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Post by oldnewbie on May 7, 2024 14:35:21 GMT -5
Meanwhile, Israel backed out of a ceasefire agreement Hamas signed on to and is now ordering the relocation of a few hundred thousand people in Rafah, which in itself is a major war crime. One of the best commentaries on the student protests I have heard so far.
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Post by guest2 on May 7, 2024 14:55:44 GMT -5
The current government of Israel has *explicitly* stated that they will not accept a two-state solution. It is bizarre to posit here that they really don't mean what they say, when all their actions to date are completely in congruence with their own stated objectives. The tragic thing is that both opposing sides "agree" on one thing, no two state solution. Israel, or at least the current Israeli government, is unwilling to accept a two state solution, as you said. Ironically, Hamas likewise agreed, they do not accept a two state solution either. Perversely, this "agreement" between the two sides mean there is no long term accomodation possible between them. This current Israeli government does not believe Palestianians deserve their own state. Some of the hardcore settlers on the West Bank, in their warped view, even think Palestianians does not exist as a people and so they are free to take their land. Hamas likewise does not accept Israeli's right to existence and their stated goal remains the destruction of Israel and expulsion of Jews from Israel. So given that reality, beyond tactical or short-term strategic negotiation between Israel and Hamas to resolve aspects of the immediate short-term crisis, there is bound to be another violent tragedy further down the road even after the Gaza war has ended. Or maybe I am just too bleak... You keep saying current Israeli government as if there has been one in recent memory with a different opinion. There has not been significant support for a two-state solution from an Israeli government this century. On the Palestinian side its very different. I've never met a Palestinian who seriously thought they would, or could, get all of historical Palestine back. Palestinians have long since been resigned to a two-state solution. The PA basically begs for it and Hamas would happily accept a two-state solution if any reasonable offer were sincerely made by Israel.
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Post by franknvb on May 7, 2024 15:03:58 GMT -5
The tragic thing is that both opposing sides "agree" on one thing, no two state solution. Israel, or at least the current Israeli government, is unwilling to accept a two state solution, as you said. Ironically, Hamas likewise agreed, they do not accept a two state solution either. Perversely, this "agreement" between the two sides mean there is no long term accomodation possible between them. This current Israeli government does not believe Palestianians deserve their own state. Some of the hardcore settlers on the West Bank, in their warped view, even think Palestianians does not exist as a people and so they are free to take their land. Hamas likewise does not accept Israeli's right to existence and their stated goal remains the destruction of Israel and expulsion of Jews from Israel. So given that reality, beyond tactical or short-term strategic negotiation between Israel and Hamas to resolve aspects of the immediate short-term crisis, there is bound to be another violent tragedy further down the road even after the Gaza war has ended. Or maybe I am just too bleak... You keep saying current Israeli government as if there has been one in recent memory with a different opinion. There has not been significant support for a two-state solution from an Israeli government this century. On the Palestinian side its very different. I've never met a Palestinian who seriously thought they would, or could, get all of historical Palestine back. Palestinians have long since been resigned to a two-state solution. The PA basically begs for it and Hamas would happily accept a two-state solution if any reasonable offer were sincerely made by Israel. Delusional. Palestinians became palestinian in 1967 by an Arab names Arafat. They have never wanted a 2 state solution and have rejected every offer
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Post by ironhammer on May 7, 2024 23:48:28 GMT -5
The tragic thing is that both opposing sides "agree" on one thing, no two state solution. Israel, or at least the current Israeli government, is unwilling to accept a two state solution, as you said. Ironically, Hamas likewise agreed, they do not accept a two state solution either. Perversely, this "agreement" between the two sides mean there is no long term accomodation possible between them. This current Israeli government does not believe Palestianians deserve their own state. Some of the hardcore settlers on the West Bank, in their warped view, even think Palestianians does not exist as a people and so they are free to take their land. Hamas likewise does not accept Israeli's right to existence and their stated goal remains the destruction of Israel and expulsion of Jews from Israel. So given that reality, beyond tactical or short-term strategic negotiation between Israel and Hamas to resolve aspects of the immediate short-term crisis, there is bound to be another violent tragedy further down the road even after the Gaza war has ended. Or maybe I am just too bleak... BS. Hamas dropped this the language in their charter denying Israel's right to exist decades ago. You're a victim of Israeli propaganda. All they do is lie, lie, lie. They are counting on Americans not having the IQ to discern their lies. Furthermore, good for Hamas! Defending themselves against pure evil. I wish them the best. Do you ever wonder how stupid you sound? How much do you get paid per post?
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Post by ironhammer on May 7, 2024 23:49:04 GMT -5
The tragic thing is that both opposing sides "agree" on one thing, no two state solution. Israel, or at least the current Israeli government, is unwilling to accept a two state solution, as you said. Ironically, Hamas likewise agreed, they do not accept a two state solution either. Perversely, this "agreement" between the two sides mean there is no long term accomodation possible between them. This current Israeli government does not believe Palestianians deserve their own state. Some of the hardcore settlers on the West Bank, in their warped view, even think Palestianians does not exist as a people and so they are free to take their land. Hamas likewise does not accept Israeli's right to existence and their stated goal remains the destruction of Israel and expulsion of Jews from Israel. So given that reality, beyond tactical or short-term strategic negotiation between Israel and Hamas to resolve aspects of the immediate short-term crisis, there is bound to be another violent tragedy further down the road even after the Gaza war has ended. Or maybe I am just too bleak... You keep saying current Israeli government as if there has been one in recent memory with a different opinion. There has not been significant support for a two-state solution from an Israeli government this century. On the Palestinian side its very different. I've never met a Palestinian who seriously thought they would, or could, get all of historical Palestine back. Palestinians have long since been resigned to a two-state solution. The PA basically begs for it and Hamas would happily accept a two-state solution if any reasonable offer were sincerely made by Israel. Cherry picking facts are we now?
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