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Post by robtearle on May 8, 2022 17:04:32 GMT -5
Agree with PSU.. Coaches tweaks are completely overrated. "Coach's tweaks" are what won Wisconsin the national championship this year. Yes, they had a ton of talent. So did Texas, so did Louisville, so did Nebraska, etal. The tweak that won the championship - Smrek playing opposite being subbed by back-row-attacker Jade Demps - was a tweak that wasn't even tried until into November. (And this all completely ignoring the GREAT difference that the teaching a coaching staff can and does make.) |
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on May 8, 2022 17:14:44 GMT -5
Agree with PSU.. Coaches tweaks are completely overrated. "Coach's tweaks" are what won Wisconsin the national championship this year. That and some amazingly talented Super Seniors. |
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Post by robtearle on May 8, 2022 17:30:48 GMT -5
"Coach's tweaks" are what won Wisconsin the national championship this year. That and some amazingly talented Super Seniors. Those amazingly talented super-seniors were the #4 seed in the tournament. There was nothing 'inevitable' about their winning. |
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Post by bbg95 on May 8, 2022 17:49:58 GMT -5
That and some amazingly talented Super Seniors. Those amazingly talented super-seniors were the #4 seed in the tournament. There was nothing 'inevitable' about their winning. And it's not like Wisconsin was the only team with super seniors. I also think Wisconsin was more disrupted by Covid the previous season than many teams. |
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Post by bbg95 on May 8, 2022 17:50:56 GMT -5
Coaching is overrated. Recruiting is underrated. I don't agree with either statement. I think recruiting is properly rated (pretty much everyone acknowledges its importance), and coaching is underrated. If there is a large talent disparity between two teams, that will usually win out. But if the teams are close in talent, the better coach often makes a difference. |
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Post by hammer on May 8, 2022 18:04:34 GMT -5
If Illinois were a stock, I'd be a buyer. Penn State OTOH, I'd be a seller, at least for now.
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on May 8, 2022 18:16:08 GMT -5
That and some amazingly talented Super Seniors. Those amazingly talented super-seniors were the #4 seed in the tournament. There was nothing 'inevitable' about their winning. I never once said that. I will go out on a limb and say that all the tweaks in the world may not mean much if you don't have a fifth year Rettke, Hilley, and Barnes. Or put it this way, do you think Wisconsin still wins without them? |
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Post by Kearney Kingston on May 8, 2022 18:20:13 GMT -5
I feel that Wisconsin had a variety of lineups using their ten best players that may very well have won the championship.
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Post by wiscvball on May 8, 2022 18:22:19 GMT -5
Those amazingly talented super-seniors were the #4 seed in the tournament. There was nothing 'inevitable' about their winning. I never once said that. I will go out on a limb and say that all the tweaks in the world may not mean much if you don't have a fifth year Rettke, Hilley, and Barnes. Or put it this way, do you think Wisconsin still wins without them? It’s a huge help when you have a 6’9” middle/right who can touch 11’2”… that, plus the talent surrounding Smrek, will keep them in the conversation for a national and big ten championship for at least three more years. Smrek, with a good set, renders any block useless. |
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Post by robtearle on May 8, 2022 18:33:52 GMT -5
Those amazingly talented super-seniors were the #4 seed in the tournament. There was nothing 'inevitable' about their winning. I never once said that. I will go out on a limb and say that all the tweaks in the world may not mean much if you don't have a fifth year Rettke, Hilley, and Barnes. Or put it this way, do you think Wisconsin still wins without them? Ask if Minnesota would have won without Samedy, Texas without Eggleston, Baylor without Presley and Skinner, Louisville without Dilfer and Stevenson, Nebraska without Stivrins and Caffey, etc etc etc. If Sheffield, after a good deal of experimentation, doesn't come up with the Smrek-Demps opposite combo, I am pretty sure that Wisconsin doesn't win the Big Ten, and VERY likely doesn't win the national championship. |
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on May 8, 2022 18:34:12 GMT -5
I never once said that. I will go out on a limb and say that all the tweaks in the world may not mean much if you don't have a fifth year Rettke, Hilley, and Barnes. Or put it this way, do you think Wisconsin still wins without them? It’s a huge help when you have a 6’9” middle/right who can touch 11’2”… that, plus the talent surrounding Smrek, will keep them in the conversation for a national and big ten championship for at least three more years. Smrek, with a good set, renders any block useless. Without a doubt! But they don't win with Smrek and without the three I mentioned. Orzol was also a solid contributor. |
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on May 8, 2022 18:41:24 GMT -5
I never once said that. I will go out on a limb and say that all the tweaks in the world may not mean much if you don't have a fifth year Rettke, Hilley, and Barnes. Or put it this way, do you think Wisconsin still wins without them? Ask if Minnesota would have won without Samedy, Texas without Eggleston, Baylor without Presley and Skinner, Louisville without Dilfer and Stevenson, Nebraska without Stivrins and Caffey, etc etc etc. If Sheffield, after a good deal of experimentation, doesn't come up with the Smrek-Demps opposite combo, I am pretty sure that Wisconsin doesn't win the Big Ten, and VERY likely doesn't win the national championship. Again you're 100% correct regarding the players you mentioned (which goes towards my point about veteran talent) And while you're pretty sure Wisconsin doesn't win without that tweaking, I know for DANG sure they don't win without the talent I mentioned. Look, ALL of it is necessary to put together a magical season (let's not forget the luck of avoiding the injury bug). We're really just disagreeing about what the ratios are that contribute to the success. It's a small thing to quibble over. |
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Post by badgerbreath on May 8, 2022 18:44:40 GMT -5
Recruiting is a part of coaching. Sheffield took a chance on Rettke and made an offer when she wasn’t even playing vball full time yet and no one else was recruiting her for vball. Part of the coaches’ jobs is finding good players and convincing them to join.
