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Baseball
Jul 30, 2022 17:03:51 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2022 17:03:51 GMT -5
I should have been more blunt - by modern, I meant that some of the greatest baseball players of all-time (Gibson, Charleston, Paige, etc...) weren't banned by the major leagues. One could argue that Gretzky didn't play against the best, Jordan most likely did. BTW, I have those (Ruth, Gretzky, Jordan) as the best players in their sport of all-time. Who is the greatest football player of all-time? Jim Brown? Sure, I agree on most of that. Though I have to disagree on Brown. I don't think he was even the greatest running back of all time. That's Barry Sanders. As for best overall football player, I just find it really difficult to argue against Tom Brady, even though I despise the Patriots. Sanders is the best not named Payton.
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Post by nowhereman on Jul 31, 2022 14:04:25 GMT -5
Like this from George will in men at work - page 309:today there are choruses of people lamenting the large salaries earned by players. This moralizing makes no sense. The salaries are earned. The players make more for the owners than they pay in salaries.
Of course the average person still sides with the owners.
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Post by bbg95 on Jul 31, 2022 14:18:28 GMT -5
Like this from George will in men at work - page 309:today there are choruses of people lamenting the large salaries earned by players. This moralizing makes no sense. The salaries are earned. The players make more for the owners than they pay in salaries. Of course the average person still sides with the owners. Right. Because fans tend to support one team for their entire lives and don't have a lot of sympathy for multimillionaire pro athletes. It is what it is. At any rate, I don't think fans mind what players make too much per se. This mostly comes up when there's a potential labor stoppage. I think in baseball specifically, the league would benefit from a salary cap like what the NFL has. That would create a more even playing field for the small-to-medium market teams. The NFL is the most successful pro sports league in the world, so if they can do it, I see no reason why MLB (and the NBA for that matter) can't. I also think that this would create a side benefit of less resentment about salaries, since teams wouldn't be able to just spend $300 million like the Dodgers.
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Post by nowhereman on Jul 31, 2022 14:41:47 GMT -5
Just wrapped up men at work. Eighth baseball book since the end of May. Heading to the ninth inning of reading. Pardon the metaphor. Boys of summer about dem bums of Brooklyn.
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Post by geddyleeridesagain on Jul 31, 2022 15:25:36 GMT -5
Just wrapped up men at work. Eighth baseball book since the end of May. Heading to the ninth inning of reading. Pardon the metaphor. Boys of summer about dem bums of Brooklyn. I did not like "Men at Work." The format and subjects were interesting - Gwynn, Orel, and the others - I was just very turned off by George Will's writing. I'm probably in the minority, though, given how successful the book became.
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Post by nowhereman on Jul 31, 2022 18:14:55 GMT -5
I used to want Pete in the hall but I just thought the way he came out and thought he should be in rubbed me wrong. He could have just kept his mouth shut and low keyed his way to possible reinstatement but then he had to be an ass about it. Honestly, I don't care about any of that. Rose has more hits than anyone in the history of Major League Baseball. That's what matters to me. Blurb in USA today sports weekly about Reggie Jackson and goose gossage originally not wanting to attend the HOF induction due to issues with Ortiz but they changed their minds and went after all. Goose said they may as well let everyone in. Rose. Bonds. Clemens. Reggie's take is that bonds and Clemens shouldn't be the poster children for everyone else who took peds. So induct em all.
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Post by bbg95 on Jul 31, 2022 18:17:27 GMT -5
Honestly, I don't care about any of that. Rose has more hits than anyone in the history of Major League Baseball. That's what matters to me. Blurb in USA today sports weekly about Reggie Jackson and goose gossage originally not wanting to attend the HOF induction due to issues with Ortiz but they changed their minds and went after all. Goose said they may as well let everyone in. Rose. Bonds. Clemens. Reggie's take is that bonds and Clemens shouldn't be the poster children for everyone else who took peds. So induct em all. Interesting. That's just two players, but hopefully, that indicative that the hardliners among the former players are softening their stance.
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Post by mikegarrison on Aug 1, 2022 2:36:54 GMT -5
Just wrapped up men at work. Eighth baseball book since the end of May. Heading to the ninth inning of reading. Pardon the metaphor. Boys of summer about dem bums of Brooklyn. I did not like "Men at Work." The format and subjects were interesting - Gwynn, Orel, and the others - I was just very turned off by George Will's writing. I'm probably in the minority, though, given how successful the book became. I've never read it, in large part because I think George Will is a pompous ass. I had no desire to read a whole book written by him.
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Post by mikegarrison on Aug 1, 2022 2:44:10 GMT -5
Of course the average person still sides with the owners. The average person sides with baseball owners? No, I don't think so.... Who do they want to get their picture taken with? The owner or the players? How many kids dream of someday being a big league club owner?
