jwvolley where is the AU gif about the camera angle
I understand shading excessive stress on team comradery (i.e., kumbaya) when the team is losing, but I feel like team USA has been in a really good place the last year, even with all the new faces, so the criticism doesn't have the same effect these days.
If anything, I'd be shading Italy's lack of comradery sometimes, which costs them matches.
Agree. One of the biggest reasons Karch’s team won Olympic gold last year and the 2012 team lost that gold is the comradery and the lack of. Some of you pick on him and his this particular aspect is because you have lost all the other aspects to pick on now that he’s already the most decorated woman’s volleyball coach in US history by leading em to first World Champion and Olympic Gold. He can win nothing from now on and still be remembered as that first volleyball player and coach.
Retweet. The funny thing about VT's obsession with "kumbaya" is that the culture in the gym is player led. Karch built it but chemistry is a big focus for the players and it's an important part of their success.
Certain posters on VT just whine about "kumbaya" to support their agenda for why their favorite player isn't playing.
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Agree. One of the biggest reasons Karch’s team won Olympic gold last year and the 2012 team lost that gold is the comradery and the lack of.
I don't know if the biggest reasons (for better or for worse) are related to comradery vs. other factors.
Was 2014 WCh gold because of comradery? Was disappointment in 2016 (maybe only slight that year?) and 2018 due to comradery? Was there some change from 2014 to 2018 and then again from 2018 to 2021 in comradery that made those results happen?
I know some of kumbaya feedback here is serious and some of it is memeing, but, it's interesting if one uses that to explain results over 2012-2021 as a major factor, it just doesn't add up to me.
The opposition level matters more when analyzing results than one's own team's performance, IMO, and I DO think Karch and USA have addressed major weaknesses in recent years (without any respect to Kumbaya).
Last Edit: Jul 5, 2022 21:02:02 GMT -5 by trojansc
Agree. One of the biggest reasons Karch’s team won Olympic gold last year and the 2012 team lost that gold is the comradery and the lack of.
I don't know if the biggest reasons (for better or for worse) are related to comradery vs. other factors.
Was 2014 WCh gold because of comradery? Was disappointment in 2016 (maybe only slight that year?) and 2018 due to comradery? Was there some change from 2014 to 2018 and then again from 2018 to 2021 in comradery that made those results happen?
I know some of kumbaya feedback here is serious and some of it is memeing, but, it's interesting if one uses that to explain results over 2012-2021, it just doesn't add up to me.
I don't think there is any correlation or causation tbh.
I understand shading excessive stress on team comradery (i.e., kumbaya) when the team is losing, but I feel like team USA has been in a really good place the last year, even with all the new faces, so the criticism doesn't have the same effect these days.
If anything, I'd be shading Italy's lack of comradery sometimes, which costs them matches.
Agree. One of the biggest reasons Karch’s team won Olympic gold last year and the 2012 team lost that gold is the comradery and the lack of.
My only disagreement here is we lost 2012 because of “kumbaya” or whatever you want to call it.
We win that match 2 out of 3 times (or whatever “best of” you want to use). We were the much better team. Jacque had a surprisingly monster match, and a few other things didn’t fall in USA’s favor, but we were the best team in London. Sometimes the better team just doesn’t win.
That’s not to say if we won gold we wouldn’t have seen the “shift” though.
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Agree. One of the biggest reasons Karch’s team won Olympic gold last year and the 2012 team lost that gold is the comradery and the lack of.
My only disagreement here is we lost 2012 because of “kumbaya” or whatever you want to call it.
We win that match 2 out of 3 times (or whatever “best of” you want to use). We were the much better team. Jacque had a surprisingly monster match, and a few other things didn’t fall in USA’s favor, but we were the best team in London. Sometimes the better team just doesn’t win.
That’s not to say if we won gold we wouldn’t have seen the “shift” though.
Yes to all of this. I know it's unrealistic and impossible (with player overlap), but it would be interesting to see H2H matches between USA 2012, 2016, and 2021. I'm definitely not confident in saying that 2021 was the best USA team of recent history despite their absolute domination of the Knockout rounds destroying DR, Serbia, and Brazil.
My only disagreement here is we lost 2012 because of “kumbaya” or whatever you want to call it.
We win that match 2 out of 3 times (or whatever “best of” you want to use). We were the much better team. Jacque had a surprisingly monster match, and a few other things didn’t fall in USA’s favor, but we were the best team in London. Sometimes the better team just doesn’t win.
That’s not to say if we won gold we wouldn’t have seen the “shift” though.
Yes to all of this. I know it's unrealistic and impossible (with player overlap), but it would be interesting to see H2H matches between USA 2012, 2016, and 2021. I'm definitely not confident in saying that 2021 was the best USA team of recent history despite their absolute domination of the Knockout rounds destroying DR, Serbia, and Brazil.
I think that just goes to speak around the unfortunate state of womens volleyball rn with many other national teams missing players due to injury or whatever else. Not that the usa wouldn’t have won anyway. It’s just unfortunate that there aren’t very many elite teams
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Me gearing up for the latest discussion of comradery
another day of realization of how terrible my vocabulary is/has been. I never knew comradery and camaraderie were both acceptable forms of spelling for the exact same word.
I understand shading excessive stress on team comradery (i.e., kumbaya) when the team is losing, but I feel like team USA has been in a really good place the last year, even with all the new faces, so the criticism doesn't have the same effect these days.
If anything, I'd be shading Italy's lack of comradery sometimes, which costs them matches.
Just because the team found their groove and started winning doesn't mean the obsessive focus on Kumbuya isn't a problem. Of course we want the girls to like each other and enjoy playing together, but it still feels a bit forced...
It's a problem for who, though, the fans or the players? This is kind of my point. Have any players complained?