But even with Rettke in the team they had not won a championship until that tweak with Demps and Smrek was made. Maybe they don’t win without Rettke, Hilley and Barnes, but I also don’t think they win without that. Barnes was not really that great a passer in 2019, as we were repeatedly reminded. It was a potential problem, but she got better. Why?
Put a bunch of great players out there with no coaching at all, I doubt that they get very far in the NCAA. Who evaluates and works on technique? Who sets the team culture? Who analyzes the opponents tendencies and comes up with game strategies?
Now, one could make a case that differences in coaching are small relative to differences in playing talent. Maybe looking across all the NCAA that is true. The differences in talent are huge. But when you are trying to differentiate yourself from other talented teams, coaching decisions matter.
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Post by robtearle on May 8, 2022 18:53:17 GMT -5
Ask if Minnesota would have won without Samedy, Texas without Eggleston, Baylor without Presley and Skinner, Louisville without Dilfer and Stevenson, Nebraska without Stivrins and Caffey, etc etc etc. If Sheffield, after a good deal of experimentation, doesn't come up with the Smrek-Demps opposite combo, I am pretty sure that Wisconsin doesn't win the Big Ten, and VERY likely doesn't win the national championship. Again you're 100% correct regarding the players you mentioned (which goes towards my point about veteran talent) And while you're pretty sure Wisconsin doesn't win without that tweaking, I know for DANG sure they don't win without the talent I mentioned. Look, ALL of it is necessary to put together a magical season (let's not forget the luck of avoiding the injury bug). We're really just disagreeing about what the ratios are that contribute to the success. It's a small thing to quibble over. But that is the point with regard to the importance of coaching and the 'tweaks' they must make! Wisconsin did NOT "avoid the injury bug". Very much the opposite! They had their preferred lineup on the floor for exactly one weekend, and it was in August. Danielle Hart missed all but about a month, and her being gone necessitated much of the lineup experimentation; they had to move an All-American opposite away from playing opposite; at one point or another, they started at least four different players at opposite; Orzol missed about a month; Smrek missed about a month, Civita missed maybe two months in two different stretches. I'll say it once more: without the experimentation that Sheffield had to undertake and the 'answer' he finally came up with, Wisconsin does not win the national championship. The original premise that kicked off this whole thing was 'coaches are over-rated', and having had a close-up view of Wisconsin's 2021 season, I *completely* disagree with that statement. |
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on May 8, 2022 19:04:00 GMT -5
Again you're 100% correct regarding the players you mentioned (which goes towards my point about veteran talent) And while you're pretty sure Wisconsin doesn't win without that tweaking, I know for DANG sure they don't win without the talent I mentioned. Look, ALL of it is necessary to put together a magical season (let's not forget the luck of avoiding the injury bug). We're really just disagreeing about what the ratios are that contribute to the success. It's a small thing to quibble over. But that is the point with regard to the importance of coaching and the 'tweaks' they must make! Wisconsin did NOT "avoid the injury bug". Very much the opposite! They had their preferred lineup on the floor for exactly one weekend, and it was in August. Danielle Hart missed all but about a month, and her being gone necessitated much of the lineup experimentation; they had to move an All-American opposite away from playing opposite; at one point or another, they started at least four different players at opposite; Orzol missed about a month; Smrek missed about a month, Civita missed maybe two months in two different stretches. I'll say it once more: without the experimentation that Sheffield had to undertake and the 'answer' he finally came up with, Wisconsin does not win the national championship. The original premise that kicked off this whole thing was 'coaches are over-rated', and having had a close-up view of Wisconsin's 2021 season, I *completely* disagree with that statement. Again we're probably splitting hairs but I don't consider major lineup replacements as tweaks. Hart being gone meant that someone had to step into her role. For that matter I would say that Nebraska did more "tweaking" trying to figure out whether to go with veterans or first years in certain spots. Orzol, Smrek, and Civita missed time but they all played in the tournament didn't they? Orzol from what I heard (maybe from you?) played in the tournament hurt/injured. So, I would revise the statement to: avoiding the injury bug at the right time. AGAIN I will 100% agree with you that coaches are not over-rated, especially when you consider that they drive the recruiting bus. They're the ones who have to determine which players to entice to their program. Their hands are in almost every aspect of their program if not every aspect. No disrespect meant to coaches whatsoever! |
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