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Post by nowhereman on Aug 1, 2022 10:49:41 GMT -5
I did not like "Men at Work." The format and subjects were interesting - Gwynn, Orel, and the others - I was just very turned off by George Will's writing. I'm probably in the minority, though, given how successful the book became. I've never read it, in large part because I think George Will is a pompous ass. I had no desire to read a whole book written by him. Eh...I admit I was there for a long time myself. 20+ years sat on my shelf but then I saw Orel hershiser from my favorite team the Dodgers and Tony Gwynn do throes two made it worthwhile. Surprisingly I counted no more than 10 sAT words in 330 pages.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2022 11:54:44 GMT -5
Of course the average person still sides with the owners. The average person sides with baseball owners? No, I don't think so.... Who do they want to get their picture taken with? The owner or the players? How many kids dream of someday being a big league club owner? They absolutely do. In every sport. It's always greedy players demanding more money, completely missing that the owners are billionaires with 10-100x the money the players have. NFL players are considered greedy even though they have no guaranteed contracts. Just wait until Americans in general are aware of the money involved with international football.
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bluepenquin
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Post by bluepenquin on Aug 1, 2022 13:13:03 GMT -5
The average person sides with baseball owners? No, I don't think so.... Who do they want to get their picture taken with? The owner or the players? How many kids dream of someday being a big league club owner? They absolutely do. In every sport. It's always greedy players demanding more money, completely missing that the owners are billionaires with 10-100x the money the players have. NFL players are considered greedy even though they have no guaranteed contracts. Just wait until Americans in general are aware of the money involved with international football. I think this has changed over time as sports journalism has become more liberal and owners are no longer individuals tied to the community but large corporations. At least in baseball.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2022 13:23:59 GMT -5
They absolutely do. In every sport. It's always greedy players demanding more money, completely missing that the owners are billionaires with 10-100x the money the players have. NFL players are considered greedy even though they have no guaranteed contracts. Just wait until Americans in general are aware of the money involved with international football. I think this has changed over time as sports journalism has become more liberal and owners are no longer individuals tied to the community but large corporations. At least in baseball. Ummm...the only teams owned by corporations: Atlanta Braves: Liberty Media Toronto: Rogers Comunications Washington: Lerner Enterprises Every other team is owned by individuals, usually operating as LLCs. Billionaires are making money. Do a deep dive into the finances and you'll find that they do REALLY well, especially since income from their land ownership/ballparks aren't in the MLBPA agreement, nor are the revenues of regional sports networks OR developments from MLB technologies. And why go to the kneejerk/red herring response of 'sports journalism is more liberal'. Are you sure? You may want to check those sports pages from about 1947-2000 because there sure wasn't any support for Jackie R. or Muhammad Ali. Read Pittsburgh papers and you'll find Clemente was hated. Read current stuff on Bill Russell and you'll see just how "liberal" media was towards him, too.
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Post by nowhereman on Aug 1, 2022 13:52:13 GMT -5
I think this has changed over time as sports journalism has become more liberal and owners are no longer individuals tied to the community but large corporations. At least in baseball. Ummm...the only teams owned by corporations: Atlanta Braves: Liberty Media Toronto: Rogers Comunications Washington: Lerner Enterprises Every other team is owned by individuals, usually operating as LLCs. Billionaires are making money. Do a deep dive into the finances and you'll find that they do REALLY well, especially since income from their land ownership/ballparks aren't in the MLBPA agreement, nor are the revenues of regional sports networks OR developments from MLB technologies. And why go to the kneejerk/red herring response of 'sports journalism is more liberal'. Are you sure? You may want to check those sports pages from about 1947-2000 because there sure wasn't any support for Jackie R. or Muhammad Ali. Read Pittsburgh papers and you'll find Clemente was hated. Read current stuff on Bill Russell and you'll see just how "liberal" media was towards him, too. And my issue is this: as an employee I always think management is out to screw the worker. Do 99 things right and they L look for the one wrong thing do they have an excuse not to pay you. A lot more money is involved but the relationship of the players to the owners is the same. I'm just glad I don't have to put up with that bs anymore.
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Post by bbg95 on Aug 1, 2022 13:52:35 GMT -5
The average person sides with baseball owners? No, I don't think so.... Who do they want to get their picture taken with? The owner or the players? How many kids dream of someday being a big league club owner? They absolutely do. In every sport. It's always greedy players demanding more money, completely missing that the owners are billionaires with 10-100x the money the players have. NFL players are considered greedy even though they have no guaranteed contracts. Just wait until Americans in general are aware of the money involved with international football. Fans aren't dumb. They know the owners are even wealthier than the players. But the average fan making like $50K per year just doesn't have a ton of sympathy for players who might make more in one game than the fan does in the entire year. The fans aren't "missing" anything.